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60% of polled Americans beleive Elvis is still alive..

60% of Americans beleive Saddam Hessien was behind 9/11

80% of Americans would not vote for a woman regardless of her qualifications...


Coming from an African-American this might sound odd; but I don't think everybody should get to vote...

Hear me out...

I think only college grads (people who have gotten BA's) from an American university should get to vote..

And that would make up our "electorial college/ voters assebly"...

Thouhgts....?
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quote:
A BA degree doesn't establish any level of qualification, intelligence, or deservedness in relation to the vote.


I beg to differ..
That is exactly what it does..

We all know someone who gradiated from kolleg', and is dumb as hell...

That is the exception & not the rule..

I saw a poll where most college grads were liberal minded..

i think there is a connection between education and political affiliation.
quote:
Originally posted by blaqfist:
quote:
A BA degree doesn't establish any level of qualification, intelligence, or deservedness in relation to the vote.


I beg to differ..
That is exactly what it does..

We all know someone who gradiated from kolleg', and is dumb as hell...

That is the exception & not the rule..

I saw a poll where most college grads were liberal minded..

i think there is a connection between education and political affiliation.


Definitely.....that is why conservatives decry academia as bastions of liberalism...but the difference between liberals and conservatives on that tip is the difference between all of that social research i placed in here versus the rhetoric others put in here trying to sell "wolf tickets" to black people en masse.....academia is based on FACTS and REALISTIC looks at social disparities and the effects of policy on various groups.....that environment is too grounded in reality to let BS fly. I read where people from other countries tend to vote along the lines their gov't did...that is why you'll have a fool ranting against immigration as an immigrant.....it is ignorance of the workings of politics here or that self-hatred schit blkcons do when they talk about black progressiveness but support actions that move in the opposite direction....something needs to be done....because when you have a poor azz person vote for big business candidates....then they are too stupid for their own good......
quote:

I think only college grads (people who have gotten BA's) from an American university should get to vote..

And that would make up our "electorial college/ voters assebly"...

Thouhgts....?


Shame on you dude!!!!

Don't you know that Kevin and others have laid out the conspiracy to suppress Black college attendence and graduation rates?

You are only complementing their efforts if this is so.

I say - maximize the votes of Americans. Have people to be ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE CHOICES THAT THEY MAKE at the ballot box and not be allowed to REDIRECT TOWARD A BOOGIEMAN FOR THEIR OWN FAILURES.
quote:
Originally posted by blaqfist:
60% of polled Americans beleive Elvis is still alive..

60% of Americans beleive Saddam Hessien was behind 9/11

80% of Americans would not vote for a woman regardless of her qualifications...



I think only those who truly know the platform for those who are running for office, and the candidates past history.

Those who read newspapers, and listen to news on both Television and radio.

Now, these qualifications I just gave, also sounds weird coming from a black person.
How is the stipulation of a college degree to vote any different than the old "land owner" qualifications or reading & U.S. Constitution tests? Reading or watching the news doesn't qualify you either - doing those things don't guarantee comprehension of political issues. Besides, how would you test whether a potential voter "understates" a platform or politician's past without bias?
IMO, all an undergrad degree does is prepare you to work in coporate America. A BA/BS doesn't indicate mastery of a subject - it just shows that you can follow instructions, complete complex tasks, and that you know basic math, science, and grammar.
quote:
Don't you know that Kevin and others have laid out the conspiracy to suppress Black college attendence and graduation rates?



*This is coming from someone who was shown 30 years of positive trends....supported policy efforts that resulted in those numbers turning downward, cannot express that in terms of effectiveness and cannot explain the results as indicative of their own fucking intentions....now all that shit is based on terminology he introduced to this board, yet went mum when asked about the shit specifically. Now you want to say I laid out a conspiracy.....man you are one dumb azz marginally educated ass brother when it comes to policy issues....you go through life with your head up the white man's azz acting as his little racially political flunky....and then try to draw a diagram with you as a dot that indicates you as some kinda unique motherfucker....the way you make unsubstantiated bullschit rhetorical statements and fail to support them make you look like the dumbmest motherfucker that ever came out of a woman.....and I really wish you would keep my name out of your dumb azz self-loathing mouth....my experience with niggas who support uncle tommism and spend their lives promoting whites and everything except for blacks really have no place in my life anymore....not even in gotdamn message board site....now please keep my name out of your fucking mouth.....unless you want me to go back and gather all the questions you cannot answer without clearly demonstrating what a bootlicking raghead philosophy you embrace........
For the sake of argument I'll take an entirely different approach. In this country money is the currency (both literally and figuratively) that matters. Thus, why shouldn't it be that those who pay taxes are the ones who vote? If you pay taxes then you have "skin" in the game. You have a financial interest in the outcome - how your money is used. Hence, even those who currently are denied the vote - like non-citizen residents - under this scheme would get the opportunity to vote.

