This is what I mean. These conversations can never take place without the females interjecting Tyrone or whatever other muthafucka they feel like beating up on.

Anyway, I'm done.

You ladies are free to hate on men now...

Bye!
Take the one-sided gender references (the phenomenon should be offensive whether it's Black men or women using the tactic) out and I agree with:
quote:
I hate to hear a black man put use down because he prefers something other then us to justify his actions... I just get heated when black men put us down to justify why they date other nationalities.


Raheem, you might have another riot on your hands!

HB - be careful! Your worldview at 23 was probably different than it is 35. Give qty a chance to live & adjust hers. Clearly, Tampa, has a lot to do with how she views things. I would bet 5lbs. of protein that if she went to school in the AUC, her outlook on Black dating would be a little different.

To all the advocates of IR relationships - how do you manage the culture conflicts along with the normal gender conflicts?
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
Well lets just say this...........i cant get a black man.


I find this very hard to believe. Are you sure that you actually want a Black man? You've explained the dating scene in Tampa many times, but I have a feeling there's more to it than that.

The chances of me finding a Black woman where I live is almost non-existant. That's because there just aren't any here. But there are Black men in Tampa. Considering the statistics we just explored, it can't be all the white women's doing. Can it?
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
To all the advocates of IR relationships - how do you manage the culture conflicts along with the normal gender conflicts?


Very, very carefully. It's complicated and it can go wrong very easily. Both people have to be bigger than the bullshit. That in itself can be difficult to find.

As I've said before, patience and sensitivity are the key words. Patience with communication, because each person probably has vastly different styles. Sensitivity for any subject or situation where either person has no frame of reference. I think these things are mandatory in IR's, but all male/female relationships would benefit from a successful application of these two words.

Then again, one person I shared this with said "If women talked a little less and men listened a little more, both those things would come naturally." lol

My 2 Cents... hat
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
Take the one-sided gender references (the phenomenon should be offensive whether it's Black men or women using the tactic) out and I agree with:
quote:
I hate to hear a black man put use down because he prefers something other then us to justify his actions... I just get heated when black men put us down to justify why they date other nationalities.


Raheem, you might have another riot on your hands!

HB - be careful! Your worldview at 23 was probably different than it is 35. Give qty a chance to live & adjust hers. Clearly, Tampa, has a lot to do with how she views things. I would bet 5lbs. of protein that if she went to school in the AUC, her outlook on Black dating would be a little different.

To all the advocates of IR relationships - how do you manage the culture conflicts along with the normal gender conflicts?


I personally view all conflicts in that relationship as normal, not race based. I think that it takes two VERY understanding people to look above race to have a functional relationship. Race topics have come up in those relationships, for me, but since she nor I are racist, they have been discussed without anger/hatred.
Typical. laugh

How DARE those Black women have a smile on their faces?! Don't they know they're supposed to be somebody's emotional punching bag?! I guess they didn't get the memo. lol
quote:
Originally posted by Frenchy:
Typical. laugh

How DARE those Black women have a smile on their faces?! Don't they know they're supposed to be somebody's emotional punching bag?! I guess they didn't get the memo. lol



Roll Eyes
DDouble.........Your statement is probably true. But what i've heard, is that black men/women are not seeing eye to eye.....across the nation. I do know this........if i date a white man, im not going to make excuses, that black men are uneducated, low lives, etc, etc. etc. I've never said this about black men.....and im tired of black men saying this about black women.



Black Viking....Youre trying to play with my intelligence. If you want to believe, that black men are dating white women.......because of my attitude, im fat, black, ugly, uneducated.......then say it.

Its truly amazing, how black men are willing to have patience, sensitivity, working hard to communicate......with other races but not black women!!

As far as im concerned........this is a dead issue.



"Typical.

How DARE those Black women have a smile on their faces?! Don't they know they're supposed to be somebody's emotional punching bag?! I guess they didn't get the memo."


Yes frenchy, typical indeed!!!
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
Black Viking....Youre trying to play with my intelligence. If you want to believe, that black men are dating white women.......because of my attitude, im fat, black, ugly, uneducated.......then say it.

Its truly amazing, how black men are willing to have patience, sensitivity, working hard to communicate......with other races but not black women!!


"Typical.

