I am a black male and been single for about a year now. I have been noticing a lot of irony and confusion in the dating/meeting ritual of today. I am 28, employed, college educated, and good looking. What I am clueless about is the signals I don't receive from sistas. Not to sound arrogant, but as a good looking, marrying aged man walking around with no ring on his finger I would expect that I am at least good for a smile or serious eye contact. Instead I sense a very unconcerned, nonchalant disposition from sistas. I'm tripping because one minute I hear and read about black women feeling unsatisfied because of the big gender imbalance crisis in or nation among blacks; especially professionally and educationally. Isn't there a big issue among sistas worried about the low number of available men to marry? They do a lot of preaching about it but thier actions don't reflect their worry. I mean from my professional workplace at a huge company, a big college I take night classes at, or the big church I often visit. In all of these places sistas outnumber brothas 6-8 to 1; and I know that all of them aren't attached. So why do sistas give off the impression that they are not concerned when in the presence of a possible available brotha? I feel that sistas almost purposely avoid simple socializing with a man they don't know but who could be available. Even common courtesies like saying hello and making eye contact let alone engage in innocent conversation or flirting. I have even noticed frowns, the rolling of the eyes, or simply acting like they didn't even notice a brotha. Are these sistas just puttin on a front? Is pride stopping them from showing interest? By there body language I would conclude that they are either already attached or prefer not to meet a man for a possible relationship. I refuse to question my appearance because I dress nice and stay clean cut, carry my self as a grown man, and speak with intelligence. So why do sistas put out these counter acting vibes? Is it just me?
All phenomena are characterized by "unity" through the complementarity of masculine and feminine principles – Memphite theology
Original Post
Kweli, your old saying may be true in many cases but I do not believe this to be one of them. If what this brother say is true and all we can do is take what he saying at face value and believe he has no reason to lie to us then I say this discussion should focus on what is being said versus the person that is saying it. We can do both but just focusing on him and not commenting on his statements does not help.

Now brother Detroit1, a relationship is about relating, these women you see all the time are probably feeling what you are feeling when they look at you. It is always a learning experience when one finally holds a conversation with someone whom they have passed or seen on several occasion but never took the time to converse with. You will find that what they thought of you is totally inaccurate and what you thought of them is totally inaccurate. Perception is reality as it relate to how we view other people. The easiest way to solve the dilemma your having Brother Detroit1 would be to not wait for the sista's to give you a look or show you this interest you think must be present before you decide to converse with them. As men we go after those things we want and we go after women we are attracted to. Open your mouth brother, if you are waiting on a sista to say something to you because you are what they are looking for, then your wait will be a long one because none of them know this about you. However, when you finally meet a sista, she will spread the word; watch how many of them say "I always wondered about him" but he seem like he was so and so. Step up and speak up Black man there are tons of beautiful Black women out there waiting for a man like yourself as you have described yourself. I would hate for some white woman name suzzy to say hi to you and you believe that for whatever reason she see in you something the sista's did not. Stay away from Suzzy good brother.

-------------------------
When our most educated, and best prepared turn their back on our community, stagnation sets in and the men and women who are not the most educated and not the most prepared become the example for those coming behind them. It is up to those of us who are not rich and well off but are educated and prepared to educate our youth and prepare them for what they will face when entering the world.



More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem
out of all of that--the most important sentance:


quote:
Originally posted by Faheem:
Stay away from Suzzy good brother.




for real brotha detroit1--if you are all that you say you are--show some confidence and speak. we love nothing more than a confident black man who see's what he wants and approaches it respectfully.
unfortunately if you are attractive, if you are financially stable, educated, etc--some sistah's might think you've already crossed over into suzzy-land and some of the scowls you receive could be because of that. like faheem said--perception is rarely what reality is once you get to know someone and showing your true interest to a few sista's in the places you mention you frequent will let them all know that suzzy isn't an issue. Smile

if all else fails--move to seattle, i know a single sistah. lol just kidding...


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994
quote:
Originally posted by isistah:
Personally, I think 28 is too young to be considering marriage. Maybe you're coming into contact with women who think likewise.


28 too young for marriage? I wonder how many here would agree. I got married way too young, at 19, and then waited way too long before the divorce! Eek

I listened to way too many years of this before I got out: broscream

But 28 seems to me a good age to be thinking of marriage.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


Thanks for the interesting responses but still no direct answer to my root question. I'll start off by saying I have approached women plenty of times based on their looks alone, regardless of any rhythm between us, but that's not enough. I now see it as insincere and juvenile. It should be more than a phat tail to move a brotha to the point where he just gots to get a name and number. I get something out of the whole flirting thing. The classic boy meets girl scenario: eye-contact, body language, and the whole vibing thing. I was hoping to hear that someone else understood what I was talking about when it came to signs men read from women. I still feel that some single women give off signals that don't promote introduction. I'm single so I act single. I don't hide my glances when I see a fine sista. I attempt to make eye-contact. I'm basically all in. But why isn't the feeling, signs and body language mutual? I don't expect women to make the first move or cross the thin line of showing interest and appearing to be desperate. Plan and simple, why don't single sistas act single instead of walking around like their not trying to meet nobody? Like it is no big deal.
quote:
Originally posted by detroit1:
I am a black male and been single for about a year now. I have been noticing a lot of irony and confusion in the dating/meeting ritual of today. I am 28, employed, college educated, and good looking. What I am clueless about is the signals I don't receive from sistas. Not to sound arrogant, but as a good looking, marrying aged man walking around with no ring on his finger I would expect that I am at least good for a smile or serious eye contact. Instead I sense a very unconcerned, nonchalant disposition from sistas. I'm tripping because one minute I hear and read about black women feeling unsatisfied because of the big gender imbalance crisis in or nation among blacks; especially professionally and educationally. Isn't there a big issue among sistas worried about the low number of available men to marry? They do a lot of preaching about it but thier actions don't reflect their worry. I mean from my professional workplace at a huge company, a big college I take night classes at, or the big church I often visit. In all of these places sistas outnumber brothas 6-8 to 1; and I know that all of them aren't attached. So why do sistas give off the impression that they are not concerned when in the presence of a possible available brotha? I feel that sistas almost purposely avoid simple socializing with a man they don't know but who could be available. Even common courtesies like saying hello and making eye contact let alone engage in innocent conversation or flirting. I have even noticed frowns, the rolling of the eyes, or simply acting like they didn't even notice a brotha. Are these sistas just puttin on a front? Is pride stopping them from showing interest? By there body language I would conclude that they are either already attached or prefer not to meet a man for a possible relationship. I refuse to question my appearance because I dress nice and stay clean cut, carry my self as a grown man, and speak with intelligence. So why do sistas put out these counter acting vibes? Is it just me?


bruh to bruh, at 28 years old, you have tried blk woman and it doesn't seem to work, try other races, believe me, you'll be much, much happier!!! Go to a local sports bar or a suburb nightclub and just watch at the large number of 'other race' women that will give you that attention you want. Don't worry, just stand there, they'll approach you. You need not develop any macklines to introduce yourself. Just be chill. I think that, judging by your information provided about you, you'll be ideal for them. Other races of women have a high respect for the educated and professional types. It's been my experience that blk women are not interested in a 'good blk man' until their life is in shambles, i.e. babymomma drama, thug ex boyfriend in jail, or drama addicted, if you don't have enuff drama for them, esp the ones your age or younger, you are NOT what they want. why can't the first guy that have a kid with be a good, professional, educated man??

Nevermind that, let's talk about you.

You have worked hard, developed yourself, been legal, and all you ask is for a lifetime love from a good woman...that might not be possible with many blk women out there...consider this, if you look at the pool of available single blk women and eliminated single moms, a-t-t-i-t-u-d-e issues, drama addicts, drug addicts, gollddiggers, fuller fat ones, etc...there are about three single blk women left. You deserve better man!! That's not a diss, just a reality. DO that same test with other races of women, there just are more desireable dating situations there...open your mind bruh.



***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused

Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!

[This message was edited by RadioRaheem on August 01, 2003 at 12:07 PM.]
Radio you are not fit to give advice to intelligent black men because doing so would require intelligence and it is clear from the bullshit you just wrote you lack intelligence. There are equally ignorant Black women like you out there spouting just the opposite of what you are saying. They are saying to Black women to look for a mate in other races because Black men are either on drugs, in jail, have baby momma drama, uneducated or just plain hopeless. Some one is lying. If this is the condition of Black men and that garbage you wrote is the condition of Black women how do you explain the black man and Black woman like Detroit1. You could not possibly explain them because your hatred for Black women seeps out of everything you say. It matters not though, Negroes like you do not deserve to be with a Black woman, on drugs, uneducated, with a thug baby daddy or other wise. You stick to the little white girls and boys; it is clear you have some deep fascination with them and believe them to be better than Black men and women. You already have the blue print in hand how to get with them but weak men like yourself truly fear the power behind the Black woman. Could you please give information how to get with a Black woman since you are so versed in getting with other women? You sit around in your Black skin and dream and fantasize about the Black woman but because she is your natural mate it is harder to accept rejection from her than it is from any other woman, I am sure negroes like you have been dissed by white women before, but it means absolutely nothing because you know she means nothing, but rejection from the Black woman is like rejection from your momma, your sister and you can not handle that. I believe brother Detroit1 is too smart to fall for your foolishness that's why he frequent places where Black women are and do not hang out in suburbs and sports bars smiling at white women.

-------------------------
When our most educated, and best prepared turn their back on our community, stagnation sets in and the men and women who are not the most educated and not the most prepared become the example for those coming behind them. It is up to those of us who are not rich and well off but are educated and prepared to educate our youth and prepare them for what they will face when entering the world.