Millions of undocumented immigrants pay taxes of every kind to this nation. Federal Reserve chairman Alan Greenspan says that they are net positives to the treasury - that they pay more into the govermnent than they use - that they actually subsidize our lives through their taxes. Why shouldn't they have a say into how their taxes are spent?

Now of course there could be some residency provisions applied, but why not? If we are truly interested in democracy, then shouldn't we be figuring out ways of trying to get MORE people to vote rather than less? If people are uninformed, is that really their fault - or is it the fault of a system and process that has an interest in keeping people uninformed?

BTW - only about 25% of Americans graduate from college.
For the sake of argument I'll take an entirely different approach. In this country money is the currency (both literally and figuratively) that matters. Thus, why shouldn't it be that those who pay taxes are the ones who vote? If you pay taxes then you have "skin" in the game. You have a financial interest in the outcome - how your money is used. Hence, even those who currently are denied the vote - like non-citizen residents - under this scheme would get the opportunity to vote.---MBM

I think in today's vernacular this would be called 'originalist.'

The original plan for the Republic was for only landowners to be voters, and of course, 'white' and male.

We know this plan will not succeed, at least not for long.


PEACE

Jim Chester
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quote:
Definitely.....that is why conservatives decry academia as bastions of liberalism...but the difference between liberals and conservatives on that tip is the difference between all of that social research i placed in here versus the rhetoric others put in here trying to sell "wolf tickets" to black people en masse.....academia is based on FACTS and REALISTIC looks at social disparities and the effects of policy on various groups.....that environment is too grounded in reality to let BS fly.


Simply Amazing.

If only Kevin could take his understanding of REALISM as it relates to "colleges" and apply a dose of it to the situation in too many Black communities. It seems to me that REALITY is what is missing from his assessment on how to make EFFECTIVE change.

Nearly every year Maxine Waters from the Watts district does a "State of the District" speech. I have seen C-SPAN and other outlets carry this event. Each year she tells the audience all that she has done for them. As we look at the economic profile of this section of Los Angeles a critical observer will note that what is on HER paper does not match the REALITY of life on the streets there.

After she builds up the crowd with her accomplishments sue then switches to a tirade against the Republicans. She tells the crowd how THEY have stopped her in her tracks as she has TRIED to bring more resources home to them. She talks about how they are attempting to cancel the "Community Reinvestment Act" that would have banks to loan them money.

EACH YEAR - IT WORKS LIKE A CHARM!!! She and Sharpe James of Newark are the two politicians that deserve a medal for being able to have people look beyond their LOCAL REALITIES and instead focus their fight against some national ideological BOOGIEMAN that is REALLY THE CAUSE of their woes.

You see Kevin if REALITY is what you are dispensing you need not go to the Universities. You need to go to where there are more Black folks - IN THE CITY, on the streets. THIS is where the reality needs to be exposed.

Instead we have those who PIMP ILLUSIONS to the people. They cast lures of "Spinner Rims" and "Platnum Fronts" as they attempt to reel in women for sex and young Black males as mentors to "The Game". Those green notes with the White men on them is the bottom line, no different than the White capitalist. They are not the lover of men. They love money.

While YOU seek more Blacks to vote Democrat with the hopes that through Democratic victory the Black community will live vicariously through this good fortune for the Democrats. In truth there is a growning number of young Black people who are tuned out of this entire voting and political process. They are into their own little world, all within their own little community. Take a trip to the late night hangout ON ANY DAY OF THE WEEK and you will see them. What REALITY do they live in Kevin?

Though you attack the Windmill of the "Black Conservative" you fail to oranize this group of people and/or hold them accountable for their duties to the community.

In the long run their RIGHT TO VOTE will become IRRELEVANT TO THEM. They will have lost both confidence in the system and lost the vision that "the system" working in their favor is the pathway toward their success.

Instead they are redefining "success" so that they can be winners. Unfortunately their definintions don't quite live up to what YOU define as success. Certainly there will be few of them living to their 80th birthday within their lifestyle.