How DARE those Black women have a smile on their faces?! Don't they know they're supposed to be somebody's emotional punching bag?! I guess they didn't get the memo."



Yes frenchy, typical indeed!!!



Qty, I was trying hard to communicate with you. And you made a shit's worth of an effort to listen.... I think the same can be said of Black Viking. In fact, he was MORE patient than I was.

YOU females - Both you and Frenchy - haven't heard shit that we said. You just seized up on what you wanted to hear. That part which made you feel justified in your hostility.

quote:

If you want to believe, that black men are dating white women.......because of my attitude, im fat, black, ugly, uneducated.......then say it.


Black Viking has said several times I can remember that you're attractive.

The fact that you don't deem it important to listen to folks says VOLUMES about your attitude though ....

For the record, I think you're attractive. But I can't deal with that tude.
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by Black Viking:
I've found that conversations white folk don't need to be involved in simply don't interest them. If they're interested, for whatever reason, then they need to be involved.


That is one of the most asinine comments I've ever heard! White folk love an ignorant ass negro like you... and you go right along with it. ***shaking my head****

Do you allow your neighbors to get involved in your family business? If so then you're one weak ass excuse for a man. I wonder how do you live with yourself.

White folk don't need to do a goddamn thing except stay out of the internal affairs of Black people unless invited. Period!

I'm done with this thread.

OUT!
quote:
Originally posted by Dissident:
quote:
Originally posted by Black Viking:
I've found that conversations white folk don't need to be involved in simply don't interest them. If they're interested, for whatever reason, then they need to be involved.


That is one of the most asinine comments I've ever heard! White folk love an ignorant ass negro like you... and you go right along with it. ***shaking my head****


My, my, my. Haven't we gotten a little testy all of a sudden? Did someone get up on the wrong side of his coffin?

Next time you want to get a wild hair up your ass you might want to consider the context of the conversation. Like I said, ricardomath apparently has some experience related to the topic which would explain his interest. Like it or not, this is an inter-racial subject. Therefore, anything white people want to contribute is fine by me. But, if you don't like it, plug your ears and go sit in the corner.

quote:
Do you allow your neighbors to get involved in your family business? If so then you're one weak ass excuse for a man. I wonder how do you live with yourself.

Neighbors and family business have nothing, I repreat, NOTHING to do with the topic of this thread. There is no correlation.

I live with myself just fine, thank you. Even though occasionally I have to put up with shitheads like you.

quote:
White folk don't need to do a goddamn thing except stay out of the internal affairs of Black people unless invited. Period!

I'm not sure if you were paying attention the last time I reminded you of this, but the topic of this thread is Inter-Racial Couples. It doesn't have dick to do with the "internal affairs of Black people".


quote:
I'm done with this thread.

OUT!


Damn... and you've been so inspirational up to this point. sleep sleepsleep
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by qty226
Black Viking....Youre trying to play with my intelligence. If you want to believe, that black men are dating white women.......because of my attitude, im fat, black, ugly, uneducated.......then say it.

If that's what I believed, then that's what I would have said. But, that's not what I said. Your projecting. Why?

quote:
Its truly amazing, how black men are willing to have patience, sensitivity, working hard to communicate......with other races but not black women!!

What have we been doing all this time?
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:

For the record, I think you're attractive. But I can't deal with that tude.


Thanks for the compliment.

If you feel i have a "tude", im sorry.....i didnt mean to come across that way.
quote:
Originally posted by Black Viking:
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
Well lets just say this...........i cant get a black man.


I find this very hard to believe. Are you sure that you actually want a Black man? You've explained the dating scene in Tampa many times, but i have a feeling there's more to it than that.

The chances of me finding a Black woman where I live is almost non-existant. That's because there just aren't any here. But there are Black men in Tampa. Considering the statistics we just explored, it can't be all the white women's doing. Can it?



Ok, to be fair.......im going to retract, and ask....what were you implying?
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
Thanks for the compliment.

If you feel i have a "tude", im sorry.....i didnt mean to come across that way.


No problem. The compliment was sincere. Apology accepted. And I apologize for my (occasional) verbal excesses Smile Sometimes I just can't help myself...
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
quote:
Originally posted by Black Viking:
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
Well lets just say this...........i cant get a black man.


