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Hi Black women check out this link it has tons of information on Black history and the women of antiquity.

The Black Madonna In Europe

"Black Madonna is a nickname used in Europe.
It refers to the skin tones of Mary and the baby Jesus. Mary, Jesus St Joseph lived in a hot arid climate.
Their skin tone would be dark brown
or olive in order to survive the intensity of the sun and avoid skin cancer.
It wasn't until the Renaissance that they begin to have paintings of Jesus and Mary with alabaster skin, blue eyes and blond hair.
Previously, all religious artwork reflected the olive skin, black or brown hair and eyes of the Holy Family and the Apostles"

[This message was edited by Prophetessofrage on November 06, 2003 at 07:07 AM.]
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Black women you'll also be able to click on this site which shows the very icons.

"The most sacred icons of the Catholic Church are the Black Madonna and Christ child, which are found in Europe's most venerated shrines and cathedrals. Each year, hundreds of thousands of European pilgrims ritually humble themselves before the image of Black Mary and her child Jesus at Black Madonna sites throughout France, Germany, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Portugal and other Catholic countries. Many Black Madonna statues have the black paint literally kissed off of their hands and feet. In Poland, the Church encourages believers to pray to the Black Madonna of Czestochowka every morning before rising. It is reported that Pope John Paul follows this ritual. Time Magazine (June 11, 1979) reported on Popelaul II's visit to Czestochowka's holiest shrine, which prominently displays "The Lady" known for centuries as the Black Madonna. At Our Lady of Koden (Poland), there are statues of white saints carrying pictures of Black Madonnas. Pilgrims throughout the ages have visited Black Madonna sites and left inspired, confident, relieved, or healed of their afflictions. Today, there are over 300 documented Black Madonna sites in France alone! 1 Sometimes they are hidden awaken vaults, while the public is shown Madonnas with European features.

The Oueen of the Pyrenees

In the hard-to-find classic, Anacalypsis, historian Godfrey Higgens writes, " all the Romish countries of Europe, in France, Italy, Germany, etc., the God Christ, as well as his mother, are described in their old pictures and statues to be black. The infant God in the arms of his black mother, his eyes and drapery white, is himself perfectly black. If the reader doubt my word, he may go to the cathedral at Moulins -to the famous chapel of the Virgin at Loretto ...the whiteness of the eyes and teeth, and the studied redness of the lips, are very observable... There is scarcely an old church in Italy where some remains of the worship of the BLACK VIRGIN and BLACK CHID are not to be met with. Very often the black figures have given way to white ones, and in these cases the black ones, as being held sacred, were put into retired places in the churches, but were not destroyed... 2

The Black Madonnas originally all had Africoid features before most of them were destroyed by iconoclasts. When they were replaced, the artists retained the dark skin color but, not being familiar with real Afrikans, gave European features to the paintings. In cases where originals have survived, you may witness Africoid features on Mary and her child Jesus, such as the Black Madonna of Nuria, Spain - called "the Queen of the Pyrenees." Russia's remarkable legacy of Black Madonnas and other Christian icons of dark skin is evidenced in the book, Russian Icons by Vladimir Ivanov, including the feature story of the Spring 1994 issue of Russian Life magazine, graced with a Black Madonna on its cover.

1) Watts, 22.
2) Higgens, v! 138

Actually the worship of the virgin, Black "Mother of God" with her God-begotten child, far predates Christianity and prevailed throughout the ancient world.

Goddess Ad (Isis) suckling
Her Holy Child Heru (Horus).

Historians recognize that the statue of the Egyptian Goddess Isis with her child Horus in her arms was the first Madonna and Child. They were renamed Mary and Jesus when Europe was forcibly Christianized. The worship of Isis and Horus was especially popular in ancient Rome. "Roman legions carried this figure of Black Isis holding the Black infant Horus all over Europe where shrines were established to her. So holy and venerate were these shrines that when Christianity invaded Europe, these figures of the Black Isis holding the Black Horus were not destroyed but turned into figures of the Black Madonna and Child. Today these are still the holiest shrines in Catholic Europe." 1 Titles such as Our Lady, The Great Mother, are the same titles attributed to Isis! The word "Madonna" itself is from mater domina, a title used for Isis! The month of May, which was dedicated to the heathen Virgin Mothers, is also the month Mary, the Christian Virgin. 2

The Fedorovo Virgin, a Black Madonna
icon of 18th century Russia

Incredulously, many contemporary white authors seem not to link or acknowledge the Black Madonna's color with her Afrikan origin,
although their ancestors did without hesitation. Some flatly deny any
racial connection. Instead, they come up with various reasons and sophisticated explanations (the "dark" phase of the moon, fertility of the earth, etc.) -any excuse except Melanin - to explain why the Lady is portrayed black.

This is evident in a number of books by white authors discussing Black Madonnas. Perhaps whites have become so enmeshed in the webs of false history woven by their predecessors that many are blind to the truth, unable to see or discern even glaring evidence of Afrikan historical presence. If white writers of today are indeed this ignorant - or pretending ignorance - of the Black Madonna's Afrikan origin, let them read the works of a few rare honest white scholars which preceded them, such as Gerald Massey, T.W. Doane, Godfrey Higgins and Kersey Graves. These writers knew and wrote the truth. This is amazing given the exceedingly overtly racist times in which they lived. Yet today, official white establishment does not and will not acknowledge the Afrikan genesis of their whitewashed religions.

In Bible Myths, T.W. Doane devotes a chapter to The Worship of the Virgin Mother, where he candidly states, "The whole secret of the fact of these early representations of the Virgin Mary and Jesus - so called-being black, crowned, and covered with jewels, is that they are of pre-Christian origin; they are Isis and Horus... baptized anew." "

Listen you, I'm going to make one last ditch effort in trying to reach your psychosis to make you quit this folly you are performing.

The Jesus that you claim you are over here COWARDLY INCOGNITO no less, to SHOOT ME DOWN for is nothing like YOU AND YOUR BEHAVIOR.

Jesus wouldn't STUPIDLY burst on the scene full of DEMONIC RAGE and think he/she or in your case, 'IT' is CHRIST LIKE when you look like a FOOL, ANGERED, STUPID, FOOL.

Secondly, JESUS would IDENTIFY HIMSELF whereas you are just some psycho, little moron who burst on this board strictly to attack me as you're OBSESSED WITH ME, AND ALL WHO LOOK IN SEE THAT AND THAT ALONE, WOULD MAKE ME THE WINNER, IF I WANTED TO 'DEBATE' WITH A MORON LIKE YOU OF WHICH I DON'T!

Thirdly, I will not DEBATE YOU EVER, BECAUSE YOU ARE A PSYCHOTIC, HATE-FILLED, MORON not able to SEE that you are blind, deaf and dumb.

You are not winning a debate, as I'M NOT READING YOUR GARBAGE I JUST SCROLL PASS IT!

I have repeatedly ask you to identify yourself as a GOOD CHRISTIAN WOULD but you continue to show yourself dense.

You think this is a game, I'm really telling you as a person you are a FOOL. I don't want to discourse with you and will you ARROGANTLY, DEMONICALLY, BURST ON THIS BOARD THINKING YOU ARE PUTTING ME DOWN, WHEN YOU ARE SIMPLY SHOWING YOURSELF A MORON?

You are an INSULT that's why I'm calling you what you are. Stupid, wierdo, goofy, because you're too stupid and arrogant to listen and think you are proving what by bursting on the scene strictly to attack the TRUTH AKA MY POSTS ALONE?


Your OBSESSION over communciating with me, can be ended if you will simply give your RACE AND GENDER like a CIVILIZED CHRISTIAN WOULD DO, YOU FOOL.

I know you won't follow this but for the young girls who will look in and read the TRUTH, they need to understand a specimen like you for the sickass you are. That's not an INSULT but a FACT that YOU ALONE ARE DISPLAYING.

By the way, I could drag your stupid ass all up and down the board for MORE funsy by putting up EVERY MAJOR BLACK SCHOLAR, PREACHER'S BOOK ON BLACK JESUS AND NATIONS AND YOUR STUPID ASS WOULD DO AS YOU DID ON THIS POST DENY IT, JUST AS BLACK PEOPLE WITH SENSE KNOW YOU WOULD. So proving who you are too cowardly to profess yourself to be.... Wink And who RESPECTS A COWARD BUT FELLOW COWARDS NOT WORTHY OF RESPECT.


Again, YOU stupidly tell on yourself, while COWARDLY refusing to be PERSON enough to IDENTIFY YOURSELF and in all these matters you think anyone in their right mind would call YOU a LOVING, TRUTHFUL FOLLOWER OF THE JESUS CHRIST who you allege you are over to SHOOT ME DOWN ABOUT? Get Real!

By the way, I'm over here as a BLACK WOMAN speaking the TRUTH with regard to BLACK WOMEN, that's why I'm addressing BLACK WOMEN....duh!


Now cease communicating with me. Get lost, take a hike, hit the road, I will not READ nor correspond with your LUNCACY.

The End!

P.S. In the post entitled 'AND THEY CAST TRUTH TO THE GROUND' I stated thus:"At any rate, the reason I thought to remind you of the significance of skillfully wielding the weapon of truth, even though I know you are wise enough to know it, is because now get this black women, the Caucasoid enemies of truth were so burned by the truth that they actually go about trying to imitate my skill. I am their would be teacher! The peons fools... . See I originally came online to encourage black women to wake-up and unite against our enemies within and without. Well, I learned of this ˜message board' circuit and began to speak. Lo and behold, who pops out on every single black site but angy-wangy white male devils, and their colored trained underlies"

Thanks for proving a HUMBLE woman like me TRUTHFUL AND CORRECT....and by the way, you get an 'F' for a bad imitation of TRUTH which had you SQUASHED like a bug in a rug, before you even got out of the gate....peon.... Razz

[This message was edited by Prophetessofrage on November 07, 2003 at 12:05 PM.]
Dear, dear Prophetess,

Isn't this just what you said over on your "Black Jesus of the Bible" thread?

And weren't you just as silly over there?

And you stil haven't said anything about these icons' late dates. They were made far too late for anyone to know what Jesus and Mary looked like, especially since their descriptions were not passed down to the next generation, let alone to the 500s and 600s when these icons first started appearing.

For earlier depictions of Jesus you can go to the Roman Empire and to the Byzantines and see there earlier icons of a white Jesus and Mary.

They aren't any more true than the black ones, of course, but it would show anyone (well, anyone with an ounce of truth in them) that the icons cannot be used as testimony to Jesus' color.

But I'll bet that you enjoy your hate. You certainly seem to hug it to yourself tightly and refuse to part with it. "It's my hate and you can't take it from me!"

Poor thing.

The is a shrine to The Black Madonna of zestochowka in Warminster, Pennsylvania. It located about 30 miles north of Philadelphia. During those days of observance the area is swamped with worshipers. I first became aware of The Black Madonna in the late 60s. A co-worker came into my office shortly after the murder of Dr. King on a "coffee visit." Of course, the conversation turned to the events of the day. He said, "Jim, this thing is crazy. My people have revered The Black Madonna, The Lady of Black Madonna of Czestochowka, for hundreds of years. I asked, "Who is this person." and he told me some of the story. I forget the detail, but I'm sure your links will provide the information.

The practice is very, very real the shrine in Warminister is a large estate-compound.


Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
Hi James, wow you've been there? That's great. I've read a lot of J.A. Rogers works on the subject matter and have many of his photos. I also like William Mosley, "What Color Is Jesus," also Ivan Van Sertima's Egypt Revisited which compiles all the black scholars works on the subject matter.


By the way, here is Tim Wise, he's a great white man, who I'm very fond of. Have you ever read any of his writings whew, now talk about a man of truth.


December 20, 2000

Dreaming of a Non-White Christmas:
Santa, Jesus, and the Symbolism of Racial Supremacy

By Tim Wise

Well it's that time of year again. Time for all good Americans to focus on what really matters. Not family, community, or world peace, but that national sacrament of late-stage capitalism known as Holiday shopping. Whether you do it online, or drag yourself to the mall amidst the sea of humanity scrapping and fighting for the latest must-have gizmo, rest assured that your actions are vital to the national interest. In fact, the annual consumer bonanza unleashed in the last fiscal quarter is so central to defining life in the U.S. that the economy's strength in the beginning of the following year is literally tied to how much stuff we buy. So get out there and do your duty: Buy American. Be American. Shop till you drop, and remember, this is what it means to be a patriot!

Now, being one who doesn't like to give advice that I myself am unwilling to follow, I must say that I too have been making the pilgrimage to the shopping centers lately, both to purchase desired items, and also to observe others in the process of this sociologically fascinating ritual. As someone who regularly writes about racism, you can probably imagine that I have long been especially intrigued by the way in which Holiday symbolism replicates notions of whiteness as rightness, and acts to reinforce, however subtly, racial supremacism. Yet, the full force of this process never really hit me until last week.

It was then that I found myself at the mall, passing a line of parents and their children, waiting to have a few seconds alone with Santa. You know Santa, right? The big white guy who only works one day a year and yet no one calls him lazy; the big white guy who exploits elfin labor in a sweatshop for no pay while his wife does all the housework, and yet no one calls him a slave master; the big white guy who invades millions of homes on Christmas Eve and yet, no one arrests him for breaking and entering. Yeah, that one.

Though there has been an attempt to make use of Santas of color in malls around the country lately, I think we can all agree this is pretty absurd: if Santa were black, there is little question he'd have been shot dead years ago in the vestibule of some New York City apartment by the NYPD's Street Crimes Unit. After all, how could the cop be sure that toy gun he was bringing to the child inside wasn't real? Better safe than sorry -- and anyway, that bright red suit would make him a logical target, seeing as how red is the color favored by members of the Bloods street gang.

But it wasn't this kind of irony about a black Santa that animated the comment I heard while strolling through the mall that day. No, it was pure racial resentment and nothing else leading the white woman, child in tow, to say to her friend, "don't you think it's silly to have these Black Santas? Everybody's trying to be so P.C. I mean, come on, a Black Santa? Everyone knows Santa is white."

Her friend of course agreed. Everyone knows Santa -- a make believe entity for those who haven't figured it out yet -- is white. The insistence on the racial purity of this entirely fictional being, as if this was a real person, struck me as hilarious, and right up there with the folks who send get well cards to their favorite soap opera characters when they fall ill on the shows. Ronald and Nancy Reagan are reported to have done this once. Fantasy, reality, ah screw it, who cares? I'm starting to realize the awful truth: white people are certifiably insane.

It all made sense though once I passed the woman and noticed the holiday stationary and cards in her bag. The ones with the calming, soothing face of Jesus staring back at me. You know the Jesus I'm talking about right? The one with the pale skin, blue eyes, and rock-star good looks? Yeah, that one. The same Jesus that has occupied the minds of Western Christians for the last five centuries, ever since Michaelangelo was commissioned to paint his image, and used his lily-white cousin as the sitting model.

Oh shit, I've stepped in it now. Questioning the ethnic heritage of Christ himself. And you thought this was just gonna be a cute little diatribe about the commercialization of the Yuletide season? Au contraire, mon frere.

My wife and I have received many a Christmas card this season, and as always, the representations of Jesus that adorn so many of them cast the Christian Messiah as nothing if not European. Now I know my gentile friends have that song, "A Child is Born in Bethlehem," but I never realized until now that they had meant Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. Silly me, but I always had thought the Christ child was born in that part of the world we call the "Middle East," which, if we were being honest, we would easily recognize as basically a part of Africa, separated from the continent by the man-made Suez Canal. As such, the odds of him looking the way he does in churches across America are pretty much slim and none. But don't tell that to most of his followers: especially the ones who are white like me.

The suggestion that Jesus would have been dark-skinned (black in the admittedly non-scientific racial taxonomy of the United States), is about as blasphemous to most Christians as anything one could say. Of course, no one wants to admit their indignation at the notion, so they typically couch it in ecumenical platitudes like "it doesn't matter what Jesus looked like; it only matters what he did." OK, fine. I'm down with that. Although not a Christian, I've always been one who thought Jesus said and did some pretty exemplary stuff, unlike what so many of his modern disciples say and do. So then, if it doesn't matter what he looked like then why not make him black?

