Why the Left Has Failed to Mobilize Black Americans Around the Dream Act

This story did not move me with respect to illegal immigration, however, the disparity in the treatment of Haitians, Caribbeans and Africans vs other preferred groups is something that seems to be a problem to me.  I would probably respond to political outreach on the immigration issue couched in these experiences.   

NSpirit, when the Dream Act was discussed some time ago, I can't recall my exact wording however in a nutshell what is it going to do to benefit African descended American people? The more I evaluate some of these issues being raised by 'the left' too many of them are just irrelevent to African Americans.

And this brings another point which I initially felt uncomfortable with this thing about people popping off that the President is not just the President of Black America. Well if hispanics and other non-blacks can make a demand of the president, which this is what this Dream Act is a DEMAND, then does that make him the President of Hispanics, Asians and other naturalized Americans? If so, why not for African Americans??? I've seen many staunch defenders and critics of the POTUS say this very thing. WHY??

Another perfect example of how we allow people to psychologically cop us out.

To answer the opening question Sunnubian, no one cares about what Black people have to say or think of the immigration policy in this country. Not the Left, not the Right and sad to say many of us don't even consider the impact of illegal immigration on our community nationally and internationally. Furthermore, black immigrants to the U.S. like illegals are treated like criminals regardless of what they have to offer. To piggyback on NSprit's comments about Haitians, lets not forget that the U.S. offered Liberians refuge here for 20 years and now they want to send them back to Liberia because there is no longer a Civil War. Is this done to any other group offered asylum to the U.S.? Is temporary asylum enforced with any other entire group of people? This is another inconsistency in the immigration policies that will prevent Black people from ever getting on board with the Left and the immigration proponents on this issue.

Im totally feeling this post.  You rock!

I think that all the racist propaganda being put out there to divide Blacks and Latinos is working so well that it leaves Black people in the position of not knowing whether or not to support their causes.  That and the fact that there have been just a little too many racist jabs at Black people by Latinos/Hispanics lately that are saturating the media and the internet.  Otherwise, I think that you couldn't get a negative quote from an African American on the subject, with the exception of your run of the mill houseni88er type Black person.  Now, back in my young days Blacks and Latinos/Hispanics were cool with each other and even if we did not know one another we were still close enough to our collective histories in this country to know that OUR groups should not have any hatred or malice against each other.  Now, it seems that these recent Latinos/Hispanics immigrating to this country are letting racist Whites and gangbangers decide for them how they should view Black people.  However, I will not let Black people totally off the hook, in that I am sure that there are Black people in America who have negative attitudes against Latinos/Hispanics and that Latinos/Hispanics may have had bad experiences particularly with Black people in America, dependent on were exactly that they chose to come to in America.  But, at any rate, divisions between Blacks and Latinos/Hispanics only serve to weaken and lesson our power in this country, at least for now.  However, if the rate of Latino/Hispanic population grows as expected, then in a couple of decades they will be their own power block and that will not be good for Black people if they continue to view Black peoples in a negative light and it won't be good for White people for the oppressive and racist history they have inflicted on their people.

So, who know what is going to happen, especially in the future?  The only thing you can count on is the fact that Black people here in America and throughout the diaspora better learn that WE are a people that have to watch our own backs and each other's backs when it comes to ANY group that is not also Black. 

Excuse me, when have blacks and 'latinos' ever been unified? We may have some issues that serve each other's common interests, but lets not interpret that to be a form of unification. They have their own groups and organizations that put their own people's agenda first and foremost, unlike us. We are always seeking to unify with some other group as if we can't get our own agendas and execute them. Like I said, we are always being psyched out if we ever want to do something to benefit black people alone.

Well, it's not like Latinos/Hispanics - and in particular Mexicans - treat their OWN Black countrymen very well, either!!    Blacks in Mexico (and other South American countries) are at the bottom of the barrel.  Just like here.  And just like EVERYWHERE else. 

I didn't know many Hispanics growing up ... but, from the time I entered the working world (right out of high school), I have met - and know - and like - a whole bunch of Hispanic people .... from Mexico and beyond!!  One of my best, best male friends came here illegally from Guatemala, could barely (and I do mean barely!) speak English when we met him and added him to the "crew", is now a naturalized citizen that I've known for over 30 years .... but, his family doesn't like for him to bring "us" (the "crew") around.  They tolerate us because they have no choice. He's as much "family" to us as he is to them.  But they'd rather he not.  Old prejudices die hard. 

I believe the 'criminal-minded' ... (gangbangers, drug dealers, thieves, murderers, etc.) ... believe that if there's anybody lower and less powerful than they are ... it would be us.  Which is just historical belief by seeming ALL (other) people on this planet!! And so they try to dominate us by fear and violence.