I find this very hard to believe. Are you sure that you actually want a Black man? You've explained the dating scene in Tampa many times, but i have a feeling there's more to it than that.

The chances of me finding a Black woman where I live is almost non-existant. That's because there just aren't any here. But there are Black men in Tampa. Considering the statistics we just explored, it can't be all the white women's doing. Can it?



Ok, to be fair.......im going to retract, and ask....what were you implying?


I'm trying to understand why you think you can't get a Black man. All the things that you listed, "I'm too fat, black, ugly, uneducated, ect." doesn't describe you. So what's the deal?

I'm wondering if the Black men that are around you just aren't up to your standards, whatever your standards are. That's why I brought the statistics back up. According to the statistics, Black men want you. My question is, do you want them?
See, it's like this: You guys are applying analytical thinking in an obvious attempt to gain understanding. While this is great, you'll come up against a wall of truth that most Sistas would rather not climb over.

Now, if you can get the Sistas to admit those points they never want to.

You gotta be careful though, there are times when the truth can be a little ugly.
Black Viking...

Black men have options........and they are exercising those options. (Im just one of many women they can chose from)

As i've mentioned before (some people want to ignore this fact)........this is a problem in the black community. If a woman is too dark.....she goes unnoticed, i dont care how beautiful she is. Her light skinned friends, are the ones that get picked first!! They only want me, after these women turn them down....!!

This has always been a problem for me. Its happened since high school, and im therefore cautious of black men.

(Yeah, as Thayfen mentioned, the truth can be ugly)

I dont complain about the situation, i just move on in life.
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
This has always been a problem for me. Its happened since high school, and im therefore cautious of black men.

Now I'm starting to understand why this whole thing has been so hard to get my brain around. I won't deny your experiences, but I can say with certainty that I've never said (or even conciously thought) that a woman was too black. But, that's just me, and I'm just one guy.

I can relate on some level though. I've been told by a small handfull of Black women that I was not Black enough (or too light skinned). It only happened a few times and I never really gave it much thought. I always figured there was another one around the corner, and the last thing I want to do is waste time on a woman who's not interested (regardless of what her reasons are). But I can easily see how a lifetime of experiences like that could have turned me off of Black women entirely.

Keep your options open Qty, and keep the faith. Wink Smile
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
As i've mentioned before (some people want to ignore this fact)........this is a problem in the black community. If a woman is too dark.....she goes unnoticed, i dont care how beautiful she is. Her light skinned friends, are the ones that get picked first!! They only want me, after these women turn them down....!!

This has always been a problem for me. Its happened since high school, and im therefore cautious of black men.

(Yeah, as Thayfen mentioned, the truth can be ugly)

I dont complain about the situation, i just move on in life.


Qty, I guess I should cut you some slack too. My sister has had this problem. So I do sympathize. Guys who make skin shade a criterion are shallow. I've seen absolutely beautiful sistas of all skin shades. All I can say is to keep your options open. And here's a piece of advice I've given to my own brother: Put your yourself in social situations where your special qualities shine. Night Clubs are not it. People in clubs tend to be shallow almost by definition. I mean develop hobbies. Join book clubs. Go to poetry readings. Etc. I'm serious. I do these things myself. Not that I've been terribly successful at finding a mate. But I do have a more interesting social life and more dates.
Black men have options........and they are exercising those options.
----------------------------------------------

All a Black woman (the average to better than average 'sister)has to do, is look, away, or look down, or look out the window and it's like, where'd he go? rotfl!!!!! lol
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
To all the advocates of IR relationships - how do you manage the culture conflicts along with the normal gender conflicts?


Black Viking said it very well:

"Very, very carefully. It's complicated and it can go wrong very easily. ...patience and sensitivity are the key words. Patience with communication, because each person probably has vastly different styles. Sensitivity for any subject or situation where either person has no frame of reference".

IMO, it's also important to be very clear about whether each person's reactions are personality-based or cultural.

No matter what IR mix, to keep it all together, you both have to have similar values and compatabilities.
.
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
And if I've dated white women in the past, it's because I couldn't find a black woman


hmmmmm.....Was the grass greener on the other side?

quote:
who

1) Didn't have a major attitude problem about black men
May I offer my opinion?