I have asked this question when giving speeches on racism at religiously affiliated colleges, and let's just say, there's nothing like it if you're looking to see how fast you can get folks to start clearing their throats. Again they insist, "no you don't understand, it doesn't matter what he looked like, it's what he did." And again I repeat, O.K., fine, if it really doesn't matter then let's make him black, just for a year. Then you can change him back again if you really want to. No biggie.

No dice, and no takers. We go round and round, as white folks check their watches and try to figure out how they can leave the room without seeming to be rude.

But let's be clear: the white iconography of Jesus that predominates in this culture makes absolutely no sense, except as an artifact of a white supremacist worldview. First off, the earliest representations of Jesus, Mary, and Christ's disciples appear in the catacombs of Rome, where the first Christians, known as Essenes buried their dead. All of these portrayals picture a dark-skinned Messiah. In addition, during the time of Roman Emperor Justinian II, the Empire minted a gold coin that pictured Jesus. This coin, which today can be viewed in the British Museum, shows a man with clearly non-white facial features and tightly curled hair, consistent with the description of Christ offered in the Book of Revelations, wherein it is noted that Jesus had hair like wool, feet the color of burnt brass, and resembled jasper and sardine stones: both of which were brown in color.

Now I don't much care about the scriptural references myself, and far be it from me to insist on the infallibility of the Bible; but if the folks who do swear that every word of it has to be accepted as literal, don't also accept these descriptions -- which clearly contradict the imagery on the Christmas cards, or that of the nativity scenes one sees everywhere at this time of year -- then they are nothing if not hypocrites.

And don't forget, according to Biblical lore, when Jesus was born, Herod sent search parties out to find him and slay him as an infant. To hide the Christ child, his family absconded with him to Egypt, and if there is one thing we can be absolutely sure of, it's that one would not have been likely to try hiding an Aryan baby and family in pre-Arab Egypt, of all places. This was, after all, a society of dark-skinned Africans (as evidenced in their own hieroglyphs); one that had referred to itself as Kemet (the Black land), for thousands of years, and themselves as "Kemetcu" (the black humans). The "father" of modern history, Herodotus, himself acknowledged as much when he said "the Egyptians, Colchians and Ethiopians have thick lips, broad nose, wooly hair and are of burnt skin." Elsewhere, he actually referred to them as "black." If Jesus had been white, Mary and Joseph would have put him on a slow boat to Canada, not trekked to Egypt where finding them would have been like shooting fish in the proverbial barrel.

For those of you still reading, you'll either be laughing or fuming: if laughing, it's because you realize how silly the whitening of Jesus has been in this culture, and yet, how wedded we really are to that imagery; if fuming, well, it's because you think that somehow I'm being sacrilegious, or absurd. But I'm just reading what the good book says, and applying a little common sense and anthropology to the process.

If you want to really see absurd, go pick up Volume One of the Robert Maxwell Bible Stories Series, which I assure you is sitting on a table in your doctor's office right now. There you will find Adam and Eve depicted as if the Garden of Eden had been in Norway, despite the fact that Biblical scholars all agree the Garden -- whether viewed as a literal place or as a fictional metaphor -- was bordered by two rivers, the Biblical description of which only fits that of the Blue Nile and White Nile: neither of which, last time I checked were to be found in Scandinavia.

Some may ask what the point of all this is though frankly, it ought to be obvious. So long as our culture pictures Adam, Eve, Moses, Jesus, Mary, the Apostles, and even God "himself" as fair-skinned folk, despite the obvious preposterousness of such representations, we will continue to plant the seeds of racial supremacism in the hearts and minds of millions of people.. After all, to believe that divinity is white like you leads one to easily assume that others are somehow less complete, less than human. If God supposedly made man in his image, and God is always portrayed as a bearded white man (kinda like Santa without the suit), how hard a leap is it -- especially for children whose introduction to religion is always nine-tenths forced propaganda anyway -- to assume that persons of color are somehow not full and equal "children of God?" Not to mention the sexist aspect of the male sky-God imagery, of course, which is a whole different can of worms.

So now that I have managed to piss everyone off, here's wishing you all a very merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Joyous Kwanzaa, Resplendent Ramadan, and Super Solstice. Now get out there and shop! And take that damned Swedish-looking angel off the top of your tree for God's sake. --

Tim Wise is a Nashville-based writer, lecturer and activist. He can be reached at .


Just because people go to a Black Madonna shrine doesn't mean that the Madonna was black.

People have flocked to see the Madonna's "face" on refrigerators and stop signs, and the Shroud of Turin is still venerated even though it was shown to be a medieval creation.

And of course, there was the shrine of Apollo at Delphi as well a host of others.

Now, I'm glad that people find meaning in their worship, but when people go to the shrine of the Black Madonna, perhaps we need to ask ourselves, "Do they go because she is black, or do they go because she's the Madonna?"

There are popular shrines to white Madonnas, too, and that is most likely the answer to that question: people go because it's the Madonna.

As I said on another thread or two, the Black Madonna did not exist until the early Middle Ages.


You are beating your head against a dead horse.

Tim Wise has one maybe two good points in his article, but unfortunately he hides them deeply in an emotional screed against the wrong enemy.

He starts out with unnecessary exaggerations.

He said that people believe that consumerism is "what it means to be a patriot!"

Of course, no one actually does that. After 9-11, who said that we must go buy stuff? Who wrote songs about firefighters and police and all the things they buy? Who sang "God Bless America and Wal-Mart"?

It's a small thing, butit shows that this author doesn't mind making false statements to strengthen his point.

False statements never do so, but that truth didn't stop him from doing it.

He even does that with a fictional character, Santa Clause. "Who only works one day a year and no one calls him lazy..." H'm, doesn't Santa have a "workshop" at the North Pole? Don't we see him in suspenders and a flannel shirt or a long-john top sometimes?

Or might it be that we are only supposed to see him once a year? And for this, your author tries to paint a completely erroneous picture about a fictional character that is somehow supposed to be angering to him, and presumably to us?

That's what he's trying to do, isn't it--manipulate our emotions. He's setting us up for something. What do you suppose it could be?

Oh, yes, black Santa would be "shot." which is why all those black Santas that he just mentioned have all been shot. Every year.

No, this fellow is trying to say something that can't be said because it isn't true, so he has to exaggerate and to leave out the contradicting truths. Ignore truth, and it'll go away.

So he finds "hilarious" someone else's doing what he was just doing?

Now, when he starts talking about Jesus, he makes a very funny and telling point. Most Americans think that he was from "Bethlehem, Pennsylvania" is a very good line. Partly because it's true.

But there the good of his article ends until the very end. What a pity, because he strikes me as someone with a very good mind. He could have done better. He should have done better, because teh subject is serous enough to warrant it.

"Blasphemous to most Christians," the idea that Jesus might have been dark? Where has he been worshipping? That's not quite true.

He doesn't say at what "religously-affiliated colleges" he's been speaking, so I would imagine that he hasn't been to any Catholic or Methodist ones, say. The largest denomination in America has had many pictures of a dark, even black Jesus that I have seen. I've seen a Chinese Jesus, a Hispanic Jesus, and an African Jesus, and these pictures have had the approval of officials in the church. I've seen such pictures of Jesus among Episcopalians, too, I've seen him in Lutheran publications and Methodist churches (the mainline ones, not just the AME ones), and this comprises maillions of Christians in America.

So I would bet that he's been talking to the more conservative Protestants, as culturally-bound a set of people as you will find anywhere.

Those people do have a problem, not with a black Jesus, but with change in general. I can remember talking with one poor sweet woman in her fifties. We'd just seen a video depiction of Jesus in which Jesus told someone to "Shut up." Guess what she objected to? I asked her how she knew that Jesus hadn't said that, and she replied that Jesus "just wouldn't." I told her that he made several people angry. Sometimes he wouldn't answer questions, and sometimes he called people hypocrites. Why wouldn't he say, "Shut up?" She wouldn't hear of it.

So it is with the image of Christ in our minds. I have a picture of a black Jesus in my home. I also have a laughing Jesus, a Mexican Jesus, and a Jesus playing soccer with his disciples (I don't have them all up at the same time, but I do take turns with them). Most people don't because that's not what they grew up with.

Most Americans need some kind of sameness in their lives. It gives their lives a sense of stability in a changing world. The image of Jesus that they grew up with they try to keep for that reason.

That's something that he doesn't seem to have thought about.

A religiously-affiliated college is sometimes an institution in fragile financial state. Angering the alumni can cut off funds, and Christians sometimes are just as quick to send their money seomwhere else as they are to send it to you. A local Christian theater company produced the play "Saint Hugo of Central Park," which so angered some Christians that they cancelled their season tickets. A friend of mine decided never to go there again because of it, and all it did was to make the central character--a Jesus figure, not even Jesus--human. The colleges that reacted as he describes may have been looking to their budget instead of their racial imagery. It's also called "cowardice."

But he doesn't seem to have taken that into consideration, either.

It's not a "white supremacist worldview." It's intertia. Get pictures of a black or Arabic-looking Jesus in good art (that's the problem, not the color of Jesus but the excrably bad art in which he is most often portrayed) and it will be accepted.

If he's so sure about this, let him find a good artist and commission a work and see how it is received. Some will vilify it, of course. Some always will. But most will accept it. If it is good.

And about fitting in when the Holy Family went to Egypt, that's a guess, and not a particularly good one at that. They didn't need to fit in in Egypt, they only had to get away from Herod, in another country, a country that had been getting immigrants from other lands and other colors for a long time (Hyksos, anyone?).

His point in his article is well meant, I think. Our perceptions of Jesus easily can come from the wrong places. For those of us who have seen enough Renaissance art, we know that Jerusalem didn't look like Venice and Jesus didn't look like the Doge. Just so, Hook's "Head of Christ" is only a guess, and likely not a good one. We need to see it as it was no doubt intended (and here I'm giving Hook the benefit of the doubt), as stirring up a certain love for Jesus, not for telling us what he looked like.

I don't see any problem with Tim Wise's suggestion that we publically display a black Jesus for a while. I'd like to see him start it, if it's that important to him.

But I don't expect him to, because it's much easier to gripe than to fix.

Besides, his motives are all wrong. He's trying to use Jesus for a racial purpose, which is just the problem he accuses others of having.

If he wanted a black Jesus to worship, now, that'd be different, but I don't see any hint of that. Do you?
QUOTE]Originally posted by Melesi:

Just because people go to a Black Madonna shrine doesn't mean that the Madonna was black.

That's true. And I agree. LIt also does not mean the Madonna was not black.

It is also true that just because people pray to God He is real. What is real is the Black Madonna is an entity revered by millions --- not only in Europe, but in the United States, and such a shrine is located in Warminster, Pennsylvania.

The contention by Prophetessofrage is valid.

It is a point worth noting, because color is a great issue in American society. Black is a negative in American society. Black is an absolute negative in America's Christian religions. We, as African Americans, a "black" people have internalized that persuasion that belief to the point that serious confrontation can result. This is not true for Christians around the world.

It is good to let African American Christians know this.


Jim Chester


Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.

[This message was edited by James Wesley Chester on November 08, 2003 at 05:31 AM.]

[This message was edited by James Wesley Chester on November 08, 2003 at 05:33 AM.]

Yes, you are right. That peole do something has no bearing on that soemthing's rightness or wrongness. Which also means that just because we do something it is not necessarily right or wrong.

"Black" is in many cases a negative, that's true, but not because of skin. It's just a matter of natural fact that as something gets dirty it generally gets darker. That then has been universalized even though it of course is not right to universalize a general.

But the matter is in our hands, not others. If we refuse that univeralizing then it will fall out of favor. We started that back in the 60s with "black is beautiful," a necessary phrase for the time. Today we do that by doing what's right and not letting any cultural or self-imposed limitations keep us from our rightful achievements. Those limitations are legion, and we must be rid of them.

Thanks for the opportunity sing a version of my song, again Big Grin

Because those limitations you talk about are indeed legion, they require a response that cancels them out, or minimizes their potential. I have concluded that solution is ancestral nationality. It is universal in its application. All negatives now have to deal with the "teflon" of ancestral nationality.

Can't you just hear it? Hey, I called that African American "black." "Oh? He is "black." "That guy's is biracial." "Oh? I guess he is. He told me his mother is Italian, and his father is African American. So I know he's African American-Italian. I guess he is biracial."

WHAT you are is no longer WHO you are. I works for me, and mine.

If your heritage is like mine, it will work for you.


Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
The Black Madonna was black. All of the original European dieties were black; originally. The word Europe is of African origin; name for the African queen/goddes, Europe (U-rope-a). The description of Jesus in the Bible is that he was a black man. The claim that Jesus was Jewish because he was born in Isreal leaves out the fact that the only his parents had traveled to that area, town, etc. and were not from there. People seem to now forget exactly where Isreal is, especially since a ditch was dug and called a canal that was also for the sublinal empression of that country being separate from black and brown nations of the continent of Africa.
Historian and powers that be in the West does not want the world to know who exactly were black people. They have whitenized the so-called "Egyptian" in the cave drawings, in documetaries, in books and pictures to implant an image more to their own likeness in the minds of people. They usually act like the same people that are in north African (Egypt and the so-called Middle East) are the same people that were there 3 or 5 or 10 thousand years ago, which is equivalent to people believing that because the people in America now are prodominately white people, then it must have been these same people responsible for the 3 thousand year old Native American cave drawings.

A lot of statements but no support.

What proof or evidence do you have of this?

All of the "original" European deities were black? I don't think so. The Earth Mother was, but who were the other black ones? All the other gods and heroes were white.

What African queen or goddess was named "Europa"?

The origin of the name Europe is not quite as you have put it. Either it came from the Greek myth of Europa (and the east wind of similar name), or from an ancient Semitic word "ereb" meaning "sunset," which is about where a Semitic would expect Europe to be, in the land of the sunset.

How do you say the continent got the name of an alleged African named "Europa"?

The Suez had nothing to do with separation. It had everything to do with it being in the most effective place for the shortest route between the Mediterranean and the Gulf of Suez--and thus the Indian Ocean.

Jesus did not have to be black. Paintings of the time show that not everybody who lived in the neighborhood was black. In fact, from the evidence, most people in Israel were not black. There is no decription of Jesus in the Bible (If you know of one, would you point it out to me, please?).
I am in the process of moving. I'll have to dig up the information later.

Let me ask you what "evidence" do you have that she was not? Does it concerns you that she is a black woman? What does it matter? The white man knew nothing of the bible until approximately 800 years ago, so at least we know she was not white.

Semit: original meaning mean "half"

I did not say Europe was name by an African Queen, I said it was named for an African Queen/Goddes; do to the fact that historian have not been able to completely separate real people from mythological god/goddesses, it is not clear if Europa was a real person or a goddess in African mythology; by the way a lot of which was "borrowed" by the Greeks and have since been assumed or incorporated into Greek mythology or originality.

And the Suez canal was built for the reasons that you state and also for the reasons I stated as well.

Oh, ick--moving. That is so much work and bother. I hope it doesn't wear you out. Try to rest whenever you can.

No, of course it doesn't "bother" me that Mary may have been black. The trouble is that there is no evidence that she was. She's not described by any contemporary, certainly not in the Bible.

The fact that she lived in a place where there was a mixture of people means that she could have been just about any color. But we don't know what color she was.

The white man knew nothing of the Bible until 800 years ago? Where did you get that idea?

That would put it at about 1200.

Well, what do you do with St. Patrick? He was a Christian and read the Bible, and he died around AD 460, a few years before 800 years ago. There were missions to the Germans around AD 400, also a few years before 1200. Kenneth Scott Latourette and Stephen Niel, both historians and scholars of missions, report that.

The Bible was known in Europe long before 800 years ago. But the Black Madonna did not appear until another century or two went by. Before that the portraits of Madonna and Child were of white people. That's fairly easy to check out.

"Semitic" is not at all from the Greek word for "half." It's from the Hebrew name "Shem."

I am not familiar with the African queen or goddess "Europa." Who was she?