More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem
quote:
Originally posted by Faheem:
Radio you are not fit to give advice to intelligent black men because doing so would require intelligence and it is clear from the bullshit you just wrote you lack intelligence. There are equally ignorant Black women like you out there spouting just the opposite of what you are saying. They are saying to Black women to look for a mate in other races because Black men are either on drugs, in jail, have baby momma drama, uneducated or just plain hopeless. Some one is lying. If this is the condition of Black men and that garbage you wrote is the condition of Black women how do you explain the black man and Black woman like Detroit1. You could not possibly explain them because your hatred for Black women seeps out of everything you say. It matters not though, Negroes like you do not deserve to be with a Black woman, on drugs, uneducated, with a thug baby daddy or other wise. You stick to the little white girls and boys; it is clear you have some deep fascination with them and believe them to be better than Black men and women. You already have the blue print in hand how to get with them but weak men like yourself truly fear the power behind the Black woman. Could you please give information how to get with a Black woman since you are so versed in getting with other women? You sit around in your Black skin and dream and fantasize about the Black woman but because she is your natural mate it is harder to accept rejection from her than it is from any other woman, I am sure negroes like you have been dissed by white women before, but it means absolutely nothing because you know she means nothing, but rejection from the Black woman is like rejection from your momma, your sister and you can not handle that. I believe brother Detroit1 is too smart to fall for your foolishness that's why he frequent places where Black women are and do not hang out in suburbs and sports bars smiling at white women.

-------------------------
When our most educated, and best prepared turn their back on our community, stagnation sets in and the men and women who are not the most educated and not the most prepared become the example for those coming behind them. It is up to those of us who are not rich and well off but are educated and prepared to educate our youth and prepare them for what they will face when entering the world.



More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem


i thought this was a forum to post opinions?? Did not the brother state his problems with finding a black woman that was desiring him and his qualities???? what sense would it make to encourage him to continously do the same thing [pursue blk women] and expect a different result [one that will date him back]?? That's insane.

I'm sorry you disagree with me and my verified truth. Why re so many blk women under the age of 35 so thug hungry?? Shouldn't you encourage him to find out what the blk women he wants, want in a man?? That seems to be a criminal record, drama, and thugness. Maybe you should tell him how he can be a thug/bad boy?? I guess you can suggest ways he can hide his intelligence or break up his english.

When you finally leave the land of make-believe or sesame street, please post some realtiy here. Are you saying that i am wrong?? I challenge you to PROVE it.

***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

You have worked hard, developed yourself, been legal, and all you ask is for a lifetime love from a good woman...that might not be possible with many blk women out there...consider this, if you look at the pool of available single blk women and eliminated single moms, a-t-t-i-t-u-d-e issues, drama addicts, drug addicts, gollddiggers, fuller fat ones, etc...there are about three single blk women left. You deserve better man!! That's not a diss, just a reality. DO that same test with other races of women, there just are more desireable dating situations there...open your mind bruh.




I'm not sure if you are being serious here, but there is really no indication that you are not.

If he is indeed attracted to non-black women, then it would make sense for him to explore that option, too. But the impression that I get from his post is that he is mainly interested in black women. He also does not have the very negative attitude reguarding black women that you seem to have (again, assuming that you are serious here, and not just baiting).

Your characterization of black women does not fit my (admittedly limited) experience. But I suspect they are better off without your attentions. You can have my ex, instead! Razz

Being somewhat shy myself, I'm glad that I'm not in the dating game, anymore. I suspect that his story is somewhat common, for both men and women, of all races and backgrounds. I never would have had the nerve to approach my wife, had she not shown interest first. As it turns out, she was just checking me out for a friend, but I misinterpreted her interested in me, and in any case was more interested her than her friend, so I then had the nerve to pursue her. So crossed signals is not necessarily a bad thing! Big Grin


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


quote:
Originally posted by ricardomath:
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

You have worked hard, developed yourself, been legal, and all you ask is for a lifetime love from a good woman...that might not be possible with many blk women out there...consider this, if you look at the pool of available single blk women and eliminated single moms, a-t-t-i-t-u-d-e issues, drama addicts, drug addicts, gollddiggers, fuller fat ones, etc...there are about three single blk women left. You deserve better man!! That's not a diss, just a reality. DO that same test with other races of women, there just are more desireable dating situations there...open your mind bruh.




I'm not sure if you are being serious here, but there is really no indication that you are not.

If he is indeed attracted to non-black women, then it would make sense for him to explore that option, too. But the impression that I get from his post is that he is mainly interested in black women. He also does not have the very negative attitude reguarding black women that you seem to have (again, assuming that you are serious here, and not just baiting).

Your characterization of black women does not fit my (admittedly limited) experience. But I suspect they are better off without your attentions. You can have my ex, instead! Razz

Being somewhat shy myself, I'm glad that I'm not in the dating game, anymore. I suspect that his story is somewhat common, for both men and women, of all races and backgrounds. I never would have had the nerve to approach my wife, had she not shown interest first. As it turns out, she was just checking me out for a friend, but I misinterpreted her interested in me, and in any case was more interested her than her friend, so I then had the nerve to pursue her. So crossed signals is not necessarily a bad thing! Big Grin


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


http://www.plowsharesactions.org/
http://www.nonviolence.org/nukeresister/
http://www.soaw.org/





i understand and respect your opinion. My point of view is very similar to the original poster of this thread. I, too, am educated and professional and have heard numerous blk women complain about black man shortage etc. The issue I have with them is their lack of focus on growing wit a brother on the raise [i.e. possibly dating a man at their college] and a 'thug addiction'...why would anyone date a bad boy or attempt to convert a bad boy into a good man, if they loved themselves?? I think this is the major problem that young blk women, under 35 or so, have with relationships. It seems that the blk women that the original poster is talking about are the most desireable ones, i.e. no kids, educated, professional, etc aren't interested in a man on the positive....unless and until they have been, 'screwed' over by thug boy. I've noticed this in my life, the life of my friends, church members, etc...it seems very much universal. Again, i'm not here to diss, i'm a realist by nature. No sense hoping for a better world, when we all must deal with the world in front of us. I suggested that that bruh date interracally because that is what I did and can speak highly from that experience. Notice that those that advised him to continue to look for more blk women are not speaking from experience [i.e. having lived like him and later found a good blk woman after many failed attempts], but from a possible standpoint of insecurity or some other nonsensical viewpoint. If the bruh struck out time after time, maybe he needs to change his outlook on things, that's all i'm suggesting...from a REALIST mindset Wink

***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

i understand and respect your opinion. My point of view is very similar to the original poster of this thread. I, too, am educated and professional and have heard numerous blk women complain about black man shortage etc. The issue I have with them is their lack of focus on growing wit a brother on the raise [i.e. possibly dating a man at their college] and a 'thug addiction'...why would anyone date a bad boy or attempt to convert a bad boy into a good man, if they loved themselves?? I think this is the major problem that young blk women, under 35 or so, have with relationships. It seems that the blk women that the original poster is talking about are the most desireable ones, i.e. no kids, educated, professional, etc aren't interested in a man on the positive....unless and until they have been, 'screwed' over by thug boy. I've noticed this in my life, the life of my friends, church members, etc...it seems very much universal. Again, i'm not here to diss, i'm a realist by nature. No sense hoping for a better world, when we all must deal with the world in front of us. I suggested that that bruh date interracally because that is what I did and can speak highly from that experience. Notice that those that advised him to continue to look for more blk women are not speaking from experience [i.e. having lived like him and later found a good blk woman after many failed attempts], but from a possible standpoint of insecurity or some other nonsensical viewpoint. If the bruh struck out time after time, maybe he needs to change his outlook on things, that's all i'm suggesting...from a REALIST mindset Wink




I don't see his point of view as being at all close to yours. I don't read his post as expressing the kind of hostility towards black women that your post does. He is expressing a frustration that I think is common across all gender, racial, and cultural lines.

I'm certianly not opposed to interracial dating, and to my mind, if he is attracted to women of other races, then it makes sense to broaden his search, on the grounds that you catch more fish with a wider net, but only if he is so inclined. It makes no sense to pursue women that he is not attracted to. And if he does so, it certainly would not make sense for him to blame some imagined faults of black women in general for his decision, as you aparently do.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


quote:
Originally posted by ricardomath:
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

i understand and respect your opinion. _My point of view is very similar to the original poster of this thread._ I, too, am educated and professional and have heard numerous blk women complain about black man shortage etc. The issue I have with them is their lack of focus on growing wit a brother on the raise [i.e. possibly dating a man at their college] and a 'thug addiction'...why would anyone date a bad boy or attempt to convert a bad boy into a good man, if they loved themselves?? I think this is the major problem that young blk women, under 35 or so, have with relationships. It seems that the blk women that the original poster is talking about are the most desireable ones, i.e. no kids, educated, professional, etc aren't interested in a man on the positive....unless and until they have been, 'screwed' over by thug boy. I've noticed this in my life, the life of my friends, church members, etc...it seems very much universal. Again, i'm not here to diss, i'm a realist by nature. No sense hoping for a better world, when we all must deal with the world in front of us. I suggested that that bruh date interracally because that is what I did and can speak highly from that experience. Notice that those that advised him to continue to look for more blk women are not speaking from experience [i.e. having lived like him and later found a good blk woman after many failed attempts], but from a possible standpoint of insecurity or some other nonsensical viewpoint. If the bruh struck out time after time, maybe he needs to change his outlook on things, that's all i'm suggesting...from a REALIST mindset Wink




I don't see his point of view as being at all close to yours. I don't read his post as expressing the kind of hostility towards black women that your post does. He is expressing a frustration that I think is common across all gender, racial, and cultural lines.