A Black woman may have an attitude because she's been hurt.... How do you respond to someone in pain?.... You offer comfort.... not judgment.... that will come later... after they know that you are someone they can trust will not hurt their heart anymore.....She may not be the one... but she is your "sister" so to speak.... and needs her self-image and hope revitalized if just in an instant..... Your brethren have done much damage in your name (Black Man)..... It's going to take different experiences and promotion thereof to change perceptions....


quote:
2) Wasn't look for a 6 figure earning fancy car driving man


May I say that... there are gold diggers.... and then there are women who simply want more out of life.... and for a woman (especially if she wants children).... she has to seriously consider a man who will not only be able to provide.... but also who will be able to provide if there are children (that will need her in a young age).... This is reality.... survival.... Then there is hope... everyone wants to improve...

So here is what I hear coming from my sisters.... Not 6 figure salary.... But "Is he going somewhere in life?" In this capitalist society that question is easily identifiable with material gain....

Every one has their different ideas of what that is.... But when you are here.... things cost... and a woman during pregnancy, nursing, infancy, toddler stage, etc... may not be the steady employee if she has a heart for her children.... she has to consider a man that will be able to not only provide the "basics" in her absence.... but also will continue to place the family forward.... this is almost instinctive....


quote:
3) Wasn't looking for a 6 ft. tall guy with a little (or even a lot of) thug in him


Unfortunately, many sisters are mislead about how to read in a man what they "really" want.... Many women are attracted to "thugs" or "some thug in him" Not because they want a criminal... but because a thug represents... "Nonconformity" this gives the illusion of "Power" the thug also represents "Strength".... this gives the illusion of protection.... Powerful, Man in Control, Knows what he wants, Strong... etc...

These are traits that are attractive in "Men" but are highly represented in our culture through the "thug"...... Many women have no other examples of these qualities outside of the thug image....


quote:
4) Wasn't a Jesus freak from Mars


People want to have the peace that comes from knowing right from wrong.... often they dive deep into their professed beliefs... if you understand people and why they do things.... you will know how to reach them when they are in error....

Many sisters are lonely... brother... Religion gives and keeps their dignity... and gives them hope.... some misuse this ...... but we need more compassion for each other.... it's hard... but needed none the less...


quote:
5) Just was plain not interested for whatever reason.


Not everyone will recognize a beautiful man in their midst..... But not everyone can fit together..... Her loss... Perhaps... or maybe .... relief for you both.....

quote:
I repeat, I've EXCLUSIVELY dated black women for a few years now and its been the most depressing dating period of my life. I'm tired of this crap.

I'm not saying that I'm Denzel. I'm not chopped liver either. But DAAAAYUM. My experience seems to suggest that Sistas have some major damn problems too......


Sisters do have MAJOR ISSUES... but we all do.... and it's dishearteniing to hear your experiences.... But don't shut the door to happiness.... in a sister.... there is love there... and comfort.... we have that in abundance... We have SOUL remember? You just have to know how to tap into it.... Or know when to recognize it in your midst....


Peace,
Virtue
If you dont have a firm KNOWLEDGE OF SELF, this white mans world with make you think you have no worth or you are less than any other human.But with that knowledge of who you are where you came from you have a frame of reference to draw on besides those forced on you through propaganda.Me personally I love sistas, especially attracted to brown and darkskinned sistas who loves who they are in their essence. Those who take pride in the natural texture of their hair the strong features in their appearance, and understand that god didnt make any mistakes when creating here, because she knows she is made of the best material in the universe. She is the Original Woman.
quote:
Originally posted by ZAKAR:
If you dont have a firm KNOWLEDGE OF SELF, this white mans world with make you think you have no worth or you are less than any other human.But with that knowledge of who you are where you came from you have a frame of reference to draw on besides those forced on you through propaganda.Me personally I love sistas, especially attracted to brown and darkskinned sistas who loves who they are in their essence. Those who take pride in the natural texture of their hair the strong features in their appearance, and understand that god didnt make any mistakes when creating here, because she knows she is made of the best material in the universe. She is the Original Woman.
There are many Black people that will try to make you feel that way as well......
Can't stop laughing at this. laugh


quote:
Originally posted by nayo:
Black men have options........and they are exercising those options.
----------------------------------------------

All a Black woman (the average to better than average 'sister)has to do, is look, away, or look down, or look out the window and it's like, where'd he go? rotfl!!!!! lol
From Vox's "That's Right, I Said It!" Department...