Thanks for the info. Good luck on the moving.
I am typically reluctant to get involved in discussions on religion, or religious things. But this is largely focused on "black", or not "black." I'm "black." So, I am vested.

I have also heard or read most of the things talked about so far, and I am only that, a reader. What I have heard that impressed me greatly is the work by Dr. Frederick K. Price. He is a minister in Los Angeles who took on the task of better defining RACE and RELIGION after being "dissed" by European American broadcast ministers. Apparently, publicly. I don't recall the detail.

In any case, he produced a major work that traces ancestry of the major players in the family of Jesus Christ. It is very, very definitive. Begat, after begat. I recall hearing him resolve the ancestry of Joseph, and Mary, as well as others.

I promised myself the book. The tapes are $1000. It is voluminous.


Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
Originally posted by Melesi:

Oh, ick--moving. That is so much work and bother. I hope it doesn't wear you out. Try to rest whenever you can.

No, of course it doesn't "bother" me that Mary may have been black. The trouble is that there is no evidence that she was. She's not described by any contemporary, certainly not in the Bible.

The fact that she lived in a place where there was a mixture of people means that she could have been just about any color. But we don't know what color she was.

The white man knew nothing of the Bible until 800 years ago? Where did you get that idea?

That would put it at about 1200.

Well, what do you do with St. Patrick? He was a Christian and read the Bible, and he died around AD 460, a few years before 800 years ago. There were missions to the Germans around AD 400, also a few years before 1200. Kenneth Scott Latourette and Stephen Niel, both historians and scholars of missions, report that.

The Bible was known in Europe long before 800 years ago. But the Black Madonna did not appear until another century or two went by. Before that the portraits of Madonna and Child were of white people. That's fairly easy to check out.

"Semitic" is not at all from the Greek word for "half." It's from the Hebrew name "Shem."

I am not familiar with the African queen or goddess "Europa." Who was she?

Thanks for the info. Good luck on the moving.


I guess what I meant to say was that "Christianity" as an organized religon has only been around for approximately 800 years.

There were those that knew of the Bible long before but it was not accepted a major European religon. The first two men to attempt to translate the Bible into a European language were assasinated. The point being that it had to be translated into a European language in the first place, which rules out any European origin, and therefore, the Madonna could not have been European at all.
And I guess I meant to also say that original European dieties were black. It is obvious why they would be white afterwards and now --when people create images themselves, they tend to re-create likeneses of themselves; either diliberately or unintentionally. If the religon was introduced by foreign peoples, then the dieties would reflect those that introduced it or were the original believers of that religon.

I cannot offer any "evidence" as proof just yet, but I am not just speaking my opinion, but from factual information that I have read and I do not have ready access to the sources of that information right now; when I am able to locate the information that I am drawing from, I am sure that I have not memorized exact dates, etc., but am vaguely remembering something I actually read; the same say you have stated here something you have read. Since neither of us were alive during the times and things we are pondering, what others have already written is all we have to go on. I am not just trying to be right, but was just merely expressing something I have read in the past and believe there to be some truth to it.

I personally am not a "religous" person because I do not believe in organized religons, I believe in "God" or the positive energy source that is in all things and connects all beings. My only interest in orgainized religon comes from my knowledge of the effects it has on the human race politically, socially and how it has fueled sexism against women in general.
Hi Sun Nubian and James good to see some intelligent blacks giving your input on the truth with regard to Black Yeshua, Israel, Egypt, Babylon, etc.. Sun Nubian that was a great truth you highlighted with regard to the Suez Canal. In fact, according to the scholars Israel was once known as 'N.E. Al-Ke-bu-lan.'

James I've readed many of your excellent comments on a variety of subjects. I see you are quite learned and I have a question for you. Have you ever heard of JOSHUA BEN PANDIRA?

He is said to have been an Ethipian Messiah born in a cave, with the similar identification as Yeshua. This is said to have happened about 40,000 yrs. ago.

Also, here is additional information on the black Jews. Scholars have ABSOLUTE proof and isn't it funny with all the glaring BLACK TRUTH out there that the RACIST ILK ENEMIES all of sudden believes in NO ABSOLUTES...NO ROOT GREEK/HEBREW WORDS THEREOF. Hypocritical bigots!


Historical Introduction

Over 2,700 years ago, the Assyrians exiled the ten tribes of the Kingdom of Israel. "In the ninth year of Hoshea, the king of Assyria captured Samaria and he carried them away to Assyria and placed them in Halah, and on the Habor, the river of Gozan, and in the cities of Medes." In the years 722-721 BC (over 2700 years ago), the Ten Tribes who comprised the northern Kingdom of Israel disappeared. Conquered by the Assyrian King Shalmaneser V, they were exiled to upper Mesopotamia and Medes, today modern Syria and Iraq. The Ten Tribes of Israel have never been seen since. Or have they?


Tudor Parfitt, the protagonist of the NOVA documentary "Lost Tribes of Israel," made a journey through southern Africa to study the unusual traditions of a black African tribe called the Lemba. This Bantu-speaking group claimed Jewish ancestry and observed many Semitic traditions such as kosher-like dietary restrictions and slaughter practices, male circumcision rites, strict rules against intermarriage, and Semitic-sounding clan names.

Once described as "a sort of British Indiana Jones," Parfitt spent many months with the Lemba, meeting their tribal and religious leaders and observing some of their most sacred rituals. He came to the conclusion that the origin of many of the Lemba traditions was indeed Semitic, not African. But whether these traditions came from Islamic or Jewish sources was impossible to discern from the historical and anthropological evidence available. It would take Y-chromosome studies to delve deeper into this question of origin.

A few years after his travels, Parfitt teamed up with a group from The Center for Genetic Anthropology at University College London to look for a genetic counterpart to the Lemba's oral tradition of Jewish descent. Using a relatively new technique in genetic studies, the team identified a particular series of genetic markers on the Y chromosome of Lemba males. They then compared these markers to other groups with whom the Lemba might have shared a common ancestor long ago.

Christianity has been organized for something longer than 800 years.

The Council of Nicaea was in AD 325. Constantine thought the arguing over Arianism (Presbyter Arius said that Jesus was everlasting but not eternal) was important enough for him to watch over the discussion about it, so a bit over 200 bishops came to Nicaea for the Council.

200 bishops make for a rather organized religion. That's Europe, and it's a bit older than 800 years ago.

Perhaps it also depends on one's definition of "organized." Since the first ecumenical council was the Council of Jerusalem as it is described in the Book of Acts, with the apostles and others gathered to decide if one needed to be a Jew before one could be a Christian, it is also possible to say that Christianity as an organized religion is older than the Council of Nicaea--which scholars of Christianity would say in any case. Byt he time Nicaea came along, Christianity was definitely organized and had been for some time. It only depends on how far before that we wish to decide what makes an organization.

"The first two men to attempt to translate the Bible into a European language were assassinated," you say. I'm not sure that this is quite true. Italy is in Europe, right? The Italians once spoke Latin, especially during the late Empire. Jerome translated the Bible into Latin around the year AD 400. He was not assassinated. It became called the "Vulgate" because it was in the main the "vulgar" or "common" tongue of the time.

Before that it was in Greek. Much of the New Testament was written in Greek originally, and the rest of it was translated into Greek very soon after it was written in Aramaic because at the time everybody spoke Greek and had done ever since Alexander the Great marched through Europe. The Old Testament was translated into Greek around the year 220 bc in Alexandria, Egypt, and was done a bit more than 800 years ago. Greek was (and still is, if I hear my Greek neighbor correctly) a European language.

So why do you say that the Bible was not translated into a European language until quite late (when in fact it was in a European language for much, much longer than that), and why do you say that the first two people to try to translate it into a European language were "assassinated"?

It isn't so, unless you know of someone that I do not.

Who were these "first two" people?

The original Zeus was black? The original Thor? There's no evidence of this.

I do not suspect you of merely stating your opinion. I fully believe that you have heard or read soemthing about this. I do fear, however, that you have read or heard something that is not quite true. I have many history books in my library, and none of them show any evidence of what you claim, so I'm interested in the information and in your sources.

Joshua ben pandira is a story much later than the lifetime of Jesus, and it is repeated by those who hated Christianity and who, like yourself, looked for any reason to disregard it, even if the reaosn was not true. It is an urban legend that's been around for many centuries only because it was written, even though it was written far too late to be of any real use to establishing the truth of the matter.

I have mentioned the Lemba people before. The only lthing that we can say about htem so far is that they are somehow conected to the Levitical line of Jewish ancestry. The genetic markers that show a relationship between them and Israel is that they carry the same markers at the same frequency as do the Cohens. 50% of the Cohens have a certain few genetic markers unique to them. About 50% of the Lemba do also.

Does this mean that they are the original Cohens, or does this mean that they and the Cohens are related, that for some reason--trade? Exploration?--Cohens came this far south into Africa and intermarried some time ago?

We don't know. So the fact of the Lemba genetic structure is not proof of anything yet. It is interesting, but not conclusive.

Come to think of it, I think I'll put up the DETAILED TRUTHS on that at a later time. In the meantime, BLACK WOMEN do EMBRACE THE TRUTH AND BECOME ENLIGHTENED.


Shamanism & Earth Mythology


Excerpted from Green Psychology by Ralph Metzner
(Rochester, VT: Inner Traditions International, 1999)

Prior to the rise of transcendental monotheism, the religious worldview of the ancient world was polytheistic, animistic and shamanistic. In this essay I explore some of the key mythic images of our pagan ancestors -- the gods and goddesses that personify our relationship to the earth, to the plant realm and to the world of animals.1

The religion and worldview of the Celtic, Germanic, Baltic, and Slavic people, who inhabited Europe prior to the Christian era, as well as that of the Greeks and other Mediterranean peoples, was animistic: gods and goddesses, the living intelligences of nature, were perceived and worshipped in forest groves and sacred springs, on mountain tops and in great stone circles. In addition to gods and goddesses there were other classes of beings associated with nature, who were not human, but certainly equal, if not superior, to humans and deserving of respect, -- such as giants and dwarves, elves and trolls, fairies, leprechauns, gnomes, satyrs, nymphs and mermaids.These deities and beings could be communed with by anyone who was willing to practice the methods taught by the shamans and their successors the witches, the wise women of the woods -- using magical plants and stones, chants and incantations, dances and rituals.

This is the nature religion that was eliminated by Christian monotheism during the first few centuries of our era. Pagan deities were either banished into non-existence or demonized. Those who followed the old nature religion were branded as "pagan" or "heathen", which originally simply meant "country dwellers" or "heath dwellers". The country folk were more likely to have preserved beliefs in spirits and knowledge of healing and magical herbs than those who lived in towns with stone walls. Some of the pagan deities were absorbed into Christian lore, just as some traditional sacred places had churches or chapels built on them. Others sank into the cultural underground of folklore and popular customs and beliefs. Mythic stories of divine figures devolved into comic or moralizing legends and fairy-tales. Under the influence of Judeo-Christian transcendental monotheism the kind of direct awareness of the spiritual presences in nature that our pagan ancestors enjoyed and cultivated, was gradually lost. As William Blake said, "thus men forgot that all deities live within the human breast."

While I do not mean to suggest that we must all become pagans and worship the ancient gods again, I do believe that by re-connecting with the nature religion of our ancestors, we can recover something of the imaginal sensitivity and ecological spirituality that is the collective heritage of each of us. A tremendous spiritual revitalization can take place when we recognize the natural world and the divine world as intimately interwoven with one another. I see this as a kind of re-membering, through which the dis-memberment of human consciousness from the Earth could be healed.

In my book The Well of Remembrance,2 I focussed on the Earth wisdom mythology of the Nordic-Germanic people. In this same spirit of of healing-remembering I would like now to discuss several mythic deities from pre-Christian Europe as well as from non-European cultures -- god-images that embody a perception of the spiritual in nature. There are three groups of such images: one is the Black Earth Goddess, who was absorbed into Christianity as the Black Madonna or Black Virgin; a second group are the plant and vegetation deities of the ancient world, a variant of which also made it into Christian iconography as the Green Man; and the third group are the animal deities and wild men/wild women, who represent the evolutionary memory of our animal ancestry.

The Black Goddess/Madonna

There about 500 shrine images of the Black Virgin in various churches in Europe.3 Among the best-known is the one in the cathedral of Chartres in France; the protectress saint of Poland in Czestochowa; the protectress saint of Switzerland at Einsiedeln, near Zürich; the Muttergottes ("Mother of God") in Altötting, near München, in Bavaria; and the one in Loreto, Italy. These shrines of the Black Madonna are among the most-visited pilgrimage places in Christendom. Hundreds of thousands of people annually make the pilgrimage to Altötting, or Einsiedeln, and have done so since the Middle Ages, when most of the shrines were first established.

The reason for their magnetism as pilgrimage places lies in their reputation for healing efficacy. In Altötting for example, the tiny chapel that holds the shrine of the Virgin, is surrounded by several thousand ex voto tablets, some dating back to the 13th century and some from the current year, in which thanks is expressed for a miraculous healing or recovery, a safe journey or return of a loved one, or, in earlier times, an exorcism of evil spirits. In the typical story, a person appealed to Maria for help or guidance and vowed to make an offering if the appeal was successful. Thus, the bequest and the tablet come "from the vow" (ex voto). On the outside of the chapel one can also see numerous crutches and limb protheses, left as unnecessary by grateful healed pilgrims.

Although enjoying great popular appeal, the images of the Black Madonna are a source of some embarrassment to the Catholic church. Usually, the guidebooks make no reference to the color; or when they do, they try to explain it away by ludicrous references to the blackening effect of centuries of smoke from candles and incense burners. Occasionally, there are references to the mysterious line from the Old Testament Song of Solomon, in which the Shulamite, perhaps the Queen of Sheba, sings: "I am black, but I am beautiful, O ye daughters of Jerusalem." For the good Christian pilgrims who cannot bear to contemplate a dark-skinned Madonna, the souvenir shops carry sanitized wax or wooden replicas, in which Mary and the infant Jesus have appropriately white European faces.

The Black Virgin has been identified with several black goddess figures of the ancient pre-patriarchal cultures of the Mediterranean and Near East, including the Phrygian Cybele, the Sumerian Inanna, the Syrian Anath, the Hebrew Lilith, the Indian Kali, the Ephesian Diana, and the Egyptian goddesses Neith and of course Isis. In the goddess-worshipping cultures of Old Europe and the pre-patriarchal Mediterranean, black was the color of fertility and abundance, like the rich black soil of the Nile and other river valleys. White on the other hand was the color symbolic of death, and images of the death-bringing goddess were carved in bone or marble. However, for the nomadic pastoralist Indo-Aryans, who invaded Europe from the 4th millenium BCE onwards, white, gold and yellow were the colors of the life-giving, shining sun-god; and black was the color of the somber underground death deities like Hades, Hecate or Hel.

With the shift to a patriarchal sky-god religion, and followed by the Judaeo-Christian monotheistic traditions, the nature-reverencing goddess religions of the archaic world were suppressed, desacralized and demonized. The sacred sexuality associated with the cult of Inanna and Ishtar was condemned as prostitution. Lilith, who represented female sexual autonomy and protection of childbirth and children, was turned into a seductive demoness who stole children. Male priests and theologians found it easy to play up the terrifying aspects of goddess worship, as in the cult of Cybele, whose priests symbolically, and at times literally, offered their genitals in sacrifice to the goddess. The Indian Kali became increasingly polarized as destructive only, although the original image is balanced between birth-giving and death-dealing. Diana became the goddess of the witches. The Black Goddess entered Christianity from below as it were, in both her healing and threatening aspect. She was strongly associated with the 12th century esoteric Christianity of the Cathars, the Troubadours and the Templars, all of whom tried to overcome the dissociative split between nature-eros and dogmatic ascetic spirituality, and all of whom were savagely destroyed by the Church.