And then you have your average, run-of-the-mill, live-and-let-live, people, who aren't trying to bother anybody (instill hatred) ... but, they are dedicated to their OWN people, first, foremost and always .... and they are going to take care of and watch out for themselves and their own.  They're not trying to "hook up" with us ... but they don't necessarily "shun" us, either.

And then you have the "cool peeps" who don't care what or who you are ... if you're cool with them, they're cool with you!!  I certainly don't think they're in the majority ... but, I think I've been fortunate to have met a lot of Hispanic people like this ... and we happen to share that same "whatever, dude!" mentality!!

I do not think, though, that Hispanic people, overall, will ever "seek us out" for any kind of unification ... for any political or social or ethnic reasons ... because they are already "unified" with themselves and don't need nor want us or our help for anything.

As I said ... in their country, people like us (except they speak Spanish rather than English) are considered to be "the bottom of their shoe" in terms of respect, acknowledgement, and basic human dignity.  The Black people in ANY country you go to are the most discriminated against, unliked, disrespected, and lacking of consideration people you will find there. 

This is true even in Africa, the Motherland.  Where Arabs or colonists can dominate us, they can, do and will. 

One thing I've noticed is that black people always seem to ask questions like, "What is Obama going to do for black people?"  "Why hasn't he done anything for black people?"  But other groups press for very specific things: immigration reform.  Recognition of same sex marriage.  Etc.  Somebody can help remind me if I'm wrong, but I can't think of a similar major agenda item that black interest groups press for on a national level.   Is that because we don't really feel like we have one anymore?  Or is it because we're just resigned to feel that our interests don't matter? 

"Well, it's not like Latinos/Hispanics - and in particular Mexicans - treat their OWN Black countrymen very well, either!!    Blacks in Mexico (and other South American countries) are at the bottom of the barrel.  Just like here.  And just like EVERYWHERE else.  "

___________________________________________________________________

I'm not claiming any solidarity between Blacks and Hispanics/Latinos, especially today, but rather that there was initially no friction between the two groups previously, especially before the republican party started in on the Latino/Hispanic vote.  Of course there was always some ethnic rivalry between young gangbangers, etc., over the years, but before the right wing and republican propaganda machine went full force with their racist propaganda all over the airways and newspapers and pundit tv shows of there being some 'divide' or 'hatred' or whatever between Blacks and Latinos/Hispanics, you rarely even heard of the idea that Blacks and Latinos/Hispanics hated each other.  If you say something enough times, people will begin to believe it, and then begin to act on it.  And the majority of Latinos/Hispanics that are here today is not the same Latino/Hispanic that was here before and following the Civil Rights Movement or even before the Reagan years.  I still say that there is a big difference in the relationship between African Americans and Latinos/Hispanics since before the Reagan years and afterwards through now.  However, I'm not claiming that both groups were in lock step with each other either way, just that there was no particular damning friction between the two groups before all the Western divide and conquer propaganda began to tell the two groups that it was.  

A couple of weeks ago a story was posted here (I think by Sunnubian(?)) about a young rapper that called President Obama something stupid .... and then went on to say that he didn't even vote or participate in politics. The article suggested that this boy (and Black people, in general) was politically ignorant/uneducated. 

IMO, truer words were NEVER spoken.  And that, in a nutshell, is what is "wrong" with Black people and politics.  It is the 'bottom line' answer to your question(s).

People (especially the younger generation) want - insist - demand to be heard ... but, sadly (and realistically) none of them even KNOW .... let alone SPEAK the O-N-L-Y language that will make them be understood.  And that is politics.  And that is to vote.

Quick story:  When the Casey Anthony "not guilty" verdict came in the radio DJ let people call in with comments.  The first (young) girl to speak was LIVID!!    In some broken, country, uneducated-sounding English, she RANTED about the fact that this White girl got off while "Black mens was sitting on the death row" with less evidence against them"!! She asked "why the White girl wasn't gettin' guilty when the Black mens was not guilty and sittin' on the death row?"

She actually gave a VERY impassioned speech ... and ended with the revelation that we need to fix this situation and "we 'bout to take this from Texas to Florida" and end this kind of injustice.  I was actually impressed with her perceived activism ... but then it occurred to me that she wouldn't know HOW to take the first step ... let alone in WHAT DIRECTION to place it ... to accomplish such a goal!!! 

She had NO IDEA that what she was talking about will take a LONG, dedicated, united POLITICAL solution to fix - because there are already various groups TODAY that are - and have been for a very long time - fighting to do that very thing.  With not one second of help from people like her.   And it would have to START with voting out every Republican governor in every Southern state she was talking about "taking it to" to even get the ball rolling!!

And I'd be willing to bet a month's salary that she DID NOT even vote in the last 2010 election.