I'm certianly not opposed to interracial dating, and to my mind, if he is attracted to women of other races, then it makes sense to broaden his search, on the grounds that you catch more fish with a wider net, but only if he is so inclined. It makes no sense to pursue women that he is not attracted to. And if he does so, it certainly would not make sense for him to blame some imagined faults of black women in general for his decision, as you aparently do.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


http://www.plowsharesactions.org/
http://www.nonviolence.org/nukeresister/
http://www.soaw.org/





pardon me, i mistyped, my 'life experience' is similiar to the writer of this thread. This may have led to my current feelings, which are the end reult of the dating 'culture' i've described in my post. I hope that clears it up. Peace

***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
Your truth is not verified and you are not a realist. If you were a realist you would know that the garbage you wrote is not the reality of all Black women. What you are saying is not even the general rule. Are you so delusional and in love with white women that you believe Black women do not want a good man. Is this true for all the Black women you know? I highly doubt it. With the number of Black women in college versus the number of brothers in college you have to be confused. Black women out number us in colleges, in corporate jobs and in many other professional fields. Are you saying these women fall into your twisted logic. These women are not the exception these women are the rule, most Black women want a good man and desire a good man. There are many who do like the thugged out brothers less he would not exist. There is a balance in the Black community and always will be, the balance is distorted do to ignorance like your spouting here, the continued courting, dating and marrying of white women by accomplished Black men and can not forget the hatred of self.

You did not address the question I raised, I will ask it again. If there exist Black women who are telling other Black women to date and marry men from other races because Black men are either in jail, on drugs, jobless, uneducated, gay or hopeless and then there are Negroes Like you who claim to be none of this but are telling other brothers to date women from other races because Black women are either uneducated, have baby daddy drama, drug addicts, gold diggers etc.. How is it possible for the two fools saying this (you and the sista) to exist? Are you and the ignorant sista an anomaly? Would you agree with the Black woman saying to the other Black woman all those things about Black men? One of you are lying, and if both of you are right we might as well surrender now because the struggle is clearly over.

-------------------------
When our most educated, and best prepared turn their back on our community, stagnation sets in and the men and women who are not the most educated and not the most prepared become the example for those coming behind them. It is up to those of us who are not rich and well off but are educated and prepared to educate our youth and prepare them for what they will face when entering the world.



More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem
Detriot1, first off welcome to the board fam. Yeah I totally get what your saying,it all seems so simple on paper,boy sees girl boy likes and hopes, and tries to get girl to like him too, right? And you might be asking yourself why something that seems so simple on paper, is harder than a chinese puzzle, or one of those old rubix cubes. I feel ya, tons of brothas do. You pay attention to what sistas (or I guess women in general) say they want, forge yourself into that over the years, while listening to the many criticisms thrown brothas way, promise yourself to be the exception only to step out into society and be ignored. Sometimes it feels like sistas are going out of their way to ignore a brotha (hows that for irony).

*sigh* I read this post yesterday but did'nt want to respond till I had something to say that might aid you, some bit of advice, or a stratagy I could provide, and I hoped that I might come up with SOMETHING as I started this response but I can't think of any. If I did'nt live here in New York where one can find blackwomen from every corner of the globe I don't know what I'd do! I've never been on AA sistas radar for who knows what reason. I remember one time this AA sis. I worked with, told me she would'nt go on a date with me because I kept coming to work on time, and said "you know thats some whitepeople sh*t".

Unfortunately some kats do stray to other races out of frustation, but you know that already, but the trend I'm just starting to see coming over the horizon is brothas here ACTIVELY pursuing sistas from other parts of the world. in the past, it was more of a "whatever" sort of vibe, in reguards to where a sista might be from. But now, I see more and more kats who've got it together, and startin' to consider starting a fam., purposely looking to sistas from other parts of the world. I remember lurking on some board (I can't think of the name off hand) a while ago and some french sista saying something like "If The black women of the u.s. won't take you, you belong to the rest of us by default" and I notice more and more dudes taking up that same stance I don't know if that something your interested in, or what the deal is in detroit in terms of different nationalities,but it's an option, and you can never have too many of those, word of caution: Those east african women,are ADDICTIVE. Wink

May the high praises of YAH be in their mouth and a two edged sword in their hand, To execute vengence on the peoples;to bind their kings with chains,and their nobles in shackles of iron,to carry out the sentence written against them.
This is the glory of the saints (psalms149)

[This message was edited by IMMORTAL LOGIC on August 02, 2003 at 09:22 PM.]


[This message was edited by IMMORTAL LOGIC on August 02, 2003 at 09:28 PM.]
quote:
Originally posted by Faheem:
Your truth is not verified and you are not a realist. If you were a realist you would know that the garbage you wrote is not the reality of all Black women.

**Never said all blk women, was referring to the under 35 types, i believe I stated that, I guess your lack of intelligence prevents you from reading effectively, remember : 'Reading is fundamental'**

What you are saying is not even the general rule.

**There are no rules for love***

Are you so delusional and in love with white women that you believe Black women do not want a good man.

***Never said anything about white women. I was talking about dating outside of one's race. There are other races other than blk and white...what do you call latinos?? arabs?? asians?? since they are not blk or white...are they human??? LOL!!!**

Is this true for all the Black women you know? I highly doubt it.

**Again, for the under 35 types, they are thug addicts and aren't interested in blk men with degrees, unless they have been screwed over by thugs or knocked up by one. Please speak with blk women at the age that the original poster is speking of and you will noticed a strong attraction to thugs / bad boys/criminals. Have you ever known a drug dealer to have problems getting women?? Why not??***

With the number of Black women in college versus the number of brothers in college you have to be confused. Black women out number us in colleges, in corporate jobs and in many other professional fields.

**Depends how you look at it.

According to the US CENSUS,
http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/02statab/educ.pdf
**No. 211 - The black male outearns the blk woman with the same level of education

blk male BS degree $42,530 and MS degree $54,642
blk female BS degree $33,184 and MS $44,761

**No. 209 - The Black female only slightly earns more college degrees that the blk man
blk female 16.7% vs. blk male 16.3% [both of total population of each group]

**If you look at the top 50 CEO/CFOs listed in Black Enterprise magazine, you'll notice that only two blk women are listed. Oprah and Cathy Hughes [of radio one]...the other 48 are black men. I think you are confusing the administrative assistants/HR dept workers with leaders of major corporations....Don't worry that's the common nonsense black women kick around amongst themselves....they don't like the facts either.

**I've listed the census website where these stats are from, i'm still awaiting your source for your information. please post that source in your reply, thanks..I figure you have those are the ready, esp. since i'm so confused Big Grin


Are you saying these women fall into your twisted logic. These women are not the exception these women are the rule, most Black women want a good man and desire a good man.

***'most' means 50% or greater or a majority...do you KNOW the majority of blk women?? If so, how did you meet those millions of sisters?? was it a convention?? chat room?? festival?? do tell!!!...or is that your twisted logic in action???***


There are many who do like the thugged out brothers less he would not exist. There is a balance in the Black community and always will be, the balance is distorted do to ignorance like your spouting here,

**yet my 'ignorance' is backed up by statistical fact. why do you think there are so many single black moms out there?? so many OOW births?? teen births?? I think it's because of their attempts to nurture and /or desire to try to change a thug into a 'good man'. When that fails, they begin looking for a good man, like the one that open this topic. Too little, too late...why is it that so many single moms are looking for a childless man??? I gues they are looking for someone to pay those bills without any previous child support payments Wink


the continued courting, dating and marrying of white women by accomplished Black men and can not forget the hatred of self.

**Not into white women, i've stated that earlier. Also, if you went to a place like Asia or South America, as you saying that those women MUST be white or black?? I think that there are other races on this planet. Maybe you just have a white people hatred growing inside. I don't know, if so, then that is not good.***

You did not address the question I raised, I will ask it again. If there exist Black women who are telling other Black women to date and marry men from other races because Black men are either in jail, on drugs, jobless, uneducated, gay or hopeless and then there are Negroes Like you who claim to be none of this but are telling other brothers to date women from other races because Black women are either uneducated, have baby daddy drama, drug addicts, gold diggers etc.. How is it possible for the two fools saying this (you and the sista) to exist?

**We are all free agents and have the free will to pick and choose who we associate with. This is where you logic fails you. It is possible for a human to date another human of another race, marry, have kids, and never associate with an opposite gender, individual of their own race...these people can live and happy and normal life. I think that the race card you are using expired decades ago. Single people in that 'meet market'/dating world, do NOT owe anyone, anything. A bruh can live a normal life and never date a sister, and vice versa. I think that is something that you might have missed in your rant against me. I could date all colors of the rainbow, if those women choose to date me back, and you or a black woman or anyother 'haters' can not stop that. That's just the truth put bluntly.


Are you and the ignorant sista an anomaly?

**Nope, just free thinking individuals. Me personally, i date who i want and do not need the 'approval' of my race to 'co-sign' on my dating choice.***

Would you agree with the Black woman saying to the other Black woman all those things about Black men?