Only the image of the Black Madonna and Child, itself based on the Egyptian images of Isis with the child Horus, survived the Christian misogynistic onslaught. The cult of Isis was the dominant religion of the Mediterranean during late Roman times, and had spread into Roman-occupied lands, including Gaul. The city of Paris was devoted to Isis, as Lyons was to Cybele and Marseilles to Artemis. Like other Black Goddess figures, Isis is the life-giving and healing goddess of the Earth. In The Golden Ass of Apuleius, Isis speaks: "I am Nature, the universal Mother, mistress of all the elements, primordial child of time, sovereign of all things spiritual, queen of the dead, queen also of the immortals, the single manifestation of all the gods and goddesses there are."4 The text goes on to claim that she is identical with Cybele, Artemis, Aphrodite, Persephone, Demeter, Juno, and Hecate.

The Black Earth Goddess under whatever name, including the Black Madonna, has traditionally always been supportive of and facilitative of the natural processes of life: healing the sick, easing the pain of childbirth, bringing fertility, making the milk flow, comforting and guiding the dying, helping the plants grow. As such, she represented the persistence of the Great Goddess during the time of dominance by patriarchal sky-god cults, and she represents the persistence of the Mother Goddess during the ascendancy of Christian monotheism.

Some years ago, when I was on the Canary Islands off the coast of Africa, I had a vivid dream about the Black Goddess. In the dream I was with a group of AIDS sufferers who had gone to Africa to get to know the Black Goddess. We had been told that the underlying cause of AIDS was a disconnection from the regenerative power of the Black Goddess; and the cure would involve reestablishing the psychic bond with that Goddess. I told that dream to several friends who had AIDS, who felt it symbolized an important truth. Since AIDS represents a breakdown of the body's inherent immune resilience and self-healing capacity, reconnecting with the healing power of the Black Goddess may well be necessary on the road to wholeness.

The shrines and images of the Black Virgin have an undeniable psychic and spiritual power, which explains their attraction for tourists, as well as those seeking a cure for their ills. The chapel in Altötting, in the lush, fertile farm country of Lower Bavaria, stands in the middle of the town square, surrounded by other churches and monasteries. The outside of the chapel, as already mentioned, is covered with thousands of votive tablets. The entire inside of the chapel is painted black, and the walls studded with countless gold and silver images and ornaments, especially around the alcove shrine which holds the statue. The light from numerous candles in gigantic silver candleholders sparkles and scintillates off the polished gold and silver objects. The blackness set with shimmering gold and silver gives the whole chapel a mysterious, alchemical, yet strangely comforting aura.



Enjoy, and tootaloo now...... Wink
1. H'm, so the Black Madonna is a Christianized version of the Earth Goddess?

I already said that. Thanks for the confirmation, prophetess.

2. Note the reference to the 12th century. The creation of the Black Madonna was earlier than that, around the 5th or 6th centuries, but that's still far too late for them to be accurate depictions of the physical Madonna and Child. Earlier art, the paleochristian art found in the catacombs of the Roman Empire an dwhich date fromt eh 3rd to the 5th centuries, show both Jesus and Mary as white.

That's still too late for them to be authoritative, but if we're going to depend on artists who never saw their subject to tell us what color teh Madonna and Child were, we're always going to get it wrong. The earliest artistic depictions of Mary and Jesus have them as white. You may try to depend on later, medieval portraits of a Black Madonna based on the black Earth Mother, but that's going to be wrong, too.

You are far too dogmatic about this, prophetess. You would do better not to concentrate on what cannot be known nor insist on what is not true. There are so many other things that you can be saying and learning instead of quoting from other websites that have are so desperate to make their racist (sic) point that they cannot recognize the truth when it stands in front of them.

3. I would be interested to know if any of these people are cured of their AIDS.

AIDS a "disconnection from the power of the Black Goddess." Sheesh. We know how AIDS works and where it comes from, and a "disconnection" ain't it.
Oh Ick, ick, ick, ick, pooh even, I almost forgot to post yet another PERSON speaking the TRUTH about BLACK YESHUA/JESUS, MARY/MIRIAM, ISRAEL, EGYPT, BABYLON, ETC...

Black Madonna

by Ken Rabac, PhD-ThD

Most Indo-Tibetan scholars believe that the Hindu and Buddhist Dark Goddesses and the Christian Black Madonna are a common prototype with a common Archetypal source in antiquity or eternity.

Alain Daneliou speaks of a mine of spirituality extending back into prehistory and expressing each civilization's emotional ties to the Great Mother in both her nurturing and fearsome aspects.

The patriarchal Aryan Vedic and Judaeo-Christian cultures de-emphasized the Divine Mother in favor of God the Father and male dominance. Feminist theologians have attempted to recover the Black Madonna as a mystical counter point to the Cosmic Christ. Poet and Scholar Andrew Harvey in his splendid book THE RETURN OF THE MOTHER sees the Black Madonna as "Mary who in the heat of true passion gives birth to the Christ Heart."

In Eastern traditions, the Black Madonna motif appears as the Dark Goddesses exemplified by Kali, the frightful creator/destroyer. In Buddhism, Kali takes the form of Vajravahari, the consort of the Black Samvara and Kali's nature is reflected in a retinue of disciples who attend to the Tantric couple. Vajrahari and the Dakinis are said to inhabit cemetery grounds and wear necklaces and skirts made from human skeletons and skulls.

Sri Aurobindo and Ramakrishna both contemplated the Divine Mother and encountered Dark Kali in only one aspect of the deity. Aurobindo found four basic sides to the Eastern Madonna. 1. MAHESWARI: represents CALM MINDEDNESS, COMPREHENDING, WISDOM, TRANQUILITY, AND INEXHAUSTIBLE COMPASSION.



For Aurobindo these four personalities of the Divine Mother are always at work, SYNCHRONISTICALLY, in the Universe. Aurobindo teaches that there is at all times an alchemy of the Divine Mother occurring in each individual. He says we are all Gnostic children of the Divine Mother, inflamed, impelled, nurtured and soothed by the four aspects of her personality.

When we are under the sway of Maheswarit, we experience tranquility and wisdom. Mahakali's Dark Mother strips us of safety -- Mahakali is of another force of nature -- force, strength and power of overwhelming intensity -- mighty passion and divine violence.

Andrew Harvey also sees the Great Mother as being a composite Archetype composed of Kali, The Black Madonna and the Blessed Virgin Mary, Queen of Heaven, Nature and Earth.


Harvey also emphasizes the Black Madonna as the Queen of Fertility and Tantra -- SACRED SEXUALITY.


In a particularly lyrical passage, Harvey writes of the Black Madonna: BLACK MADONNA IS THE TRANSCENDENT KALI-MOTHER, THE BLACK WOMB OF LIGHT OUT OF WHICH ALL WORLDS ARE ALWAYS ARISING AND INTO WHICH THEY FALL. The presence behind all things -- the darkness of love and the loving unknowing into which the child of the mother goes when his or her (own) illumination is perfect."

For Harvey the Black Madonna is also the Queen of Nature and the Blesser and Agent of all rich and fertile transformations of the outside world and the psyche.

He depicts the Black Madonna as "blackened by grief but ENNOBLED and made ADAMANT by SECRET MYSTICAL KNOWLEDGE." This knowing she has discovered through her agony which she represents with dignity.

Harvey holds the Black Madonna accompanies us in our worst anguishes and humiliations -- representing endurance and faith transmuted into WISDOM.

Paraphrasing Harvey, "The Dark Queen of Heaven guides us into the Highest Mysteries", The Black Madonna provides immense inspiration to compassionate service and the IMMENSE ALCHEMICAL POWER OF TRANSFORMATION through both JOY AND GRIEF.

Harvey interprets the SACRED HEART OF MARY as the Black Madonna's "FORCE STREAM" of the intense ENLIGHTENMENT that follows the acceptance of all of our emotions as they are ... enduring all things to perceive the deepest mysteries of existence.

One of Sri Aurobindo's least known and most beautiful brief works, HYMN TO THE MOTHER OF THE RADIANCES, captures the essence of the Divine Feminine Archetype.

And here is the 'BLACK MESSIAHS' FYI BLACK WOMEN and GIRLS looking in and those who will look in in the future. Enjoy, educate yourself, and become enlightened.

Buddha of India was Black, that's why his woolly hair is always shown in small tight curls - pepper corn style, or in corn rows. Early sculptures of him clearly portray his Africoid features of wide nose and full lips. "Buddha was adored as a square black stone." 1 In the most ancient temples of Asia and India, the sculptures of the gods and goddesses have Africoid features and woolly hair in pepper corn style and even dredlocks.

Fu-Hsi, the "Son of Heaven" and legendary first Emperor of China, was Black and woolly haired. 2

Zaha of Japan was woolly haired and Afrikan in appearance. 3

Kar of Afrika's Nile Valley was the inner soul of Mother Earth, a beautiful ebony virgin who was the "Heart of the World." 4 Shrines of Karnak in Egypt and Carnac in Brittany were dedicated to Kar, the Goddess of Agriculture, especially the growth of grain. She was Kore to the Arabs and Greeks, Ceres to the Romans. Derivatives of her name include cereal, corn, kernel, cardia (heart), care, and cherish. If you cut an apple transversely, you will discover that every apple has a "Kore," the magic pentacle which is her symbol.

Moses was Black according to Mohammedan tradition and early portraits. His hand would turn white, then back to his "other flesh" when God wished to give him a sign (Exo. 4:6-7).

Apollo was Black and woollyhaired like his father Zeus. The world famous Apollo Theatre in Harlem is named after him.

Venus of Willendorf is a famous stature of the Mother God as she was worshipped some 15 to 20 thousand years ago. Although she is found in most art history books, none mention that she is Africoid: her entire faceless head is covered with woolly hair like that of Buddha's.

1). Higgens, v-1, 137.
2) Doane, 534.
3) Ibid.
4) Waker, WE, 514.

Krishna of India was "blue black." His name means black or The Black One! He is always portrayed with black or blue skin, and his hair was woolly according to the Cambridge Encyclopedia, 1 and sometimes locked.

Tyr of Scandinavia was a woolly haired Norse god who preceded Thor as a sky deity. 2

Athena of "Greek" mythology was Black and woolly haired, originating from Afrika (Libya). She was later whitened up like the other Afrikan gods adopted by Europe. She was also known as Anath, Medusa, and the Egyptian goddess Neith.3

Isis (As-t) the greatest of Afrikan Goddesses, was worshipped throughout the ancient world in Egypt, Greece, Rome and beyond. Known under many names, She was the "Queen of Heaven" and the "Goddess from whom all becoming arose." The worship of Her survives today, disguised as the worship of the Black Madonna throughout Catholic Europe.

Lao-tse of Taoism 'was born of Mohammed of Islam was a virgin, black in complexion, described 'marvelous and beautiful as jasper.' Splendid temples were erected to him, and he was worshiped as a god " 4

Scotia was a Black goddess and Egyptian princess after which Scotland is named. 5

Caillech (Cale, Kali) was known as the "Black Queen" in medieval legend, and to the Cells as the mother of many races. The Spanish called her Califia and gave her name to their newly discovered paradise which is now called California. 6

Quetzalcoatl of Mexico was "recognized as the Messiah by seers and astrologers; his head was rayed; his complexion was black; his hair was woolly." 7 He was never blond or white, as stated by friars, though he may have been clad in white. 8

Osiris (Azar), husband of Isis and greatest of Egyptian gods, was called "The Great Black," similar to Krishna. His chief title Gleans 'Ford of the Perfect Black;" "Osiris was sun-rayed; his complexion was black and his hair was woolly." 9

Mohammed of Islam was 'large mouthed', 'bluish' in color with 'frizzy' hair. His grandfather was "black as the night and magnificent." 10

Zeus, the top god and father of gods in Greek mythology, was Black and woolly haired, having originated in Afrika. His chief title was Ethiops (burnt faced).

At Delphi in Greece, the oracles of Dodona and Apollo were founded by two "Black Doves" or Afrikan priestesses from Thebes, according to Herodotus. 11

Circe, who played a great role in Homer's Odyssey, was the most famous female magician of all time. "Ancient Greek drawings depict her as a beautiful African woman." 12

Ixliton, the name of a Mexican god, means "black faced." 13 Many ancient Mexican gods are portrayed jet black with Africoid features.

Dilyehe, meaning Home ofthe Black God, was the name which the Navajo gave to the seven suns of Pleiades. 16

Kali was the Great Black Mother, the Hindu Triple Goddess of Creation, Preservation, and Destruction.

The color BLACK represented holiness and the image of God throughout the ancient world

Historian Sir Godfrey Higgens wrote, "the originals of all the Gods have been of He black race." 14 The ancients viewed the sacred image of the Divine as Black. And woolly hair was a sign of divinity - called "the hair of the gods." 15 In the next section, we shall discover why.


About your first post:

An archetype by definition is not real. Therefore all that your authority said there is that the black goddesses were based on something imagined, and therefore unreal.

That's why he does not speak about the Madonna but rather the Madonna "motif." To him, they are not real.

So your authority there says that all that you are trying to uphold is a fantasy. A nice fantasy, perhaps, but a fantasy.

About your second post:

Take a look at these

These are early Greek sculptures--what's known as from the "archaic" period--and they don't look very black.

Here are some others

And you'll have a hard time proving your thesis from them.

About Buddha being black: if all you go on is hair style (which is all you did), then you have a very weak argument. I know of a man who has very tight curly hair naturally, and he's as white as the driven snow. In fact once he deliberately let it grow out to an Afro before he had it cut. He's a pharmacist, a normal guy.

Look closely at Buddha's face. Usually it isn't black-looking.

Come on, you can't prove anything by this line of argument. Representations of the buddha are not meant to be literally true. That's why his eyes are almost always mostly closed: not because he was a narcoleptic but because he is supposed to be looking inward serenely. The statuary tells us what we are supposed to do, not what he used to look like.

Mohammedan tradition couldn't start before about AD 600, rather a long time after Moses died. Since Mohammed wasn't born until 570, it would be hard for him to know what color Moses was. Muslim tradition is just that, tradition, but it isn't trustworthy.

Yes, Apollo was black sometimes in Delphos:

but not anywhere else:

and you'll note that the two statues of Apollo in the "" site are the only black-colored ones on the page, and then they are not black-featured. They are not Africoid.

So you can't prove your thesis, prophetess. No matter how often you say that what you say is "truth," it isn't. It isn't the whole truth, and it certainly isn't nothing but the truth.

When reporting Pope John Paul II's visit to Egypt in February of 2000, the Papal News Service stated: "Christianity and the world's culture owe much to the Church of Egypt." This statement indicates an unhealthy interest in the very Masonic conspiracy which the Vatican of previous centuries pledged to eradicate. Is Pope John Paul II's rapprochement with Freemasonry high treason in the Vatican? Or is it the case that, as Pharaoh entreated Moses, Roman Catholicism has never been far removed from Egypt in the first place? And Pharaoh said, I will let you go that ye may sacrifice to the Lord your God in the wilderness; only ye shall not go very far away. . . Exodus 8:28

Religion Today, January 21, 2000
"For the first time, a Roman Catholic pope is going to the land of the pharaohs. John Paul II will visit Egypt Feb. 24-26 as part of a series of trips to biblical sites in 2000, Reuters said. He will meet with government and religious leaders, including President Hosni Mubarak, Coptic Orthodox Pope Shenouda, and the country's top Islamic leader. The pope will celebrate Mass in the Catholic Coptic Cathedral in Cairo, then visit the monastery of St. Catherine in the Sinai desert, thought to be near the site where Moses received the Ten Commandments."