The basic point, my friend, is that their "reality" and their "consciousness" is very different than what yours is.
Learn to explain your own fucking position beyond rhetoric before your feeble attempts to scrutinize what I say...I could go get those actual quotes from actual conservatives but you're not worth the time to even go get them.....it is funny how your ilk will say stupid schit and label others as inadequate when they FACTUALLY dissect everything you all say.....i'll just stick to academia, where blkCONS and racist white ones are really scared to assert themselves unless they are at a conference of racists somewhere in lilly white classrooms...the kinds blkCONS strive to attain....because the idiotic nature of their ways become real apparent....but the meetings that I go to with terrorist "experts" and their apprehension and their admittance of failure and their pleas to emulate the structures of those they are trying to stop....tells me that their position in the world has slipped since the 50s......and that their loyal VOLUNTARY SUBORDINATE azz blkCONS are willing to sink right along with the ship........
and as so far as basking in general stereotypes to always paint that disparaging view of black people that fits your efforts to work counter to black progress and inclusion....you probably need someone that is more practical and share a negative view of black people the majority of their time...given the extra social hurdles black people face by themselves we have made tremendous strives and will continue to do so despite opposition....black or white....so your emphasis on rims and other symbols you reference as attributes to blackness fall on deaf ears....because I an many others represent black excellence that transcends any labeling that is attempted to be put on us solely because we are black...so again......I do not really fool off my time with the self-haters who play little bitch azz coward game of ignoring scrutinization of their views but still offering scrutinization on the views of others.....that intelectually dumbed-down type of dialogue is beneath the efforts I have made to actually learn things from a factual premise....and I do not want you to get confused and think I am even seeing anything you say with any validity....you would be better off trying to convince someone who has read a lot less than I have........
Kevin, C-Feed likes 2 pull your chain dawg..

As usual MBM always ruins my day w/ his superior logic... bang

That is a pretty valid argument M'...

I just think that anyone who does stuff like scribble in Daffy Duck/Popeye or any other such monkey bizness does not honour the voting process and should be removed from the voter roles..

And yes being able to read (English) and/or have a high school diploma/GED should be the minimum standard for eligibilty to vote...

As black people we have a history of being denied the right to vote so I don't think my ideas would ever be taken seriously by anyone..

Anyone who thinks Evlis is still alive should be immediatly taken off of the voter rolls.
quote:
How is the stipulation of a college degree to vote any different than the old "land owner" qualifications or reading & U.S. Constitution tests? Reading or watching the news doesn't qualify you either - doing those things don't guarantee comprehension of political issues. Besides, how would you test whether a potential voter "understates" a platform or politician's past without bias?
IMO, all an undergrad degree does is prepare you to work in coporate America. A BA/BS doesn't indicate mastery of a subject - it just shows that you can follow instructions, complete complex tasks, and that you know basic math, science, and grammar.


That is precisly my point...

Having a BA demonstrates a minimum level of critical thinking capacity...

No it is not a definitive indicatior of ones IQ, but it is a start.
I approached my support for Affirmative Action on the basis of rising college enrollment and graduation numbers for blacks over a 30 year period...and no other indicator of measurement...I showed how support for repeals to AA resulted in those numbers going downward for the first time in that 30 year span.....nothing else......I then asked a specific question of why would a black person logically support those kinds of outcomes.......now those are all fairly simple concepts except the last one....for the fact that such number declines cannot logically be considered as beneficial to black people....a blkCON cannot logically explain why THEY support those kinda efforts....and that is why when you ask them that specific question..they have to divert the topic and talk about anything and everything except for THEIR MOTIVATION TO SUPPORT SUCH POLICY OUTCOMES....and based on the racist factions that they help to promote these outcomes....makes thm appear to be even more self-hating....I do not need to even dialogue with people with that kind of psychological bagage....they need to spend their time alone asking themselves how did they become that "kind"of a black person? So i'm kool CF..you go ahead and be your kinda black person and i'll be mine and we'll see how it all plays out in america between blackCONS and black progressives...and who will be the one that can prosper and bring others along for the ride...that will be the true indicator of where one's heart was....and how effective their thinking really was....I used your word..effectiveness......the one you cannot apply to the policy your ilk subscribes to....
quote:
I showed how support for repeals to AA resulted in those numbers going downward for the first time in that 30 year span.....nothing else......I then asked a specific question of why would a black person logically support those kinds of outcomes.



AGAIN A FALSE DICHOTOMY.

I can become King and implement a policy that EVERY BLACK PERSON THAT APPLIES GETS INTO COLLEGE AND I WILL GREATLY SURPASS ANY NUMBER THAT YOU CAN POST ON THE SUCCESS OF AA.

The FLAW in your AA strategy is that you are DEPENDENT on WHITE FOLKS to agree to LET YOU into SCHOOL in these NUMBERS.

Remove the program and the NUMBERS FALL - as we see.