**I need not have to 'agree or disagree' it's her reality and it's a free speech country. She can feel how she wants. In fact, since the 'jailbird, babydaddy, criminal, no job having, living with his momma, tacky knee-grow' stereotype doesn't fit me, i can not take it personal. I have never spend a sec in jail or parole or done anything remotely illegal...not even parking violations, not child support to pay [i'm childless], don't live with fam [i left to go to college and never returned]...you see, if she feels that way, that's her RIGHT. I am under no obligation to 'change her mind'/opinion of blk men. That's her reality**


One of you are lying, and if both of you are right we might as well surrender now because the struggle is clearly over.
**Actually, it has been said that the most uneducated/ignorant people think only in extremes and that is the caterogy you attempted to put me in, but that seems to be your place. In America, there are MILLIONS OF BLACK PEOPLE!!! MILLIONS!!! something like 30 or 35 mill, i believe. It is possible that every black woman I have met is just like i described and also, it is possible that all the blk men that that sister described in just like that. Maybe her and i don't get out much or know people too deeply, but this could be true. Maybe her and i are in a small town with few blacks or a poor area like Mississippi or Bama. It's possible. For me, I grew up in a very large city [balitmore] and have seen over and over again that same thug hunger in blk women followed by the 'quest for a good man'. I often found it weird that in their post-thug dream man, is the exact opposite of their babydaddy...i guess that just one example of how men maure faster than women Big Grin **


**I'm sorry that you do not agree with me, but remember, only I [between you and i] gave actually advice that this topic starter can use and benefit from. Notice that he has already done what you have said and got nothing from it[that's why he wrote the topic here , he wanted ADVICE!!!]. I gave good advice that he could grow from and use to find the love he seeks. I'm speaking from experience. I was just like him following my college graduation and got a similar result, until I did what I suggested and found happiness.

-------------------------
When our most educated, and best prepared turn their back on our community, stagnation sets in and the men and women who are not the most educated and not the most prepared become the example for those coming behind them. It is up to those of us who are not rich and well off but are educated and prepared to educate our youth and prepare them for what they will face when entering the world.



More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem


***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!

[This message was edited by RadioRaheem on August 02, 2003 at 05:05 PM.]
YO! RR, trust me people are NOT ready for those census stats, me and my boy noticed that. brosmile The quickest way to spark a argument with most sistas(and some brothas for some reason Confused)is to bring up facts from the census or justice department stats.

But for real fellas, dude came looking for advice, let's not turn his post into a pissing match.

______________________________
May the high praises of YAH be in their mouth and a two edged sword in their hand, To execute vengence on the peoples;to bind their kings with chains,and their nobles in shackles of iron,to carry out the sentence written against them.
This is the glory of the saints (psalms149)

[This message was edited by IMMORTAL LOGIC on August 02, 2003 at 09:20 PM.]
as a sistah who is together, good job, education, independent, taking care of her business and not interested in a dating world according to RR--it frustrates and pains me to see black men saying they have difficulty meeting black women.

over and over and over again on this board i've put a call out to my sisters to take a look in the mirror at what it is we're doing to ourselves and our fellow sisters. what attitudes are we portraying, why the lack of support for our black men and then the complaining that brotha man isn't here for us?

i for one am single and attractive and have a difficult time with the black men in my area--they all seem to be siblings of RR. i've done nothing wrong, but feel as if i'm being punished for all the chicken head sistahs out there. black men don't want black women--period. that is the message i get, and the message im reading here.

its almost as if a black man has one too many bad experiences, and he crosses over. why???

dating, relationships, love is all about meeting enough people until you meet the right one and things fall into place. it should be about having a foundational criteria (black woman, educated, single, kids or no kids, a physical requirement if that's important to you, religious affiliation, etc) for what you think will work for you in a mate and sticking with that until you find the right one.

it shouldn't be about trying this or that until you're fed up and then trying something else--how will you ever know that the 'right one' wasn't the next one--if you're open to anything?

it's almost like mining for diamonds..you have to pick an area and work that area...turn over tons of rocks, dig until your arms are sore..but once you find the diamond--its all worth it. you don't dig sporatically all over the mountain hoping to find the diamond...

im venting, and i apologize for doing so on brotha detroits call for advice, i just wanted him to know we are NOT all like the women he's incountered. as a single black woman who has so much to offer a black man, it's frustrating to read things from people like RR, or hear that black men have now traded us for women of international descent. where does that leave women like me?? im not the only one like me out there.


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994


[This message was edited by Nykkii on August 02, 2003 at 11:31 PM.]
RR--to your census points about how much men earn over women with degree's and advanced degree's--that's nothing new, and it wasn't Faheem's point.

Faheem said With the number of Black women in college versus the number of brothers in college you have to be confused. Black women out number us in colleges, in corporate jobs and in many other professional fields. his point being there are more black women getting higher educations than there are black males--not that black women earn more than black men. (were you doing some creative reading?) and for the sistah's getting higher educations--it's highly unlikely that they are chasing thugged out men and trying to go for that BA, or BS degree... the two don't go together.

from a topic posted here on aa.org prior to your arrival the following is stated:

Black males are graduating from high school at rates equal to whites, but many are choosing not to enroll in college. Many join the military or go straight into the work force. And others get caught up in the criminal justice system - where they make up 47 percent of the prison population.

That makes things tough on black female college students and graduates who are looking for a mate with those of a similar educational background, says Robert Billingham, an associate professor of human development at Indiana University.


dating/relationships-black men and white women


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994
quote:
Originally posted by Nykkii:
RR--to your census points about how much men earn over women with degree's and advanced degree's--that's nothing new, and it wasn't Faheem's point.

**He was eluding to 'success'/'success level'. What can be more 'successful' than earning more money?? I'm still waiting for HIS reply. **


Faheem said _With the number of Black women in college versus the number of brothers in college you have to be confused. Black women out number us in colleges, in corporate jobs and in many other professional fields._ his point being there are more black women getting higher educations than there are black males--not that black women earn more than black men. (were you doing some creative reading?)

**Nope, again, 'depends how you look at it' as i said. Why is it that the top 50 black CEO/CFOs only has TWO blk women listed?? 48 black men are in the top 50. Like I said, you and he are confusing secreataries and HR dept employees with upper board members. Re-read my post to him. I am still waiting for a reply from HIM


and for the sistah's getting higher educations--it's highly unlikely that they are chasing thugged out men and trying to go for that BA, or BS degree...

**Please visit a college party at a Blk college or a black party at a white college. You'll notice VERY few blk women dating other college students. I guess reality is too much for some people. Read about Kemba Smith and her time at Hampton University...that's much more common than you know



from a topic posted here on aa.org prior to your arrival the following is stated:

Black males are graduating from high school at rates equal to whites, but many are choosing not to enroll in college. Many join the military or go straight into the work force. And others get caught up in the criminal justice system - where they make up 47 percent of the prison population.

**Blk men also are over representated in the military [in comparsion to their overall pops]. I posted a stat earlier that showed that 85% of long time crminials come from single parent homes.


That makes things tough on black female college students and graduates who are looking for a mate with those of a similar educational background, says Robert Billingham, an associate professor of human development at Indiana University.

***They don't date these guys while they are in college [other races of women do this and marry soon after college], so that PROVES that they do NOT want them!!! ..that's my point i made about not wanting to grow with a bruh on the rise, but as soon as ray-ray and poochie knocks them up, the first man they want is a 'good man with education'...but her history shows that she never wanted that guy before...why now?? Oh yeah, she is looking for a 'savior'. If they were attracted to educated men, they would have dated them then. Plus, Black women have the lowest marriage rate of all women in America, yet the highest Outof wedlock birthrates, these are simple FACTS, which help disprove the point you are trying to express. It's not HATE, just the TRUTH. Why is it that women of other races date men in college and have higher marriage rates?? I think this is a Blk women's problem. You don't see white female Ivy league college grads dating and marrying trailer park / white trash in hopes of 'keeping it real' or 'changing bad boys to good men' do you?? Why do so many interracial couples [blk men and other women] form in college?? I suspect it is do the the fact that blk women at that age prefer thugs/bad boys and the black college men are very single and available. Judging by your quote, the author is assuming that blk women in college would be willing to date a man of equal status, that's simply bull - ish..and that is easily PROVEN by the original topic starter and his story, which is repeated time and time again**

https://www.africanamerica.org/groupee/forums?a=tpc&s=60260642&f=16970854&m=734607327&r=906607448#906607448


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994



***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!

[This message was edited by RadioRaheem on August 03, 2003 at 10:07 AM.]
rr-

"You'll notice VERY few blk women dating other college students. " and "*They don't date these guys while they are in college, so they PROVE that they do NOT wantthem!!!"


if you see single black women on college campuses it's becuase there are VERY FEW black men to choose from!!! how many times does it have to be said to you?

from the article:
"The strip through the campus of Clark Atlanta University looks like a fashion runway, even at 8 a.m.

Young women walk by in tight skirts, designer tops, high heels and makeup _ looking like they're going to a club instead of calculus.

But when you're at a school with nearly 3,600 women and only 1,500 men, some women don't want to miss an opportunity to look their best and catch the eyes of some of the campus' high-demand males.

Around the country, colleges are becoming increasingly more female, but the imbalance is even greater at historically black colleges such as Clark, which is 71 percent women.

Some students say it creates a campus culture in which women desperately try to attract college-educated black males, and men act like commitment-phobic "dawgs" because they can pick and choose from a surplus of women."

this surplus of women end up being the college educated women in the workforce--who are single and still interested in a black man of equal stature.

(FAHEEM CORRECT THIS BROTHA PLEASE!)

comparing an HR Secretary to a CEO of a company is not the point.
the point is--there are more of us--single educated black females out there than there are single educated black males.
it's not "how you look at it", it's a fact--no need to try to read anything into the comment, and take it to a different level--it is what it is.

i could easily compare what black CEO of companies make to white CEO's make. but that comparison doesn't mean there are equal numbers of black CEO's and white CEO's--your angle is flawed.