According to an editorial in the Fides News Service of Rome, founded by the Pontifical Society for the Propagation of the Faith, "The Pope will visit Sinai and encourage Egypt's hope". This amazing article reveals the pagan source of much of Catholic tradition -- the gnostic School of Alexandria:
"Egypt is about to live an historical event: for the first time the Catholic Pope of Rome will visit this Muslim country whose Christians are mainly Orthodox Copts. The visit is part of the pilgrimages to the Holy Land, or ˜Holy Lands' as Arabs say, which the Pope has programmed to celebrate the Jubilee of the Year 2000. These journeys, he explains in his letter - A Pilgrimage to the places linked with the history of salvation - "are purely religious, not political" (n. 10). By chance, thanks to Providence, because of human violence around Iraq, the first pilgrimage will be to Egypt, a land which for millennia has linked its existence with that of God. The very name Ad Ka Ptah, means the "house of the heart of God". Ptah, considered the god-creator of the world, was venerated at Memphis, in the Early Kingdom. From him all the other gods of Egypt were born, ending with Osiris, god of the underworld and judge of the dead. The Greeks called this "land of the gods" Aegyptos from which comes the word Copt, initially used to indicate the inhabitants of Egypt, but now used only by Egyptian Christians.
"Christianity and the world's culture owe much to the Church of Egypt. When the era of persecution ended, it was here that monastic life began to flourish with Anthony (circa 251-356) and Pachomius (287-347) transmitting its ideals to Benedict and the entire civilization of Europe. Here the school of Alexandria with Clement and Origen fashioned a magnificent synthesis, combining the best of ancient Greek thought with Christianity, influencing western metaphysics still today. Here, thanks to Cyril, there was the first definition of the dogma of Theotokos, Mother of God, without which the Church could not be called "holy" and infallible". Even the name Pope, was attributed first to the Patriarch of Alexandria and then passed to the Bishop of Rome. Still today Copt-Orthodox and Greek-Orthodox patriarchs are still addressed as ˜holiness', like the Pope of Rome."
The Coptic Church
"Coptic Christianity" is an heretical gnostic tradition which originated in Syria and proliferated in the early centuries A.D. through Clement's Alexandrian School in Egypt. 1. Later history associates the Coptic Church with Druidism, euphemistically called "Celtic Christianity." This pagan sect, which migrated to the British Isles, claims that the literal bloodline of Jesus Christ exists today in a royal lineage called the Merovingian Dynasty. Today, the Coptic/Celtic Church is a formidable movement which is spreading its gnostic heresy -- based on counterfeit Scriptures -- via the popular Grail legends. In his book, The Occult Conspiracy, Michael Howard connects Coptic Christianity with Druidism, Gnosticism, Neo-Platonism, the Secret Gospel of Mark and the Prieuré de Sion:

"In addition to Druidism, the Celtic Church had been influenced by Coptic Christianity. This unorthodox version of the new faith was founded by Clement of Alexandria who had blended the teachings of Jesus with Gnosticism, Judaism and Neo-Platonism. Clement founded his Coptic Church on the Secret Gospel of Mark, written by the evangelist in Alexandria following the death of Jesus. This gospel preserved the inner teachings given by Jesus to his closest disciple who had been initiated into the Christian mysteries. It is interesting that Ormus, the legendary first-century founder of the secret society which became the Priory of Sion, lived in Alexandria and was converted to Christianity by Mark." 2.
The Columbia Encyclopedia identifies the doctrine of the Coptic Church as Monophysitism, which was declared a heresy in the 5th century by the Council of Chalcedon. Monophysites maintained that the human and divine in Jesus Christ constituted but one composite nature. The Council of Chalcedon labored to determine the correct terminology which would define the doctrine of the Incarnate Christ as existing in two natures, united in one person. Note in the next citation from the Columbia Encyclopedia that the Coptic Church is in communion with the Jacobite Church, which led the Monophysite opposition to the affirmation of the two natures of Christ by the Council of Chalcedon. The Jacobite Church confesses the "one divine-human nature" of Christ and has historically been separated from the Roman Catholic Church:
"Most Copts belong to the Coptic Church, an autonomous Christian sect that officially adheres to Monophysitism, which was declared (451) a heresy by the Council of Chalcedon. The Church is in communion with the Jacobite Church (also Monophysite) . . .the chief bishop, the Patriarch of Alexandria is in direct succession to the 5th century Patriarchs who embraced Monophysitism. Among the Copts a small minority are in communion with the Pope; these 'Catholic Copts' have their own organizations and churches but share the rites and practices of the Coptic Church. This community began to develop in the 18th cent. Protestant missions have had some success among the Copts. Besides Copts there are orthodox communities, mainly Greek and Syrian; the Orthodox Patriarch of Alexandria traces his succession to the Catholics of the 5th century. There are also many Catholic Syrians, mainly Melkites and Maronites." 3, 4.
During his visit to Egypt, Pope John Paul II said Mass at the Catholic Coptic Cathedral. This would appear to be the "Catholic Copts" mentioned above which share the rites and practices of the Coptic Church. Research of the liturgy of the Coptic Mass disclosed that this ritual is the ancient worship of Horus, the Sun-god, as the Egyptian "Christ". Dr Ragheb Moftah, whom the Coptic patriarch called "the father of hymnology," and his British colleague, Ernest Newlandsmith, have spent their lives collecting the hymns to be chanted in Coptic Masses and syncretizing Ancient Egyptian and Western hymnology.
Preserving Pharos Psalms FOR CHRIST
"Moftah, whom the Coptic patriarch has called "the father of hymnology," has been doggedly gathering, recording and transcribing this ephemeral mass of material since meeting a young English ethnomusicologist named Ernest Newlandsmith 71 years ago. His extraordinary longevity is dwarfed only by the age of his subject. According to Moftah, Coptic Church chant is the oldest liturgical music in the world. Its Christian origins are tied to those of the Coptic Church itself, which appeared with St. Mark in Alexandria in roughly 45 A.D. But at least some of the new church hymns were based on rnelodies used in odes to the pharaonic era deities of Isis and Osiris in their temples.

"A number of pharaonic elements have remained in Coptic music... The famous hymn "Kyrie Eleison" may have descended from prayers to Aton, the sun god...

"While Coptic chant predates Islam, the work of Coptic cantors and the recitation of the Holy Quran probably influenced each other, and both share common elements with the ancient, and continuing, Jewish institution of master singers in the synagogue...

"At an early age, Moftah found himself enchanted by the haunting music of the Coptic Mass. . . Newlandsmith, a fellow of the Royal Academy of Music, was. . . [a] monastic eccentric for 20 years. [I]n 1940 he married Maria Romero, a British diplomat's daughter who reportedly believed her ancestors came from the lost continent of Atlantis.

"A true believer in the pharaonic roots of Coptic incantation, Newlandsmith added, 'It seems impossible to doubt but that this is Ancient Egyptian. Moreover, it is great music: grand, pathetic, noble and deeply spirituel.'

"He also saw Moftah as a bridge between nations, 'a man of very remarkable gifts, a leading spirit in many of the higher reforms of Egypt and a thinker whose work in the near future may count for much in establishing a happier understanding between Egypt and the people of England.' It is not known what work Newlandsmith had in mind exactly, but presumably it was about Moftah's contributions to explaining the likely link between Ancient Egyptian and Western music."

"In 1931, they stopped briefly to complete Newlandsmith's return to England together. There they lectured on the glories of Coptic music - its first recognition in the West since it reached Ireland with Egyptian missionaries around the fifth century - at Oxford and Cambridge universities, among other places. Once, at Oxford, they had a special visitor in the audience - a young physicist named Albert Einstein. The lectures drew many notices in the press, which seized on the theme of Western music's hitherto neglected Egyptian roots."

The reference to recitation of the Koran (Holy Quran) in Coptic liturgy may offer some clue as to why, in May of 1999, Pope John Paul II bowed and kissed the Muslim holy book presented to him by a Muslim delegation led by the Patriarch of Babylon of the Chaldeans.
"In May 1999, during an audience granted to three Muslims at the Vatican, Pope John Paul II bowed to the Muslim holy book, the Koran, and kissed it (Christian News, Oct. 18, 1999, p. 16). The three Muslims were the Shiite Imam of Khadum mosque, the Sunni president of the Iraqi Islamic Bank, and a representative of the Iraqi ministry of religion. The photo of the gesture has been shown repeatedly on Iraqi television. . . A mere six months later, Indonesian Muslims demonstrated their reply to the Pope's gesture by slaughtering Roman Catholics in East Timor who had voted their independence from Indonesia." [Fundamental Baptist Information Service, November 4, 1999]
The Koran rejects the fundamental doctrines of Christianity: the Trinity, the Deity of Christ, the eternal Sonhip of Christ, and His death and resurrection:
Trinity and Deity of Christ: "Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His apostles. Say not 'Trinity' : desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah. Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs." (Koran, Surah 4:171)
Pre-existence of Jesus: "The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: 'Be'. And he was." (Koran, Surah 3:59)

Sonship of Christ: "Regarding Sonship of Jesus: That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth, concerning which they are doubting. It is not for God to take a son unto Him. Glory be to Him! When He decrees a thing, He but says to it 'Be', and it is." (Qur'an 19:34,35) (The Institute of Islamic Information and Education)

Death and Resurrection of Christ: "Regarding Crucifixion of Jesus: And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty calumny, and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messenger of God'. . .yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they have no knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they did not slay him of certainty. . . no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, All-Wise. There is not one of the people of the Book but will assuredly believe in him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them." (Qur'an 4:156-159) (The Institute of Islamic Information and Education)

The Vatican News Service supplied the following explanation for the incredulous among the Catholic faithful who demanded reasons for John Paul II's embrace of the Koran.
Why did the Pope kiss the Koran?: a book in Italian on basics of Islam
Rome (Fides) – "At the end of the audience the Pope bowed to the Muslim holy book the Koran presented to him by the delegation and he kissed it as a sign of respect." This was said by Raphael Bidawid, Patriarch of Babylon of the Chaldeans who told Fides about his audience with Pope John Paul II on May 14th when he was received with a delegation composed of the Shiite imam of Khadum mosque and the Sunni President of the council of administration of the Iraqi Islamic Bank and also a representative of the Iraqi ministry of religion.

That gesture was a sign of the Holy Father's respect for the billion and 34 million followers of Islam, as well as his eagerness to make a pilgrimage in the footsteps of Abraham, the common father of Christians, Jews and Muslims.

Recently a book on Islam was published in Italian by EMI with the title "I fondamenti dell'Islam. Un'introduzione a partire dalla fonte: il Corano". The book, originally in German, is written by Adel Theodore Khoury from Lebanon, who, until 1996, was professor at Muenster University in Germany. The book presents the figure of Mohammad, his life and mission and shows that the Prophet understood the relation between the religions of the Book, the Jewish religion, Christianity and Islam: it could be useful for promoting Christian/Muslims relations. [Fides News Service (Rome), 11/6/99]

To what end are the Pope's overtures to Islam and the Coptic religion? A New Age book, Messiah & The Second Coming, is authored by two members of the Coptic Fellowship and published by the Coptic Press. The backcover of this book gives a brief description of the esoteric belief system of Coptic Fellowship International:
"John Davis is Director of Coptic Fellowship International, an action oriented new age organization presenting Universal Wisdom as passed down through the ages in the great tradition of the Atlantean Doctrines to the present day. The Coptics are dedicated to the Spiritual Unity of Nations (S.U.N.), cooperating with leaders of religions and philosophies stressing spiritual World unity. John has conducted Christ Consciousness Training Seminars extensively throughout the U.S. and in Mexico, Canada, South Africa, France and Egypt. He is the successor to the Egyptian Master, Hamid Bey, who founded The Coptic Fellowship of America." 5.
The Tomb of Osiris
By coincidence, one month before the Pope's scheduled visit to Egypt, the tomb of the Egyptian Sun-god, Osiris, was reported to have been discovered in a shaft between the Great Sphinx and the Pyramid of Khafre.

Egyptians Find Tomb of Ancient God Osiris
Thursday February 17, 2000

GIZA, Egypt (Reuters) - Sinking water levels have revealed a granite sarcophagus of the ancient Egyptian god Osiris in a 30-meter (98 feet) deep tomb at the Giza pyramids, Egyptian archaeologist Zahi Hawass said Wednesday.

Osiris was one of the most important gods of ancient Egypt who according to mythology was murdered by his wicked brother Seth. He was buried by Isis, his sister-wife, and brought back to life as judge of the dead and ruler of the underworld.

Hawass said the sarcophagus, which he dated to 500 BC in the New Kingdom, was surrounded by the remains of four pillars built in the shape of a hieroglyphic 'Bir' or 'House of Osiris'.

The excavation unearthed 3,000-year-old bones and pottery found in the underground water, he said.

"I never excavated this shaft because it was always full of water. But when the water went down about a year ago, we started the adventure,'' he told Reuters.

After dirt and most of the remaining water were cleared from the shaft, located between the Sphinx and the Pyramid of Chefren (Khafre), archaeologists found three underground levels, with the submerged Osiris sarcophagus at the lowest.

"Many people believed there were tunnels going to the Sphinx and another leading to the Great Pyramid but only when we sent a young boy into a tunnel in the west wall (of the tomb shaft) did we find this exciting discovery,'' said Hawass.

Dr. Hawass is the Undersecretary of the State for the Giza Monuments and Director of the Pyramids, whose official website, The Plateau, advertises Egypt's extensive excavation of the ancient monuments. Of interest, the surname "Hawass" derives from "Aiwass" [Horus], who was the spirit guide of Aleister Crowley (1875-1947), head of the English branch of the infamous Ordo Templi Orientis. The OTO is a secret society at one point headed by the leader of the German Secret Service. Crowley also worked for the British and American intelligence services during World Wars I and II; however, it is said that he boasted openly of his occult influence on Adolf Hitler.
"Aleister Crowley is the occultist and Satanist that is maybe the most well known. His works "The Book of the Law", "Magick in Theory and Practice" and "The Book of Thoth" are broadly used in occult circuits. Crowley himself didn't take much credit for having written them, as he stated they were written by automatic handwriting, being channeled from a higher being called Aiwaz (or Aiwass). This being said he had lived in Caldea during the reign of Hammurabis (around 1750 BC), but later, in his book "Magick in Theory and Practice", Crowley identified Aiwaz as his own genius. He was actually very proud of this book, which he used as a Bible for his own religion - Thelema. Crowley looked at man as a sleeping god who gradually started to understand what powers he possesses. He also taught that Satan was identical with the Sumerian devil/god Shaitan, who he stated had been worshiped in the Egyptian deserts long before the ages of the Pharaohs. . . Crowley's messenger taught that the old Age of Osiris soon would follow by the new Age of Horus. But first Earth must bathe in blood. There should be a World War(!)"
Crowley, Hitler and World War II

"In distinction, Crowley claimed that, on the 8th of April 1904"”in Cairo at 12 noon exactly and for the following two days at the exact same time"”he actually heard a voice in his ear, dictating the words of the text (as if through some transmittor in his brain), and that he transcribed them faithfully. It was not "inspired," then, so much as received. The voice itself claimed to be that of Aiwass, or Aiwaz, "the minister of Hoor-paar-kraat," or otherwise, Horus"”the god of force and fire, child of Isis and Osiris, and self-appointed conquering lord of the New Aeon, officially announced through his chosen scribe, "the prince-priest the Beast." This much of Crowley's controversial life and claims is more or less confirmed. It is, as promised, to be found there in the writings themselves"”the proof as it were is in the pudding. Anyone who has read the work, and suffered the resulting conflictive feelings of admiration and disgust, will not doubt that there is something about the "little red book" that puts it in a class all its own. It might be argued that it is simply the work of a poetic genius, were it not for the fact that Crowley was to prove again and again in subsequent works that, for all his magikal prowess and philosophical brilliance, he was anything but a poetic genius. It seems rather as though the book partakes not of the qualities of Crowley, but that, conversely, Crowley himself grew over time to partake of the qualities of the book. And this he did, by his own admission, with boundless reluctance and distaste."

