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One in 25 fathers 'not the daddy'
Up to one in 25 dads could unknowingly be raising another man's child, UK health researchers estimate.


Increasing use of genetic testing for medical and legal reasons means more couples are discovering the biological proof of who fathered the child.

The Liverpool John Moores University team reached its estimate based on research findings published between 1950 and 2004.

The study appears in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Health.

Biological father

Professor Mark Bellis and his team said that the implications of so-called paternal discrepancy were huge and largely ignored, even though the incidence was increasing.

In the US, the number of paternity tests increased from 142,000 in 1991 to 310,490 in 2001.

Demand for testing has grown by a factor of 10 in the last decade in the UK, according to University Diagnostics, Teddington.

The current level in the UK is somewhere between 8,900 and 20,000 tests per year.

About 5,000 of these tests are instigated at the demand of the Child Support Agency to resolve who should be paying child maintenance.

Others are done to investigate inherited health disorders and others for social reasons.

The Liverpool team found that rates of cases where a father was not the biological father of his child ranged from 1% in some studies to as much as 30%.

Experts have generally agreed that the rate is below 10%, with a 4% rate meaning that about one in 25 could be affected.

However, increasing use of genetic testing is likely to boost the rates of paternal discrepancy, say the authors.

Important consequences

Professor Bellis said the consequences of a man finding out that he is not the biological father of a child could be devastating.

It can lead to relationship breakdown, mental health problems for both partners and even domestic violence, while the children involved can experience low self-esteem and anxiety.

He said services and support should be available to minimise such negative consequences.

In an ideal world, everyone should have counselling
Rebecca Webster, a counsellor for private paternity testing company DNA Bioscience

However, even basic counselling is not always provided - some individuals order and receive test results by email or over a web site, he said.

"Vital information is being delivered to people without very much thought about how it is going to affect them," he said.

Counselling

Rebecca Webster, a counsellor for private paternity testing company DNA Bioscience, who speaks to about 500 men each month about such decisions, said: "We will raise the issue about whether they have thought about the consequences both for them and all those involved.

"Very often they are quite distressed and they want someone to talk to.

"By the time they get the results a lot of people have prepared themselves. But it's a very emotional process, even if the result is the one they wanted.

"In an ideal world, everyone should have counselling and it should be available on the NHS. Unfortunately, it's not."

Adrienne Burgess of Fathers Direct called for a code of practice to ensure companies providing paternity tests also offer counselling.

The NSPCC said fathers who find out they have been raising another man's child should remember that however angry they feel, they should not take this out on the child in any way.

"The child will still regard the parent as their father. Rejection could be a devastating double blow for the child, " said a spokeswoman.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/health/4137506.stm

Published: 2005/08/10 23:22:55 GMT
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Original Post

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There was an interesting debate here on non-commercial TV about DNA testing to check paternity.
It's a hot issue for sure and raises so many ethical questions.

The participating group included owners of privately owned DNA clinics, and government ones; men's support groups; understandably bitter fathers who had unknowingly been paying their ex-wife's child payments for 10yrs who then found out their child was not their child; scientists, and psychologists.

The call here is for some kind of legislation to set a legal Standard to regulate the integrity of the testing, so that DNA test results are as accurate as possible. Which in a lot of cases today they aren't.

Some people were arguing for the introduction of mandatory DNA testing virtually as soon as bub 'pops' out. Eek

I imagine such a database could be used to track down biological fathers who've avoided partnerity payments. But do those economic benefits compensate for each of us having even more personal information on file in some government department.

Is it ethical for parents to decide not to tell a child who their true biological father is? Who should make that decision?

And how would most women here FEEL if asked to take a DNA test to check the paternity of their child? If I had children, I'd find it incredibly insulting and paranoid, and personally, I would refuse. Would that harm my relationship?

And how do you men feel - how many of you would want to - or dare to - ask their partner/baby mother that question?

And, truly, aren't the motives behind anyone wanting this kind of information, mostly financial?
The man deserves to know, especially when you have females going on Maury Povich and testing 5-15 guys 'cuz they don't know who the hell the daddy is.

But if a guy has been helping to raise a child for so long already and has supported his child and established an emotional connection, knowing or not, that man is that child's father. DNA does not always matter.
quote:
Originally posted by art_gurl:
Is it ethical for parents to decide not to tell a child who their true biological father is? Who should make that decision?

NO it's not fair to the child NOT to know where it came from. I've never understood people that would do something like that. Everyone will want to know WHERE they came from at some point in their life (hence family reunions), esp. if they don't know.


And how would most women here FEEL if asked to take a DNA test to check the paternity of their child? If I had children, I'd find it incredibly insulting and paranoid, and personally, I would refuse. Would that harm my relationship?