I've seen you post this diatribe a few times on AA.org:
"not wanting to grow with a bruh on the rise, but as soon as ray-ray and poochie knocks them up, the first man they want is a 'good man with education'...but her history shows that she never wanted that guy before...why now?? Oh yeah, she is looking for a 'savior'. "

because you say it repeatedly this to me sounds like a personal issue RR--and sorry for you if it is. no one like rejection, and to see someone you're really interested in turn you down for a thug, or even worse if a man gets rejected for a woman..but if it's personal--don't try to paint that picture on ALL black women. it's not the case.

my sister attended and graduated SUMA CUM LAUDE from Clark Atlanta. She has MANY MANY black female friends who also attended and graduated--who are all still single...not chasing thugs. The men at Clark were doggish as the article describes because they had the ability to be that way. They were the commodity everyone wanted and the supply was low. I witnessed this with my own eyes.

were any of the females my sister held as friends/roomates thug chasers--no. the college is right smack dab in the middle of the hood--thugs all around--but the few who did date--dated black men from Morehouse, from Clark and from other neighboring schools--men who were doing something with their lives--on the rise, as you put it.
i'm not sure where you get your statistics on the racial makeup of marriages that come from college dating..and what colleges you're referring to. At a school like Clark it's kind of hard to have the highest percent of marriages be black men/non black women.

back to advising Detroit...as I always say--look in the mirror first to see if you see anything that needs adjustment. Its always better to evaluate YOURSELF before you place the blame on others.
Think about the kinds of things you like doing--and if you'd like to meet someone who likes similar things. put yourself in a position to make that happen.

it's like this--if you want a woman who doesn't drink, or curse, or smoke--then you can't hang out in a dark smoky poolhall expecting to meet the woman you're interested in.




------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994


[This message was edited by Nykkii on August 03, 2003 at 10:39 AM.]
quote:
Originally posted by Nykkii:
as a sistah who is together, good job, education, independent, taking care of her business and not interested in a dating world according to RR--it frustrates and pains me to see black men saying they have difficulty meeting black women.
**Black women are the most unapproachable women of them all. Ask any woman how many men she has rejected, and you'll hear about the large onumber she turned down, kinda in a 'badge of honor' kinda way. She is thriving off of the 'rejection' she handed out.**

over and over and over again on this board i've put a call out to my sisters to take a look in the mirror at what it is we're doing to ourselves and our fellow sisters. what attitudes are we portraying, why the lack of support for our black men and then the complaining that brotha man isn't here for us?

**I've noted this in that past, and would like to thank you for that honesty. Please note that others on this board instantly rejected your comments on that, i guess you were talking to deaf ears.**


i for one am single and attractive and have a difficult time with the black men in my area--they all seem to be siblings of RR.

**I have a sister, and some frat bros., I doubt that are all in lock in step with me, but we all all different Big Grin**


i've done nothing wrong, but feel as if i'm being punished for all the chicken head sistahs out there. black men don't want black women--period. that is the message i get, and the message im reading here.

**not truly so. I'd say blk men do not want the blk woman in her current form. It's too easy for blk women to 'list' the type of men they want, but it's very hard for them to 'learn' to the type of women men want.**


its almost as if a black man has one too many bad experiences, and he crosses over. why??? **Blk women do the same thing...also, dating is a 'personal' choice, not a 'political' one**


dating, relationships, love is all about meeting enough people until you meet the right one and things fall into place. it should be about having a foundational criteria (black woman, educated, single, kids or no kids, a physical requirement if that's important to you, religious affiliation, etc) for what you think will work for you in a mate and sticking with that until you find the right one.
**between blk women and blk men, which group does the most 'listing of critieria'??? have you even listened to single blk women talk about desiriable men??**


it shouldn't be about trying this or that until you're fed up and then trying something else--how will you ever know that the 'right one' wasn't the next one--if you're open to anything?

**that's life**


it's almost like mining for diamonds..you have to pick an area and work that area...turn over tons of rocks, dig until your arms are sore..but once you find the diamond--its all worth it. you don't dig sporatically all over the mountain hoping to find the diamond...

**Or go to a different area and find a 'diamond' in less rough Wink and less painful after effects***

im venting, and i apologize for doing so on brotha detroits call for advice, i just wanted him to know we are NOT all like the women he's incountered. as a single black woman who has so much to offer a black man, it's frustrating to read things from people like RR, or hear that black men have now traded us for women of international descent. where does that leave women like me?? im not the only one like me out there.

**no 'trades' have taken place. What you may not understand is that blk men get approached all the time by women of other races. At bus stops, stores, bars, gyms, community events, movie therathes, cafes, libraries, schools, college, grad school, etc, etc etc..all the time. There is a sports bar in my town that is notorious for this. In fact, the first three or four times I went there, some woman of 'other' races, bought my drink before i could buy it. How many blk women arethat bold?? By buying my drink, i was forced to thank them. A convo starter, huh?? Black women rarely approach a bruh, even if he is her 'dream man'. We discussed earlier about that 'sit and wait'. It's a wonder any black woman ever gets a date like this Confused . Women of other races, when single, have little problem with introducing themselves to men and so they get to date men that they approach and men thaat approach them. Blk women usually only getto date the men thatapproach them. That why so many are single for so long, they are just 'sitting and waiting'...Since they do this, they must only get those men that are attracted to them and interested in them and will reject those that they don't want. That's the ignored reality of the black woman's dating life. When black women start making up bogus stats about 'the ratio of single blk women to black men in the DC area is 25 to 1'..you can see the 'sugar pill' effect going on. If the ratio was 20 to 1 or 25 to 1 or 15 to 1, why doesn't the census show this??? For DC the census showed a number very much near 50/50 and this number, ironically was the same for white women/men in the US pops. the same ratio. I think, like you've said, blk women need to look in the mirror and 're-work' the game...and adjust/adapt to the dating world.


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994


[This message was edited by Nykkii on August 02, 2003 at 11:31 PM.]



***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
quote:
Originally posted by Nykkii:
rr-

"You'll notice VERY few blk women dating other college students. " and "*They don't date these guys while they are in college, so they PROVE that they do NOT wantthem!!!"


if you see single black women on college campuses it's becuase there are _VERY FEW black men to choose from!!!_ how many times does it have to be said to you?
****Is that why they date the local drug dealers with the shiny cars??? I don't think that makes any sense...why are those college guys single?? You assumption would mean that those guys are overwhelmed with dates/attention while in college, not so. Please visit a college near you and see for yourself.***


from the article:
"The strip through the campus of Clark Atlanta University looks like a fashion runway, even at 8 a.m.

Young women walk by in tight skirts, designer tops, high heels and makeup _ looking like they're going to a club instead of calculus.

But when you're at a school with nearly 3,600 women and only 1,500 men, some women don't want to miss an opportunity to look their best and catch the eyes of some of the campus' high-demand males.

_Around the country, colleges are becoming increasingly more female, but the imbalance is even greater at historically black colleges such as Clark, which is 71 percent women._

Some students say it creates a campus culture in which women desperately try to attract college-educated black males, and men act like commitment-phobic "dawgs" because they can pick and choose from a surplus of women."

this surplus of women end up being the college educated women in the workforce--who are single and still interested in a black man of equal stature.

(FAHEEM CORRECT THIS BROTHA PLEASE!)

**Clark atlant is not a first rate college, sad to report, and school like that simply don't have the part time coursework or the althetic depts that are much more attractive to many tomost blk men. Many of our military soldiers, use part time 'distance' learning to get there degrees while serving our interests over seas. The military pays for these programs, but most only at FEDERALLY FUNDED, STATE RUN colleges, I believe CAU is private...right??


comparing an HR Secretary to a CEO of a company is not the point.
**Yes it is , he spoke about the large number of blk women. So a company like AOL with three Blk men as board members, may have only a few blk men there, yet dozens of blk women, which include administrative asst. and HR dept workers. He is talking about NUMBERS, please re-read his post.**

the point is--there are more of us--single educated black females out there than there are single educated black males.
it's not "how you look at it", it's a fact--no need to try to read anything into the comment, and take it to a different level--it is what it is.

**First, you are running off of a bad assumption. The assumption that people shouldpair up according to educational level. Ask some college professor and medical doctors, the level of their wives education. You'll be suprised how many of their wives are just high school grads. My dentist met his wife while she was a waitress in community college. She never finished that education and married a dentist 30+ years ago. Again, if this was a concern for blk women, they would have date a college student when they were college students. The end reult, there are alot of single educated blk men dating and marrying other colors Wink

i could easily compare what black CEO of companies make to white CEO's make. but that comparison doesn't mean there are equal numbers of black CEO's and white CEO's--your angle is flawed.
**Not flawed, it's like this. If you say that blk women 'outnumber' blk men in corporations, that's a flawed point when you examine it like i did. If you have two blk CFOs are IBM or something and you have 35 blk women in HR and as administrative assts....you are basicially saying that number overrules status. With that logic, you could say that the migrants [hispanics mostly] are dominiating that same company because the janitorial and landscapers out number any other racial group in that company. Status matters, that's the point Faheem tried to make, it was just baseless**

back to advising Detroit....
**I gave him dvice he could use RIGHT NOW. Your points hold little weight, because they have already been tried and failed for him. I want that bruh to find the love he wants in the world, I just adviced him to open his mind and heart to the diversity of women in the world..Big Grin



------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994



***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
first let me apologize to Detroit for sliding off his topic-but this has to be said.