On March 2 of 1999, a special two-hour TV program on the Fox Channel featured the opening of the sealed tombs of the Unknown and the Queen's Pyramids at Giza in Egypt. Dr. Zahi Hawass has served in different capacities as Director of the Egyptian Antiquities Organization, Director General of the Giza Plateau and Saqqara, and presently Undersecretary of the State for the Giza Monuments, Director of the Pyramids. Dr. Hawass presented information on the search for the Hall of Records at the Great Sphinx which is believed by Freemasons and assorted New Agers to contain the records of the lost civilization of Atlantis. To his amazement, Dr. Hawass found instead the tomb of the Egyptian god, Osiris. However, we have been unofficially informed that this televised special was a hoax {a fact we already suspected} according the letter below dated Aug. 28, 1999:
Dear Sir
I have been reading your page on the nwomysteryreligion page.
I have been in correspondence with Dr. Zahi Hawass while researching my book. I too watched the TV special about the "discovery" of the hidden tomb under the Sphinx. Many other knowledgeable historians and Egyptologists have had a little chuckle over that one. It is generally accepted that this program was simply eye candy for the mindless masses.
With a little luck and good management My myself and my writing partner will have our book out in the near future. it will reveal the truth about a good many things that you have mentioned. We are both Master Masons and avid historians.
Don't expect for us to reveal any Masonic secrets, but many of the common conspiracies regarding the true nature of the global power structure, the real purpose of the pyramids and the truth about many of the stories in the bible.
It is our intention to offer this up to open minds that are welded shut by the sort of nonsense that people like yourself spew out.
I mean no disrespect, but I know the truth, from the inside out and you are off by a long shot.
Here is a little tid bit for you to chew on.
The "Kings chamber" in the Great Pyramid was never intended to house dead king. It vault in it's center is a perfect match for the Arc of Moses. The Arc described in the book of Exodus is an exact copy of the Box of Ra ( Egyptian God) not only it's dimensions but the material it was constructed of.
The cap stone of the Great Pyramid was made of solid god [sic], (According to the hieroglyphics) which was connected to the king's chamber by metal rods.
Now the kicker to the whole thing.
The Arc: it's construction was duplicated by a British scientist based on all the available information. It was found to be a basic but effective capacitor (electronic energy storage device)
By setting it on acidic ground or in a salt water solution it generated and discharged a massive electrical charge.
That would explain the references in the bible to the bolts of fire and light that struck down the enemies of God's "chosen" people.
Now . . .word has it that the gold cap stone will be replaced in commemoration of the millenium. Makes you wonder what else will be replaced.
I await your reply.

Yours Truly

Dr. Hawass' excavation of the Giza pyramids in March of 1999 has been investigated by Egyptologists who claim that the chambers "discovered" by Hawass were known in 1935 and were believed at that time to be the 'Tomb of Osiris'.
The Shaft, The Subway & The Causeway - Opening The Lost Tombs
Matters Arising - the facts presented in the programme raise a few questions.

"This section highlights some discrepancies between the discovery of this location as reported in the television programme and other historical reports. It also suggests why Herodotus was told that this location - if indeed it is the same one - was Khufu's burial chamber, and for comparative purposes gives examples of other locations also called the 'Tomb of Osiris'.

"From points 1 and 2 above, Doctor Hawass discovered the subterranean chamber recently, however it is clear from the Excavations At Giza excerpt reproduced on page 1 and the London Daily Telegraph article of the 4th March 1935 reproduced on page 3 that the location was known about many years ago.
"From points 5, 6 and 8 above, on clearing the second level chamber Doctor Hawass found six sidechambers cut into the rock and the shaft descending to the third level chamber. Two of the sidechambers contained red granite sarcophagi, Again, it is clear from the reports cited above that Doctor Selim Hassan was fully aware of the layout of the second chamber with its sidechambers and also of the shaft to the third level, although he believed the two monolithic sarcophagi to be of basalt rather than granite."

Another Egyptology website, Ananda in the Hallway of Osiris, features pictures showing details of the proposed tomb of Osiris and the Giza site and claims that Dr. Hawass' story is consistent with the 1935 discovery:
"Parts of this discoveries are not new at all. Two levels underground had been discovered in 1935, where the Daily Telegraph, of England, published on March the 10th the details of this Tomb. The Osiris section was underwater, however."
Dr. Hawass and the Masonic Egyptologists have engaged in a longstanding controversy regarding the dating of the pyramids, according to Masonic authors, Graham Hancock and Robert Bauval, who were among Hawass' detractors until a recent reconciliation was announced.
"In 1993-4 . . . Dr Zahi Hawass appeared to be adamantly opposed to the notion that the Sphinx might be far older than ancient Egypt - and thus the work of a lost civilization. The reader will recall that the EAO official was particularly incensed by the NBC television film, The Mystery of the Sphinx, that was made about the work of John Anthony West. . . The NBC documentary linked the Sphinx to Atlantis and suggested that the chamber of Thomas Dobecki's seismograph had detected beneath its paws might have some sort of time capsule of Atlantean wisdom and history. Hawass called these claims: 'American hallucinations. West is an amateur. There is absolutely no scientific base for any of this. We have older monuments in the same area. They definitely weren't built by men from Atlantis. It's nonsense and we won't allow our monuments to be exploited for personal enrichment. The Sphinx is the soul of Egypt.'" [The Message of the Sphinx, pp. 305-6]
In late December of 1999, Dr. Hawass cancelled the raplacement of the Great Pyramid capstone that had been scheduled for the eve of the Millennium. The abrupt change of plans was reportedly due the wide publicity about New Age theories of a lost civilization called Atlantis said to have built the Egyptian monuments. Before the decision to cancel the capping of the pyramid, Reuters announced Hawass' displeasure with this Atlantean nonsense in an article, "Millennium music will make pyramids pulsate":
"Hawass, director of the Giza plateau, wants to drive home a message that the pyramids were created by ancient Egyptians, not Freemasons, Jews, aliens or the lost civilization of Atlantis. 'By putting the capstone on top of the pyramid we are saying that we are the originators of this civilization', he says.

"Hawass has planned the highlight of the night's revelry as a riposte to claims propagated on the Internet that the capstone symbol rightly belongs to Freemasons, not ancient Egypt. 'The Masons are using a wrong imitation of the capstone of the Middle Kingdom, he declares." [Reuters, 12/9/99]

Considering Dr. Hawass' aversion to the Atlantis cult, it seems strange that in August of 1998, he would make a presentation to A.R.E. [the Association for Research and Enlightenment of the Edgar Cayce Foundation] Conference. At the conference, Dr. Hawass reported that a recent excavation had led to a deep shaft found under the causeway midway between the Khafre pyramid and the Sphinx -- the place where Hawass discovered the Tomb of Osiris in March of 1999 or February, 2000, or both. At that time [1998], Dr. Hawass told the A.R.E. that he believed this shaft to be a (or the) Tomb of Osiris, and "in some way connected at least symbolically with the Oseirion at Abydos."
A prophecy by the late psychic, Edgar Cayce, foretold that a Hall of Records at the Great Sphinx at Giza would be rediscovered and opened between 1996 and 1998 and that this discovery would be related to the second coming of Christ:

"Headquartered in Virginia Beach in the United States . . . the A.R.E. [Association for Research and Enlightenment] is a multimillion dollar organization that exists to promulgate the teachings and prophecies of the American psychic Edgar Cayce, who died in 1945. Prominent amongst Cayce's pronouncements were many statements. . . to the effect that the Sphinx had been built in 10,500 BC by the survivors of Atlantis who had concealed beneath it a ˜Hall of Records' containing all the wisdom of their lost civilization and the true history of the human race. Cayce prophesied that this Hall of Records would be rediscovered and opened between 1996 and 1998. He connected the opening to the second coming of Christ and asserted that the contents of the Hall would not be shared with the general public until many years after it had first been entered by ˜three who would make of the perfect way of life.'" (The Message of the Sphinx, p. 306)
Also documented in The Message of the Sphinx, by Hancock and Bauval, is the notable role played in the Edgar Cayce/Egypt enterprise by one Lambert Dolphin, a Stanford Research Institute physicist who became a Christian in 1962 and is now an influential minister and Bible teacher with a large following and extensive website of Resource Files. In 1977, Lambert Dolphin traveled to Virginia Beach to negotiate funding from the Edgar Cayce organization for the SRI project at Giza. And, in 1983, as a consultant to NASA and leader of the SRI project at the Great Sphinx, Dolphin helped set up the Independent Mars Project'. It seems that in 1972 the first photographs from Mariner 9 had revealed an area of Mars known as the Elysium Quadrangle where there were four massive tetrahedral pyramids in close proximity and aligned in a definite pattern. The next phase of exploration occurred in 1975 when NASA launched the twin probes Viking 1 and Viking 2. Viking 1 photos produced in 1976 revealed in another area of Mars, Cydonia, the image of a human face and pyramid like structures. The London Daily Mail reported in Aug.t 17-19 1996:
"Former NASA consultant Richard Hoagland is convinced there may be a 'terrestrial connection' between Giza and Cydonia - the region of Mars where the mysterious structures are located - perhaps a common source that imparted the same legacy of knowledge and symbolism on both worlds. Hoagland's interest in Giza began when he met Dr. Lambert Dolphin, a scientist from the Stanford Research Institute (SRI) who had conducted radar and seismographic research to locate hidden chambers near and under the Great Sphinx. Dr. Dolphin was captivated by Hoagland's idea of a 'Martian Sphinx' - the Face - and , in 1983, was instrumental in helping Hoagland set up the Independent Mars Investigation Project under the aegis of SRI..."

Authors of The Message of the Sphinx provide a chronology of events involving Lambert Dolphin and his Stanford Research Institute team whose expertise in using remote sensing technology to search for hidden chambers around and under the Sphinx made possible Dr. Hawass' later discovery of the Tomb of Osiris:
"According to ECF/ARE historians the 1973-4 and 1977 projects paved the way for work. . . that would succeed in discovering hidden chambers. Exactly how and where is not made clear. At any rate in 1978 the ECF/ARE collaborated with the SRI and provided funds (to the tune of about US $50,000) for a more detailed survey of the Sphinx enclosure and the nearby Sphinx Temple." (p. 91)
"Back in Egypt in 1977, a year after the Viking images had first reached the Earth, Mark Lehner [A.R.E.'s ˜man' at Giza] made contact with NASA's Dr. Lambert T. Dolphin, leader of the Stanford Research Institute project at the Sphinx. The reader will recall from Chapter 5 that Lehner was by then already well acquainted with Zahi Hawass.

"Later in 1977 Lambert Dolphin traveled to Virginia Beach to negotiate funding from the Edgar Cayce organization for a proposed new SRI project at Giza. The purpose of this project was to use the latest remote sensing technology to search for hidden chambers around and under the Sphinx -- with Lehner again 'participating as the Edgar Cayce Foundation's "man in Cairo". Several underground cavities were detected by this Sphinx Exploration Project.

"In 1978 Mark Lehner proposed a project on the Sphinx to the American Research Centre in Egypt. The project, again partially financed by the Edgar Cayce group, was approved and went ahead with Lehner as its Field Director. Soon afterwards a United States registered company called Recovery Systems International (RSI) appeared on the scene. As we saw in Chapter 5, it undertook core drillings in front of the Sphinx to investigate the promising underground cavities previously pinpointed by SRI.

"In 1983 Hugh Lynn Cayce died and the management of the Edgar Cayce group was handed to his son, Charles Thomas Cayce. In the same year, ˜The Independent Mars Project' was set up in the United States by Richard Hoagland, a former NASA consultant, and Lambert Dolphin. Meanwhile in 1987 Dr Zahi Hawass completed his education in the United States and returned to Egypt to be appointed as the EAO's Director General of the Giza Plateau.

"In (1983) ˜The Independent Mars Project' was set up in the United States by Richard Hoagland, a former NASA consultant, and Lambert Dolphin. . . "

"In March 1996 Dr Hawass announced that the Egyptian scientist Farouk El Baz (whose name...translates into ancient Egyptian as Horus) had been chosen to lead a team to open the secret door inside the Great Pyramid at the end of the southern shaft of the Queen's Chamber. . (pp. 313-14)

For further details see our report Lambert Dolphin & the Great Sphinx.

Isis ~ The Black Madonna

In the Egyptian mystery religion, the stars are worshipped as gods and are believed to govern the affairs of mankind. Applying the Masonic axiom "As Above, So Below" to the pyramids of Egypt explains why there is so great an interest in these monuments. Hancock and Bauval maintain that the various areas of the pyramids were built with intricate precision so they would be aimed at certain stars and constellations.

"From the Queen's Chamber. . .[t]he southern shaft. . . was aimed at the bright star Sirius. . . This star the ancients associated with the goddess Isis, cosmic mother of the kings of Egypt. . . From the King's Chamber. . .[t]he southern shaft. . .was aimed at Al Nitak (Zeta Oionis) . . .which the ancient Egyptians identified with Osiris, their high god of resurrection and rebirth and the legendary bringer of civilization to the Nile Valley in a remote epoch referred to as Zep Tepi, the 'First Time'." [The Message of the Sphinx, p. 65]
Excavation of the Giza necropolis is of supreme importance to the occult brotherhood in its many expressions. Peddlers of the New Age fantasy expect the monuments will soon reveal remarkable secrets which will lead to the restoration of the lost kingdom of Isis and Osiris, and their son, Horus the King. The latest New Age propaganda claims that Jesus was supposed to communicate to the Jews the good news that the origin of their religion was Egypt. However, we are told that the Apostles botched the Gospel!
"Jesus is presented as having been an initiate of the mysteries of Osiris, the major Egyptian god of his day. . . [who] had passed this esoteric knowledge on to his disciple, John 'the Beloved'. It also claims that Paul and the other Apostles may have founded the Christian Church, but they did so without any knowledge of Jesus true teaching. They were not part of his inner circle. According to Fabre-Palaprat, it was the secret teachings, as given to John the Beloved, which had been preserved and eventually influenced the Knights Templar." [The Templar Revelation, p. 145]
The following statement informs readers that the roots of Judaism are in Egypt! Could this be a future "new revelation" in the Hebrew Roots Movement which already bases its teachings on the Babylonian Talmud? This disturbing claim appears in the pictorial section of The Templar Revelation with no documentation regarding the pictures presented:
"Archaeological discoveries have shown that Judaism itself had its roots in the religion of Egypt. For example, the 'cherubim' found in a ninth-century B.C. Jewish palace (opposite, below) are strikingly similar to winged Egyptian goddesses (opposite, above) (British Museum). Was Jesus attempting to take Judaism back to its true roots?"
Anton Chaitkin describes the infiltration of Europe with the Isis cult through the mediumship of various high adepts, such as Aleister Crowley, Mme. Blavatsky and other notables:
"Edward Bulwer-Lytton, the leading member of the Rosicrucian Society (the Colonial Minister under Lord Palmerston during the Second Opium War) was also the intellectual mentor of Adolph Hitler, George Bernard Shaw (Fabian), Helena Petrovna Blavatsky, Aleister Crowley, Richard Wagner, Benjamin Disraeli, and Karl Haushofer (founder of the Vril Society which helped propel Hitler to power). In 1886 William Butler Yeats, and several other proteges of Bulwer-Lytton formed the Isis-Urania Temple of Hermetic Students of the Golden Dawn. 'This Isis Cult was organized around the 1877 manuscript Isis Unveiled by Madame Blavatsky, in which the Russian occultist called for the British aristocracy to organize itself into an Isis priesthood.'" [p. 539]
The Pontifical Society for the Propagation of the Faith [Fides News Service] stated, "The Pope will visit Sinai and encourage Egypt's hope." What is Egypt's hope? Perchance might Pope Paul II's visit to the Egyptian Pyramids have any connection with the Masonic quest for Horus-King? The Illuminati ceremony in Egypt during the Solar Eclipse of August 11, 1999 is purported to have invoked the Dark Mother, known as Isis in Egypt and various goddesses also called the Black Madonna or Black Virgin. The Templar Revelation identifies Isis as the Black Madonna, on no less authority than a former head of the Priory of Sion:
"The Black Madonna cult is central to the Priory [of Sion]. . .To them at least, there is no doubt about the significance of the Black Madonna. Pierre Plantard de Saint-Clair writes explicitly, 'The Black Virgin is Isis and her name is Notre Dame de Lumiere [Our Lady of the Lights]." [p. 79]
An informative exposition of Jeremiah 7:18 demonstrates that the Papal worship of the Virgin Mary is in essence the worship of the Babylonian Queen of Heaven, who is worshiped today as the Black Madonna by approximately 75% of the world's population! In spite of Dr. Hawass protests that Egypt will give no quarter to the Masonic "pyramidiots", he has extended a warm welcome to New Age groupies who conduct mysterious rituals in the King's and Queen's Chambers at the Great Pyramid.
FEATURE - Pyramids attract New Age millennium pilgrims
CAIRO, Nov 29 (Reuters) - Late at night, long after the last foot-sore tourists have headed back to their hotels, pilgrims of a different kind gather silently at the Great Pyramid of Giza.
Forty-four souls, assembled from as far afield as the United States, Britain, Norway, New Zealand and Israel, patiently await security clearance before ascending to the 4,500 year-old structure, whose meaning has confounded minds for centuries.
They gather their crystals, shawls and thoughts of time, climb the steps and file inside the Pyramid one by one.
The crackle of Egyptian police walkie-talkies occasionally punctures the serenity, but these New Age pilgrims are unperturbed. For them, the night vigil is a homecoming.
"We are a group of people from around the world who have come to spend some time with Ma in Israel and Egypt," says George Riemer, a stockbroker from Bend, Oregon.
"The one thing we have in common is that we are all seekers of truth."
Chalanda Ma is the group's Indian-born, California-based guru. A small, intense woman draped in a white sari, she explains the significance of the Great Pyramid.
"The Pyramids carry the consciousness, the constant of light. It is a pure vehicle of light and harvests those seeking for the light and who come here with the knowledge. Space will activate their energy," she says.
Her group has no name. "I have no beliefs, I do not function with beliefs. In the word belief, there is the word lie, and for me this is not the truth," she says.
Ma leads her followers in a two-hour ritual in the King's Room in the heart of the Great Pyramid.
"Ask yourself, are you committed to yourself, to God? Do you have the willpower to love yourself, and God?
Are you following the path of light, or of darkness?" she asks, eyes closed, her thin, determined voice resonating in the chamber.
One by one her devotees lie down in a lidless granite sarcophagus. "Heal!" Ma exhorts, striking it with a metal rod, as her acolytes produce an eerie drone from musical bell-jars.
The session ends in the Queen's Room, where the group meditates, humming in unison.
As they activate their energy, an electricity generator powering the lights drones in the background.
Down the corridor come the faint sounds of the guards chatting in the entrance.
"It's just like coming home, that's all I can say. Amazing,"says one follower from Israel summing up the general feeling afterwards. This is her first visit to Egypt. "But I know I have been here before, in ancient times," she adds.

