quote:Originally posted by HeruStar:
So you've dismissed the Israelite attempt to steal the culture and destroy the people of Canaan as merely "cultural infighting".
Spiritual dispute? Is that all it was... a "spiritual dispute"? Hundreds of years of war over a "spiritual dispute"? You don't pull out the genocide stick over a "spiritual dispute". It would make sense if the Hebrews sought to convert other tribes, it would make even more sense if the Hebrew religion wasn't borrowed, it would make even more sense than that, if the Bible explained it as "cultural infighting over a spiritual dispute", BUT IT DOESN'T.
As a matter of fact, you've done more dismissing than you've done addressing. On historical accuracy, you dismissed the erroneous biblical portrayal of black spiritual beliefs as "not all blacks practiced the same beliefs". Huh? What the hell does that have to do with anything? Surely that's not your explanation for Jews portraying blacks as somehow culturally and spiritually inferior. That's your answer to ancestor veneration, and pretty much any attempt at explaining to you that blacks were doing more than carving images and worshipping them.
Heru I'm really not sure what point you are trying to make but different cultures of the same race have been fighting each other since the dawn of time over petty ethnic differences and yes over spiritual disputes also. Just look at the conflicts over their now between the Arabic Palastenians and the fake Ashkenazi Jews fighting over the land now even though it doesn't belong to either of them really. Concerning your little self righteous tirade about them pulling out the "genocide stick" you need to judge cultures by the standards of their time. It was not uncommon for ancient cultures to do things that would be disagreeable to your 21st century sensibilities. That goes for Black cultures to and it was not always "Asiatics" and "Europeans" doing the killing...you cited an istance were the Egyptians did the same thing when you said
"Pharaoh king of Egypt had attacked and captured Gezer. He had set it on fire. He killed its Canaanite inhabitants"
Because Egypt did this does that make it any less of a Black culture? This is the ISSUE we are dealing with whether or not the Hebrews were Black NOTHING ELSE so you can save your cultural critques for another thread
quote:Originally posted by HeruStar:
From my inferior point of view: The Jews were an undeveloped nomadic tribe who aspired to have their own land, their own culture, with their very on God. They would use this God as a scapegoat to break every standard that they set for themselves. Their God allowed them to "covet" another land, steal the culture, and kill the people. When they had to LIE in order to gain access to a land, they hid behind God's promise/plan. As an aside, THEY(the Hebrews) IDOLIZED the Canaanite (Black) culture, women, land, and belief system. These Black people were advanced beyond their comprehension and were HIGHLY admired. But... But... But... Their God was a "JEALOUS" God. They used that theme of Jealousy as a catalyst, that would propel them into any land that they set their nomadic footsies on, and as justification for genocide. Now to review, God said you can't lie, steal, kill, covet, or be jealous, but when you're doing it in my name, it's o.k.
NOT ONE SINGLE BLACK TRIBE USED GOD AS A SCAPEGOAT. NOT ONE.
If the Hebrews were successful at genocide, and they wiped out the Hittites, Jebusites, Canaanites, etc., next on the list of God's "promise" would've been the Nubians, Egyptians. But they never did tackle the smaller fish.
Again, that's just the way I see it.
So as far as historical accuracy goes, I'm left with a question, did the Hebrew tribe ever REALLY acquire/enjoy their land of milk and honey? When God "promised" a land of milk and honey, was the fact that the land would have no peace, apart of that "promise"?
Well your admittedly "inferior point of view" would be incorrect and if you know anything about the history of the ancient Hebrews you would understand that they failed to do any their established laws. Which ultimately resulted in those groups you're trying to defend i.e., the "Hittites, Jebusites, Canaanites, Assyrians and Babylonians" doing all those things you're speaking out against to them. You have to understand that back then it was in some cases kill or be killed afterall these were all warring states. The commandments that were put in place came about after the culture was established so of course the standards would be different. For example the commandment "Thou shalt not kill" actually means "Thou shalt not murder" the difference is during conflicts and war there is a TIME TO KILL but during peace you cannot kill/murder an innocent.
Again though what does all that have to do with whether or not the Hebrews were Black? We can debate the finer points of the Hebrew culture and whether or not they meet your sensibilites at another time...The purpose of THIS THREAD however is to establish the racial identity of the Hebrew so let's FOCUS on that...none of your statements address this point.