RadioRaheem...

what you've described is very close to what I see and hear on a consistent basis in my area of the country. the black men I have as friends say the same things you do "blk men get approached all the time by women of other races. At bus stops, stores, bars, gyms, community events, movie therathes, cafes, libraries, schools, college, grad school, etc, etc etc..all the time."
it's obvious that the BLACK MAN in all his thugged out, rich athletic, college educated glory has become the trendy thing to have -- and non-black women are doing whatever they have to do to get themselves one.
Again i will say--if it's love and it's real--no one can or should say anything to stop it. but when you can see it--like bread rising--to be something else other than love, then it's difficult not to call it out.
if our black man has become the thing to have--he's sitting pretty. he's got 'all' the women of the world at his feet..buying and vying for his attention. he can pick and choose who he wants to be with--if he's that moldable.

i had a quote as my signiture here on aa.org a while ago that said--"those who stand for nothing fall for anything" and i see that in play here with the way you describe your local sports bar situation.

the black man who will stand up for his sister isn't a moldable man who will follow suzie down the rabit hole because she bought him a drink. he won't even go to that "spot that's notorious for it" for free drinks or easy azz--because he knows his sister most likely won't be there, and if she is"”either he or she's got to go through a lot of suzie's to get to hook up.

it may be about some sister's 'sitting and waiting', because some of us we were taught that an aggressive woman is seen as a desparate woman, or a woman with no morals. Some of us have upbringings that may have us at a disadvantage for your sports bar situation"”and if that's the case"”women like this are most likely not there in the first place.

there are also confident black women out there who don't have a problem approaching a man, calling a man and setting up a date--and paying for it. These are the black women who get labeled "too independent" the comments get made about her ˜not needing a man', because she has the ability to take care of herself.

So to get back to our trendy black man of the moment"”what is a sistah suppose to do? Stop being confident, or get more confident? I'm not talking about the black women who are in need of thug-love"”they are another discussion. I'm talking about the black women who like yourself are on the rise, or who have accomplished things in their lives.
I know one thing-- i'll be damned if that black women will have to resort to running in front of suzie to get your attention! as your sisters-- we are the women who have the ability to move this race forward. the women who have the ability (shown through history) to support you through whatever. and you (black man) are turning your backs on us because suzie buys you a drink first or is all up in your face at the bus stop. how sad. if you are so shallow, and your head so easily turned then not only is dating made difficult, but our whole race is in trouble.

how did our black men end up like this? when did the strength my father and grandfathers had turn into the such a sad lot of men who are following a pied piper in droves to who knows where. as long as she makes things easy, (less rough, less painful after effects) you'll follow her -- nose wide open.

i wonder how things will look once you get to Suzie's destination. if in 20 yrs things will still be so easy? if Suzie will support you and have your back through any situation in this racist world? if one day you'll wake up and wonder where your sister's are? the power of a black woman is nothing to mess with--who knows what we'll create, or alternatives we'll come up with to take your place. you see--i try to always see the big picture, while some of you are looking at the free drink in front of you.


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994


[This message was edited by Nykkii on August 03, 2003 at 11:44 AM.]
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

**He was eluding to 'success'/'success level'. What can be more 'successful' than earning more money?? I'm still waiting for HIS reply. **




I'm not sure that I would equate "success" with "income level". For example, in many fields, continuing on in graduate school to atain a PhD, after recieving a MA or BA is likely to restrict your employment opportunities to acedemia, thereby potentially reducing your income. Does that make you less successful?

Without addressing just what constitutes success for an individual, I think that it is undeniable that for the social and economic health for any community, it is every bit as important, for example, to have a critical mass in the universities as it is to have a critical mass in buisiness and industry, even at the expense of decreasing "average incomes".

BTW, just where do these averages come from? Am I really supposed to be making $97K a year, as one of those tables claims???!!! Eek Damn!


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


quote:
Originally posted by Nykkii:
first let me apologize to Detroit for sliding off his topic-but this has to be said.

RadioRaheem...

what you've described is very close to what I see and hear on a consistent basis in my area of the country. the black men I have as friends say the same things you do "blk men get approached all the time by women of other races. At bus stops, stores, bars, gyms, community events, movie therathes, cafes, libraries, schools, college, grad school, etc, etc etc..all the time."
it's obvious that the BLACK MAN in all his thugged out, rich athletic, college educated glory has become the trendy thing to have -- and non-black women are doing whatever they have to do to get themselves one.

**I think you've missed the point. I will re-state it. Women of other races hold a strong respect and desire for 'educated' men....race is not that important to many of them. They like professional men, and they mean it...not like Blk women and their 'standards' around age 35+ or so.***

Again i will say--if it's love and it's real--no one can or should say anything to stop it. but when you can see it--like bread rising--to be something else other than love, then it's difficult not to call it out.

**how do you know if it is something other than love?? can you tell this by walking down the street and looking at a blk male with an other race female?? I don't think you can***


if our black man has become the thing to have--he's sitting pretty. he's got 'all' the women of the world at his feet..buying and vying for his attention. he can pick and choose who he wants to be with--if he's that moldable.

**But notice, as i have stated, that guy is one that is very polished, educated, etc...those qualities that many to most young blk women don't want.**


i had a quote as my signiture here on aa.org a while ago that said--"those who stand for nothing fall for anything" and i see that in play here with the way you describe your local sports bar situation.

**The local sports bar is an example of the 'attention' that black women do not give, like i said rarely to black women approach anyone...so if that dude doesn't approach them, then they will never meet. that's one of the many reasons why so many blk women are dateless**


the black man who will stand up for his sister isn't a moldable man who will follow suzie down the rabit hole because she bought him a drink. he won't even go to that "spot that's notorious for it" for free drinks or easy azz--because he knows his sister most likely won't be there, and if she is"”either he or she's got to go through a lot of suzie's to get to hook up.

**i guess that is where we will disagree. If a whatever color woman introduces herself to me...what should i do?? esp. if sistah soulja is playing hard to get. That club I spoke of, has a large blk women regular group, they just 'sit and wait'..bitterly I might add***


it may be about some sister's 'sitting and waiting', because some of us we were taught that an aggressive woman is seen as a desparate woman, or a woman with no morals.

**Blk women have the highest out of wedlock births, not really a point from which you can call that group 'moral'. Maybe that 'sit and wait' style is not a good one, esp do to its ineffectiveness.


Some of us have upbringings that may have us at a disadvantage for your sports bar situation"”and if that's the case"”women like this are most likely not there in the first place.

**I also added gyms and community events, those COULD HAVE BEEN good meeting places, if the sisters showed up and didn't just wait around for 'mr. right'**

there are also confident black women out there who don't have a problem approaching a man, calling a man and setting up a date--and paying for it. These are the black women who get labeled "too independent" the comments get made about her ˜not needing a man', because she has the ability to take care of herself.

**That's a small minority. Plus, if she 'didn't need a man...why complain about not having a date?? seems contradictory, eh??**

So to get back to our trendy black man of the moment"”what is a sistah suppose to do?

**Meet as many men as possible, consider dating a man in college, considering dating a man on the rise, or just avoid the bad boy fetish...all of these thing could help her out in finding that mate IMHO***


Stop being confident, or get more confident?
**more**

I'm not talking about the black women who are in need of thug-love"”they are another discussion. **That's what detriot1 and i are speaking of**

I'm talking about the black women who like yourself are on the rise, or who have accomplished things in their lives.
**where r they?? again, another minority**


I know one thing-- i'll be damned if that black women will have to resort to running in front of suzie to get your attention!
**she is a free agent too. If 'suzy', whoever that is, is desireable, attitude free, drama free, etc and sistergurl is not, what is a brother to do?? The sister just isn't the top choice...which is perfectly fine, cuz it's not about skin color Big Grin


as your sisters-- we are the women who have the ability to move this race forward. the women who have the ability (shown through history) to support you through whatever.
**except college and dates, let's not forget the topic at hand here!!!***


and you (black man) are turning your backs on us because suzie buys you a drink first or is all up in your face at the bus stop.
**The blk man owes the blk woman no extra attention/dates/hellos/dances at the club/..NOTHING!!! maybe you should encourage blk women to stop playing so many games**


how sad. if you are so shallow, and your head so easily turned then not only is dating made difficult, but our whole race is in trouble.

**I think the race is in more trouble when the educated blk woman prefers men from State PENN over those at PENN STATE!! First thing first**


how did our black men end up like this? when did the strength my father and grandfathers had turn into the such a sad lot of men who are following a pied piper in droves to who knows where. as long as she makes things easy, (less rough, less painful after effects) you'll follow her -- nose wide open.
**when did the black woman end up like this?? I mean dating criminals over educated, positive males and then having the nerve to complain about it?? how foolish!!**


i wonder how things will look once you get to Suzie's destination. if in 20 yrs things will still be so easy? if Suzie will support you and have your back through any situation in this racist world?

**i don't know about suzy, but it is proven that ms. educated sistergurl aint got my back, so waiting on her to help a bruh out, my 'back' will have no backing.


if one day you'll wake up and wonder where your sister's are? the power of a black woman is nothing to mess with--who knows what we'll create, or alternatives we'll come up with to take your place.
**sounds like the first stone thrown in some imaginary 'race war'. I hope you win this war you are dreaming up. Me personally, I thikn things are 'just fine' with most people of most racial groups in the US of A...when does this war officially start?? it'll be entertaining Big Grin ***

you see--i try to always see the big picture, while some of you are looking at the free drink in front of you.

**big picture...let me see...bruh A is a physics major at the big university, he is an honor student and will most definately graduate with good grades and is on the speed train to a 'good life'...bruh B is a crack saleman in and out of jail and has two babymommas, never married and dropped out of high school, has a shiny car...and carries a gun for 'protection'...which one would a 'strong, educted, independent nubian' Black queen to date?? ...she is choosing bruh B now...and dreaming about bruh A when he gets that degree and first job. This, much like your rant, makes no sense!!!