I wouldnt't have a problem if my child's father wanted a blood test. I guess if I was sleeping around I would have an issue with it. I don't blame men one bit for having paternity tests b/c people are very dishonest these days.
Just throwing around some questions. Smile

As for me not wanting to have a hypothetical DNA test, it would be precisely because I was being loyal to that partner that I would say no. If there was no trust about paternity issues, then would it would be an indicator to me of no trust or integrity in the relationship - and no point having that relationship. And that goes both ways.
This might sound crass, but in todays world....I want the test done. As much as I hated Reagan he did have one saying that applies to every situation in life and that I follow....."Trust, but verify"......a woman telling me shes been faithful and loves me, means as about as much as a wooden nickel. "Think with our brains, not our hearts".
quote:
Originally posted by xxGAMBITxx:
This might sound crass, but in todays world....I want the test done. ........."Trust, but verify"......a woman telling me shes been faithful and loves me, means as about as much as a wooden nickel.

It's not crass to be prudent. Rather it is a sign of wisdom.

Trust is for fools. Big fools. I am a Christian and the Bible tells me I should never put my trust in a fellow human being. I have been married for twenty years and I can tell you the Bible is absolutely right. Most of the people that talk of trust in relationships can not keep their relationships going for months let alone years. Trust no one, especially todays prosmiscous women, abslolutely not. If you can afford it, do the test
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:
quote:
Originally posted by xxGAMBITxx:
This might sound crass, but in todays world....I want the test done. ........."Trust, but verify"......a woman telling me shes been faithful and loves me, means as about as much as a wooden nickel.

It's not crass to be prudent. Rather it is a sign of wisdom.

Trust is for fools. Big fools. I am a Christian and the Bible tells me I should never put my trust in a fellow human being. I have been married for twenty years and I can tell you the Bible is absolutely right. Most of the people that talk of trust in relationships can not keep their relationships going for months let alone years. Trust no one, especially todays prosmiscous women, abslolutely not. If you can afford it, do the test


Truer words have never been spoken.... tfro
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:
It's not crass to be prudent. Rather it is a sign of wisdom.

Trust is for fools. Big fools. I am a Christian and the Bible tells me I should never put my trust in a fellow human being. I have been married for twenty years and I can tell you the Bible is absolutely right. Most of the people that talk of trust in relationships can not keep their relationships going for months let alone years. Trust no one, especially todays prosmiscous women, abslolutely not. If you can afford it, do the test


Interesting. Glad I don't follow a religion that preaches lack of trust in the whole human race. Big Grin Are you using yourself as an example? Sorry if I'm getting personal, but you've said you 'have been married for twenty years and I can tell you the Bible is absolutely right.' Is that proof of not to trust or to trust? Confused What are you saying? And how can you have faith without trust?

I've detected a trace of sexism in some of your previous posts Henry38 but I have to call you up on this one.... maybe it is just your experience, but it is not an indisputable fact: "Trust no one, especially todays prosmiscous women, abslolutely not." What nonsense! And I like the way you neatly sidestep any mention of men being 'untrustworthy'. Ha!
quote:
Originally posted by art_gurl:
I've detected a trace of sexism in some of your previous posts Henry38 but I have to call you up on this one.... maybe it is just your experience, but it is not an indisputable fact: "Trust no one, especially todays prosmiscous women, abslolutely not." What nonsense!


So art_gurl you think it is nonsense to say that men should not trust promiscuous women?

Well everyone to his own, I can not tell you how to live your life. Maybe you should wait and when your son is old enough and is involved with a promiscous woman you would advice him to continue to trust the women. Personally I believe he would be a pretty foolish person to do a thing like that.
"So art_gurl you think it is nonsense to say that men should not trust promiscuous women?"


Not what I said. Perhaps it's semantics, perhaps you've have twisted my words.
I said it is ridiculous to state, as you did, that all women are promiscuous. This is simply not true. Why are you talking women 'plural' as if you have done research?

At least acknowledge promiscuity applies equally to men as to women?

Each gender has its mix of brilliant people, and, personality disorders. And each gender endures drama, gets hurt, abused, ripped off, cheated, and has to heal and move on.

I don't have a son - lucky for him Wink - but I do empathize if yours is currently in a sticky situation.
We all live and learn - and sometimes, as painful as it is, the hard way is the only way we do. I wish you and yours the best.
quote:
Originally posted by art_gurl:
"So art_gurl you think it is nonsense to say that men should not trust promiscuous women?"


Not what I said. Perhaps it's semantics, perhaps you've have twisted my words.
I said it is ridiculous to state, as you did, that all women are promiscuous. This is simply not true. Why are you talking women 'plural' as if you have done research?

