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I never understood the claim that European Jews are not real Hebrews.

Given the persecution they experienced, wouldn't Europeans deciding to live as Jews be a lot like heterosexual white Americans deciding en masse to masquerade as gay black men? It doesn't make sense.

Thoughts?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "I have not always been right, but I have always been sincere." ~ W.E.B. Du Bois ~~~~~~~~~~~
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quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
I never understood the claim that European Jews are not real Hebrews.

Given the persecution they experienced, wouldn't Europeans deciding to live as Jews be a lot like heterosexual white Americans deciding en masse to masquerade as gay black men? It doesn't make sense.

Thoughts?


HonestBrother,

That's an execllent questions! The American conception of a Jew is actually just a modern Ashkenazi Jew. There are 4 main types of Jew; the Ashkenzi, who are from Eastern Europe; the Sephardic Jews, from the Meditteranean and Iberia (especially Spain); the Ethiopian Jews, still in Eastern Africa; and the Mizrahi, Jews who remained in the Middle East. The Ashkenazi were said to be Jews by conversion. In the Middle Ages (~600-1200, dates very a bit), there was a group in southeastern Europe called the Khazars (sometimes called Khazaks in literature). Because of their location, their kingdom was between the the Christian north and the newly Islamic south. The Khazars thrived on trade, and didn't want to get involved in a religious war between the powerful Christian Byzantines or the powerful Islamic Caliphate. Thus when tensions between Muslims and Christians heightened, their king decided to go neutral and declare himself and all his subjects to be of the Jewish faith. Despite longheld persecution of Jews by both Christians and Muslims, during this period it was better to be a Jew than to be embroiled in an ever growing Christo-Islamic dispute. After the fall of the Khazar kingdom, the people spread across eastern Europe (most notably Russia) and moved westward as well.

Ethnically, the Askenazi were believed to be orginally similar to Armenians and other groups in southeastern Europe/northweastern Asia. During their spread through Europe, the Askenazi interbred with local ethnic groups, although had a tendency to remain surprising insular. As a group they stemmed from a common people and had significantly enough interbreeding to gain light eyes and hair, yet still relatively little inter-ethnic mating. Thus while appearing to look like any other white person, Ashkenazi from different countries are still closely genetically related to one another. Because their origin is not Hebrew, but Eurasian, many don't consider them to be "True Jews". As for why would any apparently white person want to have the burden of persecution such Jewish identification would prove, consider: why would many "passable" mulattoes, quadroons, and octoroons in the pre-Civil Rights South still identify as Black?
Last edited {1}
**Piggy-backing on FreedomHournal's thread on "Who Are the Hebrews"**

I think it's important to make a distinction between Jewishness in regard to religion, Jewishness in regardsethnicity, and Jewishness in respect to culture. They're not one and the same:

RELIGION
Anyone can adopt Judaism, and thus be a religious Jew.

ETHNICITY
One can be of any religion (or none), yet still identify with the term "Jew" as it historically relates to race. For example, there are many atheists who identify as Jewish because their families originated in eatsern Europe, or had a history of anti-semetic persecution.

CULTURE
There are people who do not practice Judaism, and who identify as a "white" as opposed to a Jew , but will recognize that historically their family was ethnically Jewish. They may still like "Jewish" food, music, and traditions, but otherwise are far removed from "Jewishness".

One last note: anti-semetic doesn't refer only to Jews. I used the word myself in this post, but Semite is a linguistic category and also a racial category, of which there are many ethnicities. Arabs, Berbers, Palestinians, Syrians, and a good portion of Egypians and Lebanese are all ethnically Semitic peoples. You can dislike Arabs and love Jews, and technically still be anti-semetic.
quote:
Originally posted by ZAKAR:
The oldest Hebrews to my knowlege come from Ethiopia


Yes, the Beta Iseal(Children of Isreal) also known derogatorily as the Falashas, of which, Dr. Ben's Father was one(and he was raised as such). His mother was an Afro-Puerto Rican.

The Beta Isreal speak a version of Hebrew that was previosely believed to be a dead language and they were considered a lost tribe(before Ashkenazi contact of course, the Yemenese Jews had contact with them for centuries). They also did not adhere to, or know about the Babylonian Talmud and only followed the teachings in the Torah. They are oppressed and exploited by the Ashkenazm (as are the other so-called 'Black Jews' mwntioned above) and occupy the lower end of the economic caste system(second only to Palestinians and illegal immigrants) in the imperialist borgeoise state of Isreal. They even made them get 're-circumsized'(aka get their penises pricked) so the could be 'real Jews' before they were aloud into Isreal.

The Ashkenazm also discriminate against the other "Black Jews" Sephardim, Mizrahim(Yemenese ect.) because they say they don't want Jewish culture to become 'orientaized'.

Also, Theodore Herzl, the ideological founder of Zionism, was an atheist and he actually prefered having 'Isreal' in Mozambique or Uganda, but these placed didn't have a Biblical excuse for occupation, so Palestine was an 'easier' target for Amerikkkan and Brittish backed colonialism in the ideological sense.

Damn Zionists!

Sorry for rattling on, I've given two presentations on Zionism in the last week so I'm a little worked up.

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