P.S. I can buy my own drinks, 'suzy' is just trying to open the lines of convo with a total stranger...sister gurl should take notes!!! Wink


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994


[This message was edited by Nykkii on August 03, 2003 at 11:44 AM.]



***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
quote:
Originally posted by ricardomath:
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

**He was eluding to 'success'/'success level'. What can be more 'successful' than earning more money?? I'm still waiting for HIS reply. **




I'm not sure that I would equate "success" with "income level". For example, in many fields, continuing on in graduate school to atain a PhD, after recieving a MA or BA is likely to restrict your employment opportunities to acedemia, thereby potentially reducing your income. Does that make you less successful?

Without addressing just what constitutes success for an individual, I think that it is undeniable that for the social and economic health for any community, it is every bit as important, for example, to have a critical mass in the universities as it is to have a critical mass in buisiness and industry, even at the expense of decreasing "average incomes".

BTW, just where do these averages come from? Am I really supposed to be making $97K a year, as one of those tables claims???!!! Eek Damn!


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


http://www.plowsharesactions.org/
http://www.nonviolence.org/nukeresister/
http://www.soaw.org/






those are 'averages' based off of census reports. The average includes people with all degrees and even those with degrees that they don't use, i.e. policemen with chemistry degrees or aerobic instructors with Art history Master's degrees. I used those 'facts' to show that black men outearn blk women and all that talk about black male worthlessness in the market place, not true. The additional information about the top 50 CEOs shows that blk men are more likely to lead a company than a blk woman, not just work the mail room. The reporting of these facts slaps the ignorance that is frequently reported by the many blk women about 'corporate' america. Just stating facts, if that is allowed to be posted here Wink

***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

I'm not talking about the black women who are in need of thug-love"”they are another discussion. **That's what detriot1 and i are speaking of**




That's certianly what you are talking about. I went back and skimmed through Detroit1's posts in this thread, and couldn't find any comment that could remotely be interpreted as refering to "thug-love", so unless I missed one of his posts (which is a possibility-I counted two), he's talking about something else.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

those are 'averages' based off of census reports.


Actually, I surmised that. It was a rhetorical question. My point is that there is more to "success" than income.

And as to your point that there are more male CEO's than female CEO's, all I have to say is, "What else is new?"

I'm sure that the gender differences are just as lopsided for white men/women CEO's.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


"big picture...let me see...bruh A is a physics major at the big university, he is an honor student and will most definately graduate with good grades and is on the speed train to a 'good life'...bruh B is a crack saleman in and out of jail and has two babymommas, never married and dropped out of high school, has a shiny car...and carries a gun for 'protection'...which one would a 'strong, educted, independent nubian' Black queen to date?? ...she is choosing bruh B now...and dreaming about bruh A when he gets that degree and first job."

bigger picture--


if bruah A would pull his head out of his own ass long enough to get over the fact that oNE woman dumped him for a thug--he'd see there are plenty of other educated black women out there--but instead bruah A chooses to take the easier route and follow a Suzie who pays him a little bit of attention, buys him a drink and strokes his itty bitty ego. his decision is equally as damaging to SISTAH A who finished school, has the good job and is approaching brotha's like bruah A to only get turned away because they've run to the arms of suzie.


SISTAH A's (we are NOT few in number) stay strong in their belief in the true Brotha's that are out there--the one's who aren't weak, the one's who don't turn their backs on us. like my sig used to say--it's about believing in something--standing up for something, not just taking whatever is thrown in front of you face. i dont care if every nationality under the sun approaches you--if you believe in your people, if it's your choice to have a mate of your race--then you don't get twisted in the wind because a drink is bought for you--or a hello is given at the gym. im all for making friends, learning about other cultures, but when it comes to giving my heart--i stick with what i believe in--maybe that's the issue: you don't have a believe in anything when it comes to your race.

"If 'suzy', whoever that is, is desireable, attitude free, drama free, etc and sistergurl is not, what is a brother to do??" ***what if sistergirl is desireable, attitude free, and drama free?? what then?
"The sister just isn't the top choice..." *why isn't she?*

also-are you trying to say the precentage of educated, together, accomplished black women dating men in prison, is higher than those who are single and looking? please show me that "fact".

you telling detroit to "fall for anything" is wrong in my opinion--he's obviously stating that he's interested in BLACK WOMEN but doesn't understand what's up with the attitudes he's preceiving. that doesn't mean he should run for the white women--it means we need to help him gain an understanding (if possible) and help him figure out what he can do to make a postive connection with a sistah.


and...the "independant, can take care of herself, doesn't need a man" labels are what are PUT ON US-those of us who are confident and aren't afraid to approach and pay for things.

you said how contridictory--why would she need a date if she doesn't need a man--you mis-read it. we get told we don't need a man because we aren't damsiles in distress--men seem to think those are the only women who need men, the one's crying for help or like you said the one's looking for saviours. if she's approaching you--buying you dinner, making conversation--she's no different than the Suzie's you love so much--except she's a sistah.

Radio-out of tune-Raheem...you are ONE man with ONE opinion. an opinion that is so out of tune--i can't hear you anymore--it's all just fuzzy irritating static. we have disagreed before, and we'll continue to disagree--but I can't let you paint the picture that we're all evil, dramatic, hatful, golddigging, thug-loving women. 25-35--there are many, many (not the minority) black women who are the exact opposite of the ones you've met and had relationships with. again, i'm sorry your experiences have left you so jaded, but we're not all the same.

thank you ricardomath for pointing out obvious blunders in RR's points.


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994
quote:
Originally posted by ricardomath:
quote:
Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

those are 'averages' based off of census reports.


Actually, I surmised that. It was a rhetorical question. My point is that there is more to "success" than income.

And as to your point that there are more male CEO's than female CEO's, all I have to say is, "What else is new?"

I'm sure that the gender differences are just as lopsided for white men/women CEO's.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...",
¡Ay, Dios!

Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja


http://www.plowsharesactions.org/
http://www.nonviolence.org/nukeresister/
http://www.soaw.org/





agreed. The point was that there are more BLACK MALE CFO/CEOs in the top 50 than BLK FEMALE CEO/CFOs...this is a truth that is often ignored by blk women that think that they are dominatitng the corporate world and 'leaving' the blk males behind. This often leads to the thought that this is why blk women professionals are manless. However, blk men outearn blk women and run more top companies than blk women. The point was brought up to show how baseless faheem and nykkii point of view was. I'm still waiting for a proper reply from either with a statistical/factual backing. I guess i'll be an OLDER man by that time. Big Grin I was just posting the truth for the non believers out there Wink

***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!

[This message was edited by RadioRaheem on August 03, 2003 at 06:55 PM.]
quote:
Originally posted by Nykkii:
"big picture...let me see...bruh A is a physics major at the big university, he is an honor student and will most definately graduate with good grades and is on the speed train to a 'good life'...bruh B is a crack saleman in and out of jail and has two babymommas, never married and dropped out of high school, has a shiny car...and carries a gun for 'protection'...which one would a 'strong, educted, independent nubian' Black queen to date?? ...she is choosing bruh B now...and dreaming about bruh A when he gets that degree and first job."

bigger picture--


if bruah A would pull his head out of his own ass long enough to get over the fact that oNE woman dumped him for a thug--he'd see there are plenty of other educated black women out there--but instead bruah A chooses to take the easier route and follow a Suzie who pays him a little bit of attention, buys him a drink and strokes his itty bitty ego. his decision is equally as damaging to SISTAH A who finished school, has the good job and is approaching brotha's like bruah A to only get turned away because they've run to the arms of suzie.

**That was the true story, as told by Kemba smith in the now defunked Emerge Magazine...it was non fiction. Not make-believe, but just an example of what i was saying above. You see, Kemba smith didn't date a physics engineering major because he was 'too boring', chose to date a kingpin and got sentenced to over 20 years in prison because he assisted a criminal. Please do a net search of her name and learn more. She was pardoned from jail during the last days of the Clinton administration and is now a motivational speaker encouraging blk women/girl to stop dating thugs...which begs the question...why do blk women need to be told that dating thugs is wrong?? I guess common sense ins't...right??***


SISTAH A's (we are NOT few in number) stay strong in their belief in the true Brotha's that are out there--the one's who aren't weak, the one's who don't turn their backs on us.


**Again, blk men don't owe blk women dates. Black women don't owe blk men dates. Imagine if every blk man that ask you out you HAD to date them, whether you liked them or not...according to your logic all unemploymed, homeless men with the confidence to ask you out would get a date with you. You prolly wouldn't like that too much would you?? you got 'standards' right?? so do blk men...and BTW that is not a 'weakness' just a 'personal preference' he is using!!!***


like my sig used to say--it's about believing in something--standing up for something, not just taking whatever is thrown in front of you face. i dont care if every nationality under the sun approaches you--if you believe in your people, if it's your choice to have a mate of your race--then you don't get twisted in the wind because a drink is bought for you--or a hello is given at the gym.

**please add in that blk women at the same time play games...and you will officially have goten my point. If i have to make the first move to EVERY blk woman that i'm interested in or we will never meet, thaen it's MY CHOICE if she is desireable to ME. Is she overweight?? ugly?? attitude issues?? If i'm not attracted to those things, then i'm not likely to talk to her. If she approaches me, then I guess i should at least hear her out. That's the 'fairness' that you are missing. Blk women COULD do the same things that the 'other' women do, but she does not...why?? I don't know...again, it's more than just a drink or a random question like 'what's your favorite football team??'..it's an introduction to meeting someone and changing the reality of being without a boyfriend that 'other' women do. they are just more bold...nothing ventured, nothing gained Big Grin ***


im all for making friends, learning about other cultures, but when it comes to giving my heart--i stick with what i believe in--maybe that's the issue: you don't have a believe in anything when it comes to your race.