Any man or woman -- but especially women, for reasons I could discuss -- who complains, like QTY does, that the opposite sex doesn't want them for this reason or that, are consciously choosing to seek out opportunities to reinforce their complaint. They may want a man, but their desire to have a man is not as strong as their desire to complain about the men who don't want them. As a result, they devote more focus on the men to complain about, and less on the men who they could have. QTY, if you look anything like you do in the various avatars you've put up, there is no way that you can't find black men who find you attractive enough to want to get with. Where I'm from, men will get with just about any woman who throws them some play. And I've never been anywhere where I didn't notice that was the case.

Until the past year or so, most of my life was spent having serious problems attracting women. I was almost always alone. Throughout this time, I knew some black men who preferred to date white women. They ALWAYS would say that their preference was because black women were "too loud, too uneducated, too belligerent," etc.

The reason I brought up the fact that I was always alone was this: despite my limited opportunities with women, I never found myself having to date the type of women that these guys were talking about. I knew plenty of black women who were uneducated, belligerent, and too loud. But the women I always found myself dating were attractive, intelligent, nurturing, nice women. I didn't feel like I was being too selective, either. I had the same quality of women as I seem to find now, even though my opportunities back then were a lot more limited than they are now.

This led me to the conclusion that if a guy like me, who had a hard time meeting women, was still able to pick from the kind of black women that I wanted to be with, then these other black guys should not have had a problem finding them either. So they were making up a bullshit excuse for why they preferred to date white women.

At the same time, I used to notice that black women would spend more time bashing the men who were off-limits, and no time on giving the time of day to the men who weren't. If I'm alone in a train station, and there's a black guy with his white girlfriend and their baby, the two black women would completely ignore me and badmouth the other black guy. If I'm standing there alone, and Jo-Jo Gold-Toof is also standing alone, the black women will completely ignore me and focus on badmouthing Jo-Jo Gold-Toof. If I'm standing alone, and an effeminate gay guy is there, black women standing there are lamenting the fact that the other guy is gay... again, completely ignoring me.

You may want a man. But what you want even more is to complain and commiserate about the fact that you don't have a man. The desire for romance is dwarfed by the psychological need to temporarily sooth the bruised ego through criticism and complaint (while prolonging and worsening the problem in the process, though). QTY, you completely overlook the guys who are attracted to you, so you can concentrate on the ones who don't. In fact, if I had time, I would conduct an experiment right here on this site to prove it.

While you've been on this site, QTY, I recall that you have at times been complimented on this site by brothers who (like me) found you attractive. How many lines of text do you think you have written on this website addressing them, versus the number of lines of text you've written addressing men who've been criticizing you?

I would bet the ratio is at least 50 to one. If I'm anywhere near close, then case closed. In that case, you've got some things to think about, if real happiness is your goal.
quote:
Originally posted by Vox:
At the same time, I used to notice that black women would spend more time bashing the men who were off-limits, and no time on giving the time of day to the men who weren't. If I'm alone in a train station, and there's a black guy with his white girlfriend and their baby, the two black women would completely ignore me and badmouth the other black guy. If I'm standing there alone, and Jo-Jo Gold-Toof is also standing alone, the black women will completely ignore me and focus on badmouthing Jo-Jo Gold-Toof. If I'm standing alone, and an effeminate gay guy is there, black women standing there are lamenting the fact that the other guy is gay... again, completely ignoring me.


lol rotflmao lol

Not to start anything... But it seems like I always got the MOST attention from sistas when I was dating a white woman. When I was single looking for a black woman I couldn't get the time of day. This lasts for a year or two and then I meet another white woman. Then I get attention from sistas again.

laugh laugh laugh
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
Not to start anything... But it seems like I always got the MOST attention from sistas when I was dating a white woman. When I was single looking for a black woman I couldn't get the time of day. This lasts for a year or two and then I meet another white woman. Then I get attention from sistas again.

That is so damn true, and then once I'm with a white woman, sistas want to give me a hard time. I'm always thinking, "Where the hell were you when I was single! Oh yeah. Now I remember. You wouldn't give me the time of day." bump
Vox....thanks for your sincere response to my postings, thoughts etc.