At least acknowledge promiscuity applies equally to men as to women?


Please cut and paste where I said all women are promiscuous. I never said that anywhere. My wife is not promiscuous. My daughter is not promiscuous. My mother is not promiscuous. So why would I say all women are promiscuous. I do believe there are a lot of prosmiscuous women today who are helping to destroy the natural love that men have for women, but that does not translate that all women are promiscous. What I said was, not to trust women especially todays promiscuous women." Check it out, that is what I said. If you interpret that to read in the plural, remember, it takes a few BAD apples to spoil the name of the rest - hence my advice not to trust any woman.

Granted I hate promiscuous women, and in today's society there is far too many of them which means I don't respect a lot of women out there. If you think that makes me sexist, then fine. I believe most men in their right mind do not like promiscuous women. They may play with them sexually but they most certainly do not want these women to end up as the wife or the mother of their children. It might sound like double standards but then that is another topic we can discuss.
Granted there are many promiscuous women; however the men who "play with them sexually" are the reason they exist and those men are equally promiscuous. In a society that glorifies unhealthy relationships as "booty calls", "buddies with benefits", combined with sex being used to sell everything from toothpaste to cars, many young people fall into the trap of selfishness and self-gratification in "relationships" because the "one man, one woman, one lifetime" concept is foreign to them.

As a Christian, you are aware that men are devinely created to be leaders, providers, and protectors of women and children. When men elect to become deceitful and whorish thereby deviating from their intended purpose, where does that leave the woman? Further, many women equate sex with love whereas many men equate sex with getting off. The fact that men are in short supply in many areas of the country and aspire to be "players" rather than family men further complicates this issue.

My grandmother used to say "A snowball beats no ball" and I think unfortunately it is applicable in this matter. Men and women are socialized differently. Many women truly start out with the belief that if they give their most prized possession to a man that the man will respect and honor that precious gift. Unfortunately, that is bullchit, and some women begin to view sexual activity in much the same way that many men view it as they have become jaded and damaged by their sexual experiences. The knowledge that a woman has been "played with sexually" can damage a woman's psyche and lower her self-esteem thereby making her an easier target for the next "player". This type of emotional abuse can and does carry long-term devestation.

The issue of paternity would not be a major one if men stepped up to the plate, prepared themselves with educations, good jobs, and maturity prior to bringing a woman into the mix. Birth control is the equal responsibility of the parties engaging in sexual activity and every child deserves to be planned and brought into a family with the father videotaping and rejoicing in the new addition to the family. Too often, the young lady's mother (or her girlfriend) is the one in the labor and delivery room while the biological "father" is out gaming on someone else leaving the young lady and her family to figure out what to do with the additional burden to the family. (That is unless the family opted to abort the child and toss it into the garbage along with millions of other "mistakes".)

Further, young people are engaging in sexual activities prior to being mature enough to handle the consequences - including unwanted pregnancies. With all of the information concerning birth control, STDs, and other consequences of sexual activity, far too many young people have a feeling of "immortality", and never believe those things could happen to them.

This is a man's world in many ways. Place the blame for promiscuity where it belongs ... in the hands of the men who have toyed with women's emotions, lowered their self-esteem, played with them sexually (why is this acceptable?!?!?), and walked out the door the minute the going gets tough and the game wasn't fun anymore.
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:

What I said was, not to trust women especially todays promiscuous women." Check it out, that is what I said. If you interpret that to read in the plural, remember, it takes a few BAD apples to spoil the name of the rest - hence my advice not to trust any woman.

I think it's semantics. You just said, "not to trust women especially todays promiscuous women." "...not to trust any woman."

But I am 'hearing' you. I wouldn't trust promiscuous men either. Big Grin

But it's a funny old world, and usually people are never what we judge them to be anyway.
And if they are... well, then we are 'right'.

Most people on this planet want 1. love 2. acceptance by the tribe 3. territory
ask any psychologist. It's when this doesn't happen - for whatever reason - that most people go AWOL.

But enough from me... Smile
From my experience, it seems that there are equal and opposite reaction for every action and double standards are no exception. For example, a man who has multiple sexual partners is a player or stud, but a woman who has many lovers is easy or a whore.

On the flip side, a woman who is a virgin or celibate is a virtuous woman, but a virginal or celibate man is usually called an idiot, instead of a virtuous man (since women outnumber men in colleges, jobs, schools, etc. as well as in general. If a guy isn't having sex or at least thinking about it, both sexes will think something's wrong with the guy, it seems to me.

If a man has to decide to pick either being a player or a celibate friend...which one do you think he will pick? A guy has to be himself, because no one is a born player.

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