**I guess i somewhat agree here, to each his/her own**


"If 'suzy', whoever that is, is desireable, attitude free, drama free, etc and sistergurl is not, what is a brother to do??" ***what if sistergirl is desireable, attitude free, and drama free?? what then?

**I'd have to put in the total effort to meet her and see for myself, right?? remember most blk women are 'sit and wait' types and unapproachable by most men anyway..again the truth just put plainly***


"The sister just isn't the top choice..." *why isn't she?*

**I don't have any favorites, i'm a diversity dater, if a hispanic woman is more open to talk to me at the gym than a blk woman is, guess who i'll talk to***


also-are you trying to say the precentage of educated, together, accomplished black women dating men in prison, is higher than those who are single and looking? please show me that "fact".

**nope, never said that. What i'm saying is that hte college aged blk women love thugs and prefer them over the college ed bruh in their schools...when pochie knocks them up, like his other babymommas, she then looks for an educated bruh to fill the void...when he doesn't want a ex-con's babymomma, it's not because of her, it's because 'all blk men ain't ish'


you telling detroit to "fall for anything" is wrong in my opinion--he's obviously stating that he's interested in BLACK WOMEN but doesn't understand what's up with the attitudes he's preceiving.

**i explained the reality of what he was seeing and gave an alternative that would actually get him more dates and attention and possible love. Again, women of other races prefer educated men...they often define themselves by it, i.e. doctors' wife, first lady, etc...he's status is something that they are proud of, you can't say that about many blk women, esp for the elders of the community, but this topic is about the younger women in the community.



that doesn't mean he should run for the white women--it means we need to help him gain an understanding (if possible) and help him figure out what he can do to make a postive connection with a sistah.

**Ok i'll say it. I think you have a racial problem with white women. I'm beginning to believe this based off of this and your kobe posting...if this is not true, it sure appears that way...if it is true, i truly feel sorry for you. it's 2003, please drop the hatred!!!**


and...the "independant, can take care of herself, doesn't need a man" labels are what are PUT ON US-those of us who are confident and aren't afraid to approach and pay for things.

**Another minority. Please visit a local nightclub in your area and notice how blk women sit at the bar or stay in a huddle waiting to be approached. sometimes they wait all night long and never 'approach' anyone. I gues that's that 'upbringing' you were talking about. This must be the reason why so many blk women are so bitter about interracial dating...that's sad***


you said how contridictory--why would she need a date if she doesn't need a man--you mis-read it. we get told we don't need a man because we aren't damsiles in distress--men seem to think those are the only women who need men, the one's crying for help or like you said the one's looking for saviours. if she's approaching you--buying you dinner, making conversation--she's no different than the Suzie's you love so much--except she's a sistah.

**More white woman hate. Look, you can't hate on those that was thriving in the dating world. You need to learn from them. It's not about being 'needy' it's about being aggressive and knowing that you did all you could to get the love you wanted. What's the pointof blk women having high standards, yet putting no effort into meeting extra 'candidates' for your love?? Makes no sense...again, this is prolly why blk women are often single and single for long periods of time.***


Radio-out of tune-Raheem...you are ONE man with ONE opinion. an opinion that is so out of tune--i can't hear you anymore--it's all just fuzzy irritating static. we have disagreed before, and we'll continue to disagree--but I can't let you paint the picture that we're all evil, dramatic, hatful, golddigging, thug-loving women. 25-35--there are many, many (not the minority) black women who are the exact opposite of the ones you've met and had relationships with. again, i'm sorry your experiences have left you so jaded, but we're not all the same.


**You seem alittle bitter. I guess this strikes a nerve with you. Well, just know that if you love blk men, i mean really love blk men, that 'suzy' is not only approaching them and dating them, she is marrying them also. Isn't washington state the state with the highest interracial marriage rate?? or in the top three?? I guess your bitterness is derived from that. Again, just know that when you are growing old and gray and alone, it maybe your own fault. I mean, why didn't you say hi to that bruh at the gym or church?? Oh well, no matter, suzy got him now.


thank you ricardomath for pointing out obvious blunders in RR's points.

**actually, he agreed with me and if you re-read it you will see that...I guess your bitterness blocked your vision and common sense....

In closing, hatred is a disease, get well soon Big Grin


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"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994



***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
dang...did someone say something...? i thought i heard "kobe" and "white women"...static, nothing but static. Wink


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994
Hey, what ever happened to the starter of this post, where'd he go? Confused Maybe we scared him off.LOL

______________________________
May the high praises of YAH be in their mouth and a two edged sword in their hand, To execute vengence on the peoples;to bind their kings with chains,and their nobles in shackles of iron,to carry out the sentence written against them.
This is the glory of the saints (psalms149)
quote:
Originally posted by Nykkii:
dang...did someone say something...? i thought i heard "kobe" and "white women"...static, nothing but static. Wink


------------------------------
"Your playing small doesn't serve the world. There's nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is with in us. It's not just in some of us it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated form our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.

Nelson Mandela
Inaugural Speech, 1994



Thanks for the discussion Ms. ny-KKK-ii It was really nice hearing your views on the issue. Get well soon brosmile

***********************************************************

Who in the hell left the gate open??? Confused
Somebody put roots on me Frown


G.O.M.A.B., H.O.B.O., M.O.B., and B.B.H. Rules of life!!!
OMG... talk about side track. Couldn't read it all, got dizzy. So skipping issue altogether.

Detriot... Much love to ya. I once read, I believe in here somewhere, Someone else's rejection, is just God's protection. When you meet her, the one, you should probably thank your lucky stars that you were free and clear. I like to think of rejection as my natural filtering system, cuts alot of bullshyt and drama out. I use it in all areas of my life. Saves me time, energy and money!

Go visit this site.. http://www.happilysingle.com/whatishs.php?PHPSESSID=9c6aa969a7180d5b73f087c207897d8a .

This is what I know: 1) What you get back from relationships is a reflection of yourself and where you are at. 2) There is a bigger plan at work, leave it alone for a while, concentrate on you and the rest will reveal itself and come into being. 3) Do what you love and the rest will follow (that is where you will meet her). 4) Examine your life, if she showed up tomorrow, are you ready for her? 5) BTW, if you keep saying 'They don't show any interest in me' then they won't. You go to church... haven't they mentioned the 'You shall have what you say' part yet?. Watch your words, your attitude and your actions. Just know that she is comming and be grateful for it. Ask God, what is it you should be doing right now. Do that and all things will be added unto you.

She is probably watching you now, just waiting for the right moment to smile and say 'Hello' (is it me you are looking for?) Had to throw Lionel Richie in there Big Grin

and almost last... on a more drama note. If you are that good looking, they probably figure you have a girlfriend already.

My own story: I stopped, I just stopped. Didn't want to look, didn't care about it, was all set to become a hermit and concentrate on me and the things I wanted to accomplish. I swear to God, everytime I do that, one pops out of the woodwork, and the last time, the guy I am with now, literaly came out of thin air. Not that they all work out, but they have been meaningful, wonderful and a growing experience. All this to say, stop thinking about it. Don't think something is wrong with them or that something is wrong with you. Be patient, prepare yourself and she/they will come when the time is right.

La Femme Nkechi
...
Be the change in the world you want to see...it starts with you
I finally feel like posting again and I see Radio has run amuck: My apologies to brother Detroit1 for participating in the digression of this thread and thank you Nykkii for your comments in this thread. It is clear that you understood what I was saying while radio missed the point. I never mention earning power of Black men versus Black women. This is a male dominated society and though Black women are employed in numerous places Black men are not, they have to deal with the double ceiling (gender and race) versus the one ceiling Black men have to deal with. In a male dominated society women will not earn more than men period.

In a recent report done by Ellis Cole for Newsweek titled the Black Gender Gap, Ellis pointed out that 24 percent Black women, compared with 17 percent of black men have ascended to the professional-managerial class. In her study she spoke with numerous Black women who were at the top of their class in college, whom also seem to be facing the same problem as Brother Detroit1 is facing. The Black Gender gap is no myth it is a reality, those numbers from the Census confirms what I am saying here, using your statistics Black women are earning more college degrees than Black men, by a small percentage point. Working with that knowledge we can now see why it is important that brothers like Detroit1 date and marry Black women. We can see on most college campuses Black men cozying up to suzzy and other women while passing over the Black woman on campus and it is not due to her attraction to bad boys, it has more to do with her not being a weak woman.

There is no need for me to speak with 50% of Black women to know that they all want a good man, it is human nature to want your mate to be a good person. Although the drug dealer does not have a hard time getting women this is not a manifestation of Black women not being attracted to good brothers. This has everything to do with wanting things quick and easy. Men engaged in illegal business that brings tons of cash in never have a problem getting women and this is true for all men.

As you have said radio, what you believe is your reality and what I believe is my reality; however your reality has Black women painted in a way that hints at delusion on your part. If Black men and Black women face many of the same problems in this country, and are subjected to much of the same abuse, using your statistics proves that there are more than enough Black women out there without children for Brothers like Detroit1 and there is no need for him to look outside his community for a mate. The choice is ultimately his and I believe brother will make the right choice and ignore your corrupted view of Black women.

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When our most educated, and best prepared turn their back on our community, stagnation sets in and the men and women who are not the most educated and not the most prepared become the example for those coming behind them. It is up to those of us who are not rich and well off but are educated and prepared to educate our youth and prepare them for what they will face when entering the world.



More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem

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