Since im done with this topic.....i'll PM you my response to your post.

Thanks again! Smile
quote:
Originally posted by Black Viking:
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
Not to start anything... But it seems like I always got the MOST attention from sistas when I was dating a white woman. When I was single looking for a black woman I couldn't get the time of day. This lasts for a year or two and then I meet another white woman. Then I get attention from sistas again.

That is so damn true, and then once I'm with a white woman, sistas want to give me a hard time. I'm always thinking, "Where the hell were you when I was single! Oh yeah. Now I remember. You wouldn't give me the time of day." bump


When I've gone out with a white or non-black woman, I haven't noticed that as much. I chalk it up to my "racially-unclear" look. If I'm with a non-black woman, I don't think people assume right away that I'm black, but maybe Middle Eastern or Latino. When I went to Puerto Rico, I had a couple of American tourists try to ask me directions in Spanish... That was comical!

It works the other way too. One of the only times I was ever stopped by a state trooper for a bullshit reason was when I had other people (all black) in the car with me. When I'm by myself driving, I almost never have that problem.
Here we go again with this shit. Surprised it's coming from Vox this time around. The black man's experience is not the same as the Black woman's experience. Doesn't matter what you find when you go out looking. Unless you're looking for a brotha, you don't have a single clue what Black women encounter.

Quantity IS NOT the same as quality. 50 grubby, shiftless men hitting on a woman does not mean she "has a lot of options."

Qty, girl didn't you know you're supposed to drink the bathwater of any internet yahoo who pays you a compliment on your physical attributes?? Get with it girl! Big Grin
That wasn't his point - Roll Eyes You targeted one section & took it out of context to form a gripe.

Amazing...

I won't comment further - it's Vox's call on whether to further his points for you.
quote:
Originally posted by Frenchy:

Qty, girl didn't you know you're supposed to drink the bathwater of any internet yahoo who pays you a compliment on your physical attributes?? Get with it girl! Big Grin



lol
quote:
Originally posted by Frenchy:
Here we go again with this shit. Surprised it's coming from Vox this time around. The black man's experience is not the same as the Black woman's experience. Doesn't matter what you find when you go out looking. Unless you're looking for a brotha, you don't have a single clue what Black women encounter.

Quantity IS NOT the same as quality. 50 grubby, shiftless men hitting on a woman does not mean she "has a lot of options."



Frenchy, sweetie ...

(Editorial injerjection: Am I a real moron for not moving to Florida?? Is it really this bastion of high quality, young, beautiful women that no quality man there wants??? Or did all the men with sense decide that they had enough of the hurricanes?)

... the problem is, you're wrong. Like I said, when I was in a setting in which I'm there and a couple of overtly gay guys are there, and the black women nearby stand there looking THROUGH me at the gay guys and bemoan what they see as proof that all the good men are either dead, in jail, or GAY, then I can and do have a clue as to what black women encounter. When most of the women I'm initially attracted to have boyfriends, etc... all I'm saying is that there is definitely something else going on than what's being discussed.

And in case you overlooked it, I also took men to task for making up excuses for their reported interracial experiences, as well.

Finally... as for this statement:
quote:
Qty, girl didn't you know you're supposed to drink the bathwater of any internet yahoo who pays you a compliment on your physical attributes?? Get with it girl!


You uncharacteristically miss my point. The point wasn't that QTY should be delving all into conversation with posters here who compliment her. The point is that if she has devoted 50,000% more of her posts here toward guys who say the types of things she decries about black men, than toward those she doesn't have similar problems with, then it serves as evidence of the direction in which her energies off line lie.

Just like all of the ignorant, loud, dramatic black women seem to be disproportionately in the world of the men who derive some sort of comfort in believing that these are the majority of black women. For a guy like me, who tends to look inward for his solutions, the loud, ignorant black women never, ever have come into my dating focus. Even during times when you'd think I would be prone to settle, I never focused on them. And believe me, they abound! It would have been EASY for me to do like what you do, and focus on them as the reason for being alone. But just think of the decent women I would have completely ignored, like some men do... You women are doing the same things. The comment about QTY's lines of text supports THAT idea, NOT the idea that she should be thankful and give play to fools like IronHorse.

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