Mystery Babylon
To what end is this seemingly eternal quest for the lost civilization of Egypt? One important clue is found in The Templar Revelation, which acknowledges that Isis and Osiris may never have existed but were instead "archetypes" of the ideal state to which mankind will supposedly attain in the New Age:

"Isis. . .was worshipped as a holy virgin. But although she was also mother of Horus, this presented no problem to the minds of her millions of followers. For whereas modern Christians are expected to accept the Virgin birth as an article of faith and an actual historical event, the followers of Isis (Isians) and other pagans faced no such intellectual dilemma. To them, Zeus, Venus or Ma'at may or may not have once walked the earth: what mattered was what they embodied. Each of the pantheon ruled over his or her own area of human life; for example, the Egyptian goddess Ma'at dealt with the concept of justice, both in the material world and when the souls of the dead were weighed in the balance. The gods were understood to be living archetypes, not historical characters. Isians did not waste their time searching for cloths that may have wrapped the body of Osiris, nor did they consider it important to find splinters of the box in which he was confined. Far from being an unsophisticated and ignorant religion, theirs appears to have had a profound grasp of the human psyche.
"Isis was worshipped as both Virgin and Mother -- but not as a Virgin Mother. Isians would have considered the notion of the Virgin birth frankly ridiculous: the gods may be capable of wonders, but they do not demand that their worshippers suspend their disbelief quite so much. The worship of most major goddesses emphasized their essential femininity by dividing it up into three main aspects , each representing the lifecycle of real women. First, there is the Virgin, then the Mother, then the Crone; all three are also linked to the new moon, the full moon and the dark side of the moon. Each goddess, including Isis, was understood to stand for the whole female experience, including sexual love, and therefore could be invoked to help a woman with any kind of problem -- unlike the Virgin Mary whose own personal purity is an impenetrable barrier for those who would like to share their sexual problems with her. . . Isis, a full-blooded woman who represents a complete female lifecycle. . . Isis, a beautiful girl-goddess to whom women could pray -- with a clear conscience -- about absolutely anything, appealed to women from all cultures. . ." [pp. 77-8]

According to this problematical logic, the superiority of the religion of Isis lies in the fact that it is not intellectually bound by historical fact or doctrinal truth as a frame of reference, but rather requires faith in that which is pure speculation, i.e., superstition. Although the "mindless masses" may soon be informed that Isis and Osiris are fictitious characters, their origins can be traced to an actual historical figure -- Nimrod:
And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the Lord. And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel. . . Genesis 10:8-10
Alexander Hislop's volume, The Two Babylons, chronicles the global dispersion of the Babylonian mystery religion of Nimrod and Semiramus from remote antiquity to the present era.
"The Babylonians, in their popular religion, supremely worshipped a Goddess Mother and a Son, who was represented in pictures and in images as an infant or child in his mother's arms. . . From Babylon, this worship of the Mother and the Child spread to the ends of the earth. In Egypt, the Mother and the Child were worshipped under the names of Isis and Osiris.* [* Osiris, as the child called most frequently Horus. BUNSEN.]. . . It was to glorify Nimrod that the whole Chaldean system of iniquity was formed. He was known as Nin, "the son," and his wife as Rhea, who was called Ammas, "The Mother." The name Rhea, as applied to Semiramis, had another meaning from what it had when applied to her, who was really the primeval goddess, the "mother of gods and men." [Hislop, p. 20]
Scripture not only identifies the origins of the Babylonian system upon which the Egyptian mystery religion is based, but describes its demonic nature and catastrophic denouement. Pope John Paul II's historic visit to Egypt would seem to argue that Mystery Babylon the Great of Revelation 17 is not confined to the Roman Catholic Church, but encompasses the entire decentralized system of mystery religions -- which will be led by a Masonic Pope to the ash heap of condemned humanity.
And Babylon shall become heaps, a dwellingplace for dragons, an astonishment, and an hissing, without an inhabitant. Jer. 51:37
And for this cause God shall send them a strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. II Thess. 2:9
And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
For all the nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. Rev. 18:2,3
Verse 3 of Revelation 18 can certainly be said to describe the present kings of the earth. Ananda in the Hallway of Osiris has posted a press release, appropriately titled the Sandpit Of Royalty, which reveals their great interest in developments in Egypt:
"Egypt's age-old history and numerous imposing monuments has always had a fascinating effect on kings and queens all over the world. Egypt's leading archaeologist Zahi Hawass has been touring Scandinavia recently and gave lectures to Queen Margrethe in Copenhagen as well as the Swedish King Gustav, Queen Sylvia and 75 members of their family and staff at the royal castle in Stockholm. On those occasions he revealed the most recent and secret finds in Giza."


1. Jean Doresse, Secret Book Of The Egyptian Gnostics," p. 12.

"Gnosticism appeared originally in Syria. It is in Samaria and the Valley of the Lycos that we trace it for the first time. Simon [the sorcerer] is a man of Gitta and Samaria; Menander is originally of Capparetia - again in Samaria; Satornel is of Antioch; Cerdon is a Syrian; Cerinthus comes from Asia Minor.;...In the time of Hadrian (A.D. 110-38), Gnosticism passes over from Syria into Egypt: it is in Alexandria that the greatest doctors of the heresy are flourishing - Bacilides, Carpocrates, and Valentinus. Then it reaches Rome ; and this is the moment when the Christian doctors realize the importance of heresies which, in the East, had been incubating for a considerable time... Marcion was in Rome from 140, and thence expelled by the Church in 144, being by excommunicated by his own father, the Bishop of Sinope."

2. Michael Howard, The Occult Conspiracy, p. 142.

3. Columbia Encyclopedia, "Copt," p. 652.

4. Ibid., "Maronites," p.1700.

"Maronites, a Christian community of Arabs in communion with the Pope. By emigration they have spread to Cyprus, Palestine, Egypt, South America and the United States and now number about 1 million. Their liturgy (said mainly in liturgical Syriac) is of the Antiochian type, with innovations taken from the Latin rite. Their ecclesiastical head, under the Pope, is called Patriarch of Antioch; he lives in Lebanon... The Maronites have been a distinct community since the 7th cent., when they separated in the doctrinal dispute over Monotheletism; they returned to communion with the Pope in the 12th cent. In the 19th cent., massacres of Maronites by the Druses brought French intervention; this gave France its modern hold in Lebanon and Syria. Besides the Maronites, there are two other groups in Syria in communion with the Pope - the Melkites and the Syrian Catholics."

5. John Davis and Naomi Rice, Messiah & The Second Coming, Coptic Press, 1882, backcover.

For the Black women and girls who will read this. I'm putting the below article here so you can recognize the mindset of a white racist fiend and come to understand why they would look past all the volumous TRUTH out there with regard to Black Jesus/Mary/Miriam,Israel, Egypt, Babylon.

Since we have a UN-IDENTIFIED live specimen on the board, the below article fits perfect in with the specimen 'meles' and her sidekick colored boy 'Thawatcher' whose mother he vulgarly admitted to repeatedly defilng so showing his nature to be of the lowest base.

We see the thing is as the Bible says, 'of Satan.' It with the arrogance of satan bursts into a board demanding blacks heed it's presence. It then shows itself inhumane enough to 'denounce' all black truth so proving the Bible right when it says, such satanic beings would 'strain at a gnat and swallow a camel'. Oh, and of course, their is it's colored mule bowed down, riding in the white fiend with a big grin on its' face (Tha hee-haw jackass) does this in the same way the colored buzzards of Africa bow down prostrate and let the white male take over Africa. Actually, I don't blame the white enemy without for he 'saw a fool and bumped his head.'

Now where were we, the satanic specimen is 'arrogant,' like Satan, a fool who 'strains at a gnat and swallows a camel' as you have seen. And, the white fiend is full of demonic hate for all things BLACK. While 'its' colored jackass bucks and beighs for it. Well, all God did was use a Black woman to put forth truth and out popped our live exhibition showing that the TRUTH HURTS, REVEALS AND CAUSES DEMONS TO SQUEAL IN UTTER ANGUISH.

So whenever the UN-IDENTIFIED THING bursts in to a black woman's site to denounce BLACK WOMEN TRUTH you know that the TRUTH is AGAINST such evil. See how important it is to SPEAK THE TRUTH IN SEASON AND OUT, BLACK WOMAN? As TRUTH alone, will shine it's light and reveal the true evil in your midst.

Some doctrines of racial supremacy as classically taught
in Euro/American institutions, textbooks and media:

PHYSICAL CALIBRATION DOCTRINE: In which white anthropologists treat people as racial specimens, measuring "cephalic indices" and attempting to prove superiority of the "white" brain. Ugly racist terminology: "prognathism," "platyrhiny," "steatopygous," "sub-Egyptian." Mug-shot lineups of "the Veddan female," "Arapaho male, "Negroid type," "Mongoloid specimen" chacterize this approach. Out of favor in the mid-20th-century, it has enjoyed a revisionist comeback with sociobiology and works claiming racial differentials in intelligence, such as "The Bell Curve."

TECHOLOGICAL CALIBRATION DOCTRINE: Insists on forcing archaeological finds as well as living cultures into a grid of "development" based on the use of certain tools, materials and techniques valued by "Western" scholars. Example: "They were a stone age civilization who never discovered the wheel!" Forces cultures into a progressional paradigm: Old and New Stone Ages, Bronze Age, Iron Age, Industrial Revolution, Space Age. This classification ignores the complexity of culture, and the fact that metallurgic technology and military might are not the ultimate measure of advanced culture.

STAGES OF DEVELOPMENT DOCTRINE: The assumption that "primitive" cultures represent lower "stages" in historical evolution, and have yet to attain advanced forms of culture. One English scholar referred to "the child-races of Africa." Usually, social hierarchy, militarization and industrialization are taken as measures of "advanced" civilizations. In the 19th century, scholars openly used the terms "savage," "barbarian," "civilized." Though these offensive words have (mostly) been dropped, the underlying assumptions are still quite influential.

SPREAD OF CIVILIZATION DOCTRINE: Credits all achievements to conquering empires, assuming their superiority in science, technology, and government. Adherents are usually incapable of perceiving advanced earth-friendly systems of land management, agronomy, medicine, collective social welfare networks, healing, astronomical knowledge, or profound philosophical traditions of peoples considered "primitive" by dominant "Western" standards.

PASSING OF THE TORCH DOCTRINE: Claims a chain of cultural transmission from Mesopotamia and Egypt to Greece to Rome to western Europe to the USA, leaving vast gaps where the history of the rest of the world should be. (The discussion never returns to Egypt or Iraq to consider what happened there after the fall of their ancient empires.) Most of the planet's cultures are discussed only in relation to the European conquest, if mentioned at all. As a result, few people have any idea of the history of Sumatra, Honduras, Niger, Ecuador, Mozambique, Ohio, Hokkaido, Samoa, or even European countries such as Lithuania or Bosnia.

IF IT WAS GREAT, IT MUST HAVE BEEN WHITE: If advanced science, art, or architecture is found in Africa or South America, then Phoenecians, Greeks, Celts, Vikings (or, in the extreme case, space aliens) must be invoked to explain their presence. (Here, whiteness often functions as a relative concept, as "lighter than.") This bias gives rise to a pronounced tendency to date American or African cultures later than warranted, and as a result dating is constantly having to be revised further back into the past as evidence of greater antiquity piles up.

Corollary: IF IT WAS WHITE, IT MUST HAVE BEEN GREAT. Thus, the conqueror Charlemagne was a great man, in spite of his genocidal campaign against the Saxons, but the Asian conquerors Attila the Hun and Genghis Khan were simply evil. Stereotypes of head-hunters picture Africans (in the absence of any evidence for the practice) but never Celtic head-hunters in France and Britain -- much less Lord Kitchener making off with the Mahdi's skull in Sudan, or U.S. settlers taking scalps and body parts of Indian people. This doctrine also underlies the common assumption that European conquest must have improved life for subject peoples.

A 19th century French engraving idealizes the conquest of Algeria as a showering of the benefits of superior civilization on abject, genuflecting North Africans.

IF IT WAS NOT WHITE, AND ITS GREATNESS IS UNDENIABLE, THEN IT MUST BE DEPRECATED IN SOME WAY: Example:The Epic of Man, published in the '60s by Time/Life Books, says of the advanced civilization of ancient Pakistan: "It is known that a static and sterile quality pervaded Indus society." It used to be the academic fashion to call ancient Egypt a "moribund" civilization which "stifled creativity." Similar writings dismissed the "Incas" (Quechua) as "totalitarian," or the Chinese as "isolated" and "resistant to change."

The AFRICAN GAP DOCTRINE: After examining the first humans hundreds of thousands of years ago, this historical approach completely skips over most of the African archaeological record. It discusses ancient Egypt but ascribes its civilization to "the Middle East," denying its African identity and archaeological connections with Saharan and southern Nilotic civilizations. Saharan civilization, Ile-Ife or Mwanamutapa are not discussed at all. Africa is simply dropped from historical consideration until the era of European slaving and colonization.

The BERING STRAIT DOCTRINE insists that all indigenous American peoples came across a land bridge between Siberia and Alaska, filtering down through Central America into South America. Problem: numerous archaeological sites in the Americas predate any possible Bering Strait migration by many thousands of years. Access from Alaska to the rest of North America was blocked for millennia by two great ice sheets that covered Canada. An narrow opening that might have allowed passage appeared much too late (about 13,500 years ago) to explain the growing evidence that people were living in both North and South America much earlier than these "first" migrations.

By 1997-98, the tide of opinion began to turn: several scientific conclaves declared that a majority of attending scholars rejected the Bering Strait theory as a full explanation of how the Americas were peopled.The long-doctrinal hypothesis of Clovis hunters as the first immigrants is crumbling before the new dating, as hundreds of pre-Clovis sites pile up: Cactus Hill, Virginia (13,500 BP); Meadowcroft Rock Shelter in Pennsylvania (14,000 - 17,000 Before Present); Monte Verde (12,500 BP); Pedra-Furada, Brazil (15,000 BP, and possibly as old as 32,000 BP).