The MAIN lesson that Black people - and especially those like that rapper - should have, but didn't take from the 2008 election is that President Obama is the President TODAY for one reason, and one reason ONLY:  And that is because he received more than 2 million more votes than John McCain did.  Every vote DID count.  For those who voted, their voice WAS heard.  That day, they spoke the O-N-L-Y language that gets them heard.  And after that day ... they quit talking! 

Why?  Because, being politically 'ignorant' they don't know any better. Have no idea what to do next after that.  Or that there even IS a "next" after that.

The majority of Black people (especially those who don't vote) don't even know that the President CAN'T - legally, constitutionally or legislatively - make ANY law by himself.  They haven't the foggiest notion what Congress is, exactly ... let alone what their function and responsibilities are - and are not.  Even those that THINK they know are simply wrong and mistaken when it comes to what the reality is.

And I think part of the reason why they continue to be (politically) uneducated and ignorant is because they have a defeatist attitude and don't THINK they have the power to change things (which is a myth and untrue - as the election of President Obama (should have) proved!!!) ... but, I think mainly it's because they have never been taught about the importance that politics plays in everyday life.

If they realized that E-V-E-R-Y-T-H-I-N-G they do is legislated (i.e., even the way you walk down the street is governed .... 'cause they couldn't even do that butt-naked if they wanted to without being arrested for indecency!!  ) then MAYBE they'd have a little more initiative to pay attention. 

It's almost comical that they're so quick to ask what President Obama is doing for them ... and have absolutely NO interest in all the things they're (negatively) doing to themselves by being politically inactive.  I'd feel sorry for them .... if their political disinterest didn't have such a negative political impact on me, personally.

Yes! Yes! Yes!

It annoys me when I hear black community activist and or black folk in general, speaking to our issues/interest saying "blacks and minorities" "people of color" or "blacks and latinos". I mean other groups no malice, however we need stop coupling other folks with our plight every time the mic/camera is on.  I've never heard a latino group speaking on their issues say anything like "the latinos and blacks". Same for koreans/chinese/japanese and I'm not mad at them. 

If 1/3 the effort was spent on unifying with ourselves, we'd be ahead of the 'game' that leaves us in varying degrees and forms of destitute.

  You know...I know a lotta Black activists...ya know, being in the profession I'm in.  And a few of them were criminals who turned themselves around and decided to do the right thing within the community....and everything. But it never fails, they always wanna seek me out for some reason!  Talkin' about this unity coalition among victims of crime and the turnaround criminals themselves....well I kinda have a problem with that.  Maybe it will take some mo' time for me....but!  I don't wanna engage with mofos that had the same mindset that killed my son.  Nope!  Get the fock away from me.  Cuz you are still an azzwipe self-destructing mofo in my book.  I don't care how much you say YOU'VE changed.  Don't.  Believe.  You.  Cuz why?  All I hear is a lotta of lip service i.e. testinmonals.  I don't wanna hear that bullshyte. I wanna SEE your work i. e. CHANGE  in the community.  Your face to face confrontations with those[you were once like]in our community that are STILL being destructive and STILL killing each other.  I wanna see you pull their azzes down and get all up in their koolaid and tell them WHAT THE FOCK TIME IT REALLY IS.  I mean.  Since you've been there and done that...and all.  But they just wanna spew this term common interest..to appear that they are doing sumthing substantial but really not.  And I say it just the same old bullshyte!  It really reminds of the black panthers back in the day...in my neighborhood.  They used to talk about the white man and what they wasn't gonna take from him anymore....but in the meantime and in between time...all they were actually doing was pulling in women [some were young impressionable girls]...screwing them and getting high.  And creating conflict with the US anti-white group.  Thus, the beginning of rival gangs which includes:  women, guns and mayhem toward each other. What happened to wanting to get the white man? 

The real Black Unity I know of is.......gone!  Been gone!  Cuz now everybody seem to want to be on the platform to nowhere spewing conjecture rheotric ...instead getting down in the trenches and helping these confused troubled kids.  What are these so-called activists afraid of?  Getting dirty?  Well hell.  I do it.  Every day.  And there is something called SOAP!!!  I guess when it comes down to it, I must be crazy.  Cuz I have folks tell me all the time...."girl why you do that?  You don't know them." I tell them.  "Don't have to know them."  Or I hear often..."aren't you afraid to talk to a stray child i.e. thug?"  "Nope. Could be my child."  Developmentally....children are the same all over the world.  I  know each developmental stages of a child.  So when I approach a child[currently known as a thug or gang banger]...I know where they stand cognitively.  So I know what to say to them.  And most importantly from my experience, every child wants to be LOVED.  And so that's what I am armed with...unconditional love. 