Strengthen the PUBLIC SCHOOL EXPERIENCE and we build a better Black student and more of them will go to college.

Affirmative Action does NOTHING for the Black Students who don't go to college and does not increase the pool of students who are "college material" based on their academic attainment.

YOU CLEARLY ARE AN ADVOCATE FOR AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. I AM AN ADOVCATE OF BLACK EDUCATIONAL REFORM AND ENHANCEMENT.

Big Difference.
quote:
I can become King and implement a policy that EVERY BLACK PERSON THAT APPLIES GETS INTO COLLEGE AND I WILL GREATLY SURPASS ANY NUMBER THAT YOU CAN POST ON THE SUCCESS OF AA.

The FLAW in your AA strategy is that you are DEPENDENT on WHITE FOLKS to agree to LET YOU into SCHOOL in these NUMBERS.


Now listen to that stupid azz dumb azz idiotic statement that you just made....you start of talking about what you CAN do which is just another way of eluding what the fuck is ACTUALLY happening. If I were to embrace your ignorant azz rambling as having any validity, my question to you would be what are you using as a model to make your predictions of greater effectiveness than AA provided...plot your enrollment trends and show how they will be higher in actual number of students each year...and show how the percentage growth from year to year exceeds the percentages under AA each year for a 30 year span.......I know that whole concept of substantiating what the fuck you believe with facts in that manner is a concept that is waaay above your intellectually lazy azz mind......but to just once again demonstrate to you the stupidity that you speak with.....I am going to just take your statement itself and let you see the stupidity inherent in it.....you said IF you become king....now I don't what the fuck brought about that delusional azz introduction to whatever in the hell point you THOUGHT you were going to make.....but not only did you say some dumb azz schit about being king....you said some stupid axx schit like "if all black kids that apply to college get enrolled"...now think about that ignorant shit right there.....if everyone who applies to college gets in...then that is an 100% acceptance rate for that group(black kids)....there is not such a thing.....as 100% acceptance in college enrollment....period......so once again....you speak from a premise that is unrealistic to even establish in this society.....which means in essence...that you are some damn fool on the sidelines spouting out some kind of imaginary pie-in-the sky azz results...let me ask you something...would you say something like that in a college classroom?
quote:
The FLAW in your AA strategy is that you are DEPENDENT on WHITE FOLKS to agree to LET YOU into SCHOOL in these NUMBERS.
............... VS. ..................
Strengthen the PUBLIC SCHOOL EXPERIENCE and we build a better Black student and more of them will go to college.
Ummm... What colleges will these "better Black students" be going to?

That is? Do you have some plan to build MORE and "better" Black Colleges for these "Better Black Students"? Because, if not, your STRATEGY, too... is contingent, DEPENDENT "on White Folks agreeing to
Let *YOU* (them) Into [THEIR] Schools In Those "Better" Numbers.

Hmmm... Seems like the AA struggles would give you a clue as to how that is going to work. Or rather how your idea which, without MORE Black Colleges, is betting on something that's hardly a sure thing: That White Folks are going to let 100% of "Better" Black students into "THEIR" Colleges just because...

You must really have a lot of (unfounded) faith and trust in White People. Faith and trust no part of American History warrants... But that's another discussion.

Anyway... Speak to that: How it is you can have a "strategy" DEPENDENT on Black Students Going To WHITE COLLEGES but castigate Kevin for a "strategy" that does the same, so to speak. You can also talk about the fucked up premise of your with regard to AA and the White Folk "let you in" business as if Black Students today aren't "qualified" as you speak as if White Folks are doing us a favor.

But the thing is, since you've NEVER talked about an alternative to WHITE COLLEGES, a functional alternative (though, it clear, you've never developed your thoughts to speak aout any at all)... since you've NEVER talked about anything other than WHITE COLLEGES, in essence, and "better" preparing Black Students... really, how does your "strategy" avoid being one based on "DEPENDENCY"??

quote:
Affirmative Action does NOTHING for the Black Students who don't go to college...
Got Damn! It's the Return Of Sherlocke Holmes!

Now, what is it that you don't understand about AA as it relates to COLLEGE?

quote:
YOU CLEARLY ARE AN ADVOCATE FOR AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. I AM AN ADOVCATE OF BLACK EDUCATIONAL REFORM AND ENHANCEMENT.

Big Difference.
And what an understatement. Not as if your underlying EITHER OR shit is even close to being accurate, but now maybe your confused ass can see the BIG DIFFERENCE in how the two ideas AA for College and K-12 Education are TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT TOPICS.

Dayyyyyummmmmmmmm!!! Mad

Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin

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