Bering Strait diehards discount the oral histories of indigenous Americans, such as Hopi accounts of migrations across "stepping-stones" in the Pacific. In spite of the huge diversity among the American peoples and differences between most Americans and east Asians, all are declared to be of "Mongoloid racial origin." After the initial press stampede declaring "Kennewick Man" to be "white," study of the genetic evidence shows something entirely different. Instead, it appears that there have been several waves of migration: from central China, from the ancient Jomon culture of Japan, from south Asia or the Pacific islands. And "Luzia," an 11,500-year-old female skeleton in Brazil "appeared to be more Negroid in its cranial features than Mongoloid," in the stodgy anthropological terminology of the New York Times (Nov 9, 1999). But there is also a uniquely North American X-haploid group of mitochondrial DNA, which could uphold American Indian traditions of origins in North America.


STEREOTYPING entire peoples as mad, uncontrollable threats: "Wild Indians," "Yellow Hordes" or "the Yellow Peril." As inferior nonhumans: "primitives," "savages," "gooks," "niggers" -- this last term used not only against African-Americans, but also by English colonizers of Egypt and India. Even the word "natives," which originally meant simply the people born in a country and by extension the aboriginal inhabitants, took on heavy racist coloration as an inferior Other.

POLARIZATION: "Scientific thought" vs. "primitive belief"; "undeveloped" vs "civilized"; or "the world's great religions" vs. "tribal superstitions," "cults," "idolatry" or "devil-worship." Depending on where it was created, a sculpture could either be a "masterpiece of religious art" or an "idol," "fetish," or "devil." Few people realize that "Western" scientists did not match the accuracy of ancient Maya calculations of the length of the solar year until the mid-20th century.

Indians who resist colonization and land theft are commonly portrayed as evil in popular media, which applies negative labels such as "Renegades."

RENAMING: Dutch colonists called the Khoi-khoi people "Hottentots" (stutterers). Russians called the northwest Siberian Nentsy "Samoyed" (cannibals). These are blatant examples, but many nationalities are still called by unflattering names given by their enemies: "Sioux" (Lakota); "Miao" (Hmong); "Lapps" (Saami); "Basques" (Euskadi); "Eskimos" (Inuit). European names have replaced the originals in many places: Nigeria, Australia, New Caledonia, New Britain, etc. (But "Rhodesia" bit the dust.)

DEGRADATION OF MEANINGS: "Mumbo jumbo" has become a cliché signifying meaningless superstitions, but it comes from a Mandinke word -- mama dyambo -- for a ritual staff bearing the image of a female ancestor. (Look it up in any good dictionary.) "Fetish" now connotes an obsessive sexual fixation, but originated as a Portuguese interpretation of sacred West African images as "sorcery" (feitição). The holy city of Islam is often appropriated in phrases like "a Mecca for shoppers."

DOUBLE-THINK: Conquest becomes "unification," "pacification,""opening up," and conquered regions are dubbed "protectorates." The convention is to use Europe as the standard, writing texts from the viewpoint of the conquerors / colonizers. Thus, a Rajasthani rebellion against English rule was termed the "Indian Mutiny." A peculiarity of this thinking is the tendency to refer to times of bloody invasions and enslavement with respectful affection, as in "The Golden Age of Greece" and "The Glory That Was Rome," or "How the West Was Won." British subjugation of southern Nigeria is recast as The Pacification of the Primitive Tribes of the Lower Niger.

A contributor toMen Become Civilized, edited by Trevor Cairns explains it all to children:

"When the king of one city conquered others, he would have to make sure that all the people in all the cities knew what to do. He would have to see that they all had rules to follow, so that they would live peacefully together."

Double-think finds ways to recast genocide as regrettable but necessary, due to failings of the people being killed, who are somehow unable to "adapt." Distancing the agent is key here, obscuring the violence with the idea that some kind of natural process is at work: "vanishing races," "by that time the Indians had disappeared."


Hollywood tomtoms beat as fake Indians jump up and down, uttering brainless cries and grunts. There's the "squaw" complex in literature and cinema, the faithful Indian sidekick, and Robinson Crusoe's "Man Friday." John Wayne as the Western movie hero, saying: "There's humans and then there's Comanches." Or in real life, justifying settler theft of Indian countries: "There were great numbers of people who needed new land, and the Indians were selfishly trying to keep it for themselves."

This picture appeared in an ad for insurance.
Advertising is an important transmitter of historical misrepresentation. It draws on colonial mythologies such as the notion that the Dutch "bought" Manhattan for the equivalent of $24 in trade goods --in spite of the fact that the Indians did not think of land as something that could be sold. The role of violence (including massacres after which Staten Island settlers played football with Wappinger heads) is obliterated.

Tarzan goes up against witch doctors and eye-rolling African chiefs. The Caribbean shown as full of fearful, superstitious natives and zombies, Arabs who have nothing to do all day but loll around in harems, or cheat the white hero. Seductive Suzie Wongs, thieving Mexicans, and shiftless and sexually insatiable African-Americans. Movies depicting the Chinese as obsequious and deceitful, Arabs as treacherous, Africans as ignorant and barbaric.


The Mande were farming millet and other crops in West Africa in 6500-5000 BCE.

Temples in Peru and India are much older than the Parthenon.

People in Mississippi, Illinois and Mexico traded with each other and exchanged ideas and symbols, as the the sea-faring Ecuadorians did with Costa Rica and western Mexico.

A small-statured Black people built the oldest civilization in southeast Asia, leaving megalithic temples and statuary in south India, Cambodia, Sumatra and other Indonesian islands.

Archaeology shows that the formative influences on ancient Egypt came from Sudan and the Sahara, not the "Middle East."

The oldest megalithic calendar in the world has recently been discovered in the Egyptian Sahara, dating back to 7000 years ago. European megaliths (which spread from the south) may have an African origin.

Polynesian mariners had begun navigating by the stars and settling the vast ocean expanses of the Pacific islands before the time of Moses.


In the last half century the boundaries of "acceptable" history have been expanded by a multidisciplinary approach, including sources previously dismissed: orature (oral tradition), linguistics, anthropology, social history, art, music and other cultural sources. More recently, the social locations of historians have come under consideration as a factor shaping their perspectives, along with a sense that there is no absolutely "objective" view of history. Past claims of objectivity have biases clearly visible today, notably in siding with European settlers and slavers against non-christian cultures, and the almost total eclipse of female acts and experience from historical accounts.

A reader who might react negatively to a blatant expression of racism often misses perceiving one cloaked in scholarly language, in assumptions, judgements and misinformation most people have not been educated to catch. It does not occur to many people to question a pronounced overemphasis on Europe, the smallest continent (actually, a subcontinent of Asia.) If a chapter or two on African and Asian history is inserted in a textbook, publishers go ahead and call it a world history. Typically, media depictions of history have not caught up with information now available in specialized academic sources, and continue to present the old stereotypes and distortions as fact.

More on Racism, History and Lies


In the early '90s a hue and cry was raised in the national media against "multiculturalism." It threatened the very foundations of Western Civilization, explained an outpouring of magazine articles and newspaper columns which shed much heat but little light. A Newsweek cover blared: "THOUGHT POLICE: There's a 'Politically Correct' Way to Talk About Race, Sex and Ideas. Is This the New Enlightenment -- Or the New McCarthyism?" As if this wasn't heavy-handed enough, it adds a warning, "Watch What You Say." (December 24, 1990)

"In U.S. classrooms, battles are flaring over values that are almost a reverse image of the American mainstream. As a result, a new intolerance is on the rise." William A. Henry III, "Upside Down in the Groves of Academe", Time Magazine, April 1, 1991

"'It used to be thought that ideas transcend race, gender and class, that there are such things as truth, reason, morality and artistic excellence, which can be understood and aspired to by everyone, of whatever race, gender or class.' Now we have democracy in the syllabus, affirmative action in the classroom. 'No one believes in greatness.' Bate says mournfully. 'That's gone.'" Op-Ed, New York Times Magazine, by Gertrude Himmelfarb, June 5, 1991

"If there is insufficient authentic African culture to meet the demands of self-esteem, then culture must be borrowed from ancient Egypt. No black pharaohs? A few must be invented. Not enough first-rate women poets? Let second-raters be taught instead." James Kilpatrick, "Poisoning the Groves of Academe," San Francisco Chronicle, April 15, 1991

The assumption that were are no great women poets, no black pharaohs, no other greatness than the usual diet of "Western Civilization" is so ingrained that it is regarded as incontrovertible. Protesting the monochrome, all-male landscape of classic pedagogy becomes "intolerance." But what then are we to call the refusal to open up media and educational horizons to the full spectrum of human achievement?


A response to John Baines' review (August 11, 1991) of Cheikh Anta Diop's Civilization or Barbarism and Martin Bernal's Black Athena:

To the Editor, New York Times Book Review:

Mr. Baines' review of Diop and Bernal express alarm that their books "attack modern conceptions of the origins of Western Civilization" by showing the anteriority of African (especially Egyptian) achievements. It seems to me that he would like to deny the context of the whole discussion, which has been centuries of exalting the Greeks as the fount of Western Civilization and denying the role of Africa in the ancient world. Egypt is treated as part of the "Middle East," and her relations with the rest of Africa ignored. In this context, to demand an "intellectual contribution that will stand without reference to issues of race" is to perpetuate an injurious status quo.

This denial is especially ludicrous in the frequently-heard claim that because Egyptians were "ethnically mixed," they were not black. Southern African peoples are ethnically mixed, yet it would occur to no one that they are other than black. More to the point, if an ancient Egyptian were to find herself in the United States, she would fall within the range of colors we describe as "black." This business of reddish-brown-skinned men and golden-skinned women was a convention in Egyptian art (and one adopted by the Cretans, Greek vases, and Etruscans, bearing out the hypothesis of Egyptian influence). If Mr. Baine wants to take the golden women as a racial marker for light-skinned Egyptians, is he also willing to concede dark-brown-skinned Etruscan men? His claim that considering the race of the Egyptians is "unhelpful"--and the many others who declare it irrelevant--is coy and evasive.

Max Dashu, Suppressed Histories Archives

[The Times did not publish this letter.]
Originally posted by Melesi:
Yes, but none of them are ancient, and therefore all of them are false.

Creature Melesi I'll throw this one at ya, and be sure to catch it real good ya hear? Since you have shown the BLACK WOMEN looking in that you are obsessed over me, and bowwed down sniffing at my backside, demented though you be, you must surely not only recognize my love for jalepenos but I want you to recognize that your obsession, fixation, over MY GREATNESS is really kind of kinky, but if you must be a bowwed down, drag-a-long, sniffing at my backside, do keep in mind that you're an exhibition only, not to be talked to on any other occassion other than for laughs, what with you being COWARDLY AFRAID OF A BLACK WOMAN to the point that you are skeered to give your RACE AND GENDER. You are my voluntary disrespected sidekick and though I am amused as you show the TRUTH of your DEMON NATURE that you call CHRIST-LIKE If you had half a brain, what a half wit you'd be, but still 'sniff,sniff' on at my backside as I'm kinda flattered for all your UNDIVIDED ATTENTION.

Thanks for your support.
Melesi I am pleading with you, can you stay out of her way please. You are giving her the chance to make a monkey out of you and in the process ridicule her pet hate, which is the black male. I must admit I log in to have a good laugh as I watch her make mince meat out of anyone unfortunate enough to be at the receiving end of the vinegar tongue. I am sure there are many like me who log on just to watch the show and roll on the floor laughing. Unfortunately you have allowed yourself to be a source of amusement. I know you are a decent fellow that do not deserve the treatment so please desist from responding to her posts as she has made it clear she only wants to talk to the sisters

Is it just talk or are you for solutions? If you are GENUINELY interested in solving black problems? Then join us at
I applaud Prophetessofrage! Keep teaching the sisters my dear Sister! Good knowledge won't hurt, it's the key to freedom. Only fools and Ignorants are oppressed. For the haters, don't stress, at best ignore them. Justice, Supreme ethereal Truth is about to reign on the planet earth again and no 'human' or physical force will stop it.

Peace and Knowledge.


[This message was edited by Afroman on November 15, 2003 at 01:41 AM.]
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Afroman:
I applaud Prophetessofrage! Keep teaching the sisters my dear Sister! Good knowledge won't hurt, it's the key to freedom. Only fools and Ignorants are oppressed. For the haters, don't stress, at best ignore them. Justice, Supreme ethereal Truth is about to reign on the planet earth again and no 'human' or physical force will stop it.

Peace and Knowledge.


Hi AfroMan thanks for your support. Yes, it is important to put the BLACK TRUTH out for our daughters to read, know and comprehend as TRUTH alone will set the captive FREE.

This is why I address my posts to BLACK WOMEN about BLACK WOMEN I can't help it if white demon fiends are so sizzled by the truth that they take me SERIOUS ENOUGH to sniff up and down the board after me, as when I don't take someone SERIOUS I don't ADDRESS THEM AS THEY ARE NOT WORTH IT, and when they insist on being so OBSESSED AND FIXATED UPON A BLACK WOMAN that they SERIOUSLY BURST ON THE SCENE like a spook come-a-haunting JOKE, who could take such a boob SERIOUS as we blacks are used to the arrogant, demonic nature of such sorts. That's how you prove you DON'T TAKE ONE SERIOUS eh? Big Grin

At any rate, on a SERIOUS note, again I thank you for your support. As I was logging out I happened to see this post of yours' and it is so appropriate to go along with the BLACK MADDONA AND SON theme I thought to place it over here. I hope you don't mind as it is more proof of the MOTHER/SON divinity aspect. It actually shows us that the ANCIENT BLACK ISRAELI CULTURE got the MOTHER/SON DIVINE concept from ANCIENT BLACK/AFRICANS SISTERS/BROTHERS who they intermarried. Khemet/Egypt, Sumeria and the such.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------First Woman and Man: "Mother-Right"

The concept of a family with a father, mother, and child (or patriarchy), is unfortunately not a true picture of the original family. The first type of family was matriarchal since the role of the father in procreation was unknown. Even today, among tribes in Central Australia and the Trobriand Islands, we find people possessing no knowledge of the nature of paternity. In such a society, even if the father lives with the mother, he is not considered the head of the family.

Available evidence concludes that the earliest human groups or families consisted not of father, mother, and their descendants, but of mother and her descendants in the female line, since no other line of descent was recognized at that time. The system of female descent was known as "Mother-Right."

The role of gender in the evolution of man is very important. Most of all of the existing evidence opposes the theory of male superiority. In nearly all animal species, the female is the superior and dominant type. Even in the human race, before the rise of civilization, female rule was practically universal. Prior to the vertebrate level, the male sex is relatively unimportant.

In primitive society humans lived in groups or clans each of which was based on common descent in the female line, and the members were joined together for mutual protection, and marriage within the group was forbidden. Members of one group would have to pick a mate from another group. This type of matrimony is known as exogamy, this promiscuity was an evolution that led successively to group-marriage, loose monogamy, and finally the patriarchal family of today.

In primitive society, exogamy is closely connected with another system called totemism. Totems of kindred groups were first formed for food supply purposes. A plentiful food supply and improved tools permitted people to settle permanently in villages. Land ownership became a part of a cooperative family venture, after which is when the structure began to change from matriarchal (mother) to patriarchal (father), or the "Father-Right" family of today.
Originally posted by Prophetessofrage:
Hi Black women check out this link it has tons of information on Black history and the women of antiquity.

The Black Madonna In Europe

"Black Madonna is a nickname used in Europe.
It refers to the skin tones of Mary and the baby Jesus. Mary, Jesus St Joseph lived in a hot arid climate.
Their skin tone would be dark brown
or olive in order to survive the intensity of the sun and avoid skin cancer.
It wasn't until the Renaissance that they begin to have paintings of Jesus and Mary with alabaster skin, blue eyes and blond hair.
Previously, all religious artwork reflected the olive skin, black or brown hair and eyes of the Holy Family and the Apostles"

[This message was edited by Prophetessofrage on November 06, 2003 at 07:07 AM.]

Where is Prophetess???? Does she still post here???


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