 But getting back to the topic at hand.  Black folks will NEVER enforce an alligance until we as a people STOP hating on each other and get with the bigger picture.  Slavery and Jim Crow seemed to erase the desperation we once had.  But!  There are STILL desperate times that are affecting not only our children but our culture as people.  And our biggest most deadliest angst is our SELF-HATE toward each other....and I think that comes from NOT really knowing who we are or loving where we come cuz massa did a good job in degrading, minimizing and lying about it....and for so many years our parents believed it....and some of us STILL believe it.  So until we can really SELF-LOVE who we are.....and not that fake shyte that encroaches colorism: light/dark skin division......other folks [ and I won't call them miniorities cuz that's massa's word...they are equal human beings] who always knew who they are as a group will continue to surpass us and become a much stronger unit. 

Yes it's true.  Slaves were scattered across north, central and south America.... Yes the hispanic/latinos population is in denial of their African ancestral roots....but!  If we as African Americans embrace the power of being from Africa in a positive spin and embrace and truly CELEBRATE who we are as a former under dog people.....trust me.  THEY WILL FOLLOW!  But as long as we continue to shoot ourselves in the foot, deny each other with real black love and acceptance...well!  You know the story....and the deadly regressive history...but!  I'm just sayin 

I guess I will be told that there was never a relationship between Blacks and Jews in this country or at least an understanding of the similarities of each other's plights.

If there was some effort perhaps by the CBC, or NAACP or Urban League to promote the idea that this immigration issue affects black communities with immigrant populations and black families too (a significant number of AA's have caribbean or African friends, lovers, relatives, coworkers, etc "living in the shadows") then passing the dream act would be something i could get behind and advocate for. 

Instead the language that i constantly hear WRT immigration reform is "they're just trying to have a better life" or "they do jobs even blacks won't do" or "this country couldn't make it without them" and to me these are codewords for a very specific group of people.  The unspoken part is that these "hardworking" people should be accorded sympathy and citizenship because they are trying.  The associated imagery is often very specific ie lettuce pickers or hospitality workers.

Who among us ISNT trying to "have a better life"?

Yes the immigration talk always leaves African descended people out. So that should let you know that WE are not relevant, regardless of the nationality, to this issue. That should tell you something.

You know ... I was watching some news show the other night (can't remember which one) and they were highlighting the African (illegal) immigration situation in some European country (can't remember that, either) ... and they were interviewing one such immigrant who was "hardworking" and just "trying to make a better life for his family."

On the surface, his 'situation' was pretty much a mirror image of the Hispanic 'situation' in this country ... however, in the piece it was reported that in that particular country, immigrants were not offered access to 'public services' such as welfare and health care and a free education for their children. (The kicker was that that probably wasn't available to him at home, either!!  )

Still ... this immigrant felt that where he was he was able to provide a better life for him and his family than he would be receiving in his 'home' country.  This guy had 8 ... count 'em ... 8 children.  And he said that he had been able to take care of them pretty well for the most part, except that now, with the financial crisis, it was getting harder for him to find work.

My MAIN objection to the immigration problem in this country is that there seems to be no line drawn in the differences between what is "available" to citizens and non-citizens alike. All-out access to a limited number of resources has no choice but to cause problems.  And this doesn't seem to be an issue included in the debate over immigration at all.  My secondary objection is that the flood gates seem to be open to one ethnic group over all others.  And allowing that to happen has effectively tied the hands of everybody else to have to ACCEPT that and not be able to do anything about it.

For many Black people that I talk to, one (or both) of these are also their basic objections to the immigration problem in this country.  But neither of these are ever talked about when it comes to what should be the "solution" to any possible "fix" (which I, personally, don't believe is equitably possible, myself!!).  But .... I think that's why we're not often included in the conversation because the way most of us feel about it, and what we would figure would/could/should be addressed is not even on the table.

All of this began without our input ... and it's likely going to end or be decided without it, as well.  We should probably put our efforts into something that IS more relevant to us ... to issues that we CAN actually control.  And the issue of immigration isn't one of them.  It's out of our hands.  And, in fact, was never in them to begin with.

Could it be that no political effort is spent in trying to connect african-americans with the immigration reform effort because THEN there would be 40 million dark americans upset about the disparity in the immigration and enforcement policies?  

I mean, it's easier to just tell black people they should morally support this, than it is to explain why BLACK immigrants are persona non grata (and apparently will remain so for the foreseeable future) in a country where that "we are all immigrants BS" is extolled on the regular...  I mean, really?  U want us to support the Dream Act, but Haitians catch hell here?  Liberians are threatened with being sent back?  what?

on a side note: how full of ish is the mantra "we are all immigrants"?  No we arent ALL immigrants.  Some were here but extinguished and chased out.  Some were dragged in chains and did not volunteer to be here, and then there's the immigrant story.  We are not all immigrants.