First off, good to see you back Sis S. Smile

If you feel that my post was aimed as a personal attack then I unreservedly apologise coz I think you're an awesome woman and I DO respect your viewpoints and posts. tfro

Sis S: "I believe, as my faith teaches, that some people ARE better than others."

Ethically and morally I don't and can't agree with this statement. That's just my personal opinion.

I believe all people are equal, and it is our individual consciousness to choose how we BEHAVE whether sexually, in business, whatever.

For me it is the spirit and motivation of how each person CHOOSES to act at a particular moment that holds clarity and purpose and ethics. To me that IS everything. Going a step further, to me, by judging those choices is irrelevant and arrogant, unless we are more than human and/or mindreaders.

But that is art_gurl's unique perspective on life and is irrelevant to anyone but me.

Perhaps Sis S we can agree that some people's (male and female) BEHAVIOUR is better than others? But we don't have to agree on anything, that is cool, although I'm sure we both agree that life isn't about nodding and agreeing with each other. Smile

Anyhoo...

I think the depth of feeling and reaction this thread has generated shows it was a valid one to start Ms Popcorn. All discussion is good to blow away the 'cobwebs'.
This is something quick to stir things up a bit.

Promiscous women are the scum of the earth. These women are the biggest murderers, the biggest baby killers on the planet. Since they can not control themselves and do not respect themselves as women they take out their mistakes on poor defendless innocents in their wombs through abortions. Check out how much murders these monstrous women commit in a year and then try to justify female promiscuity.

There is no double standards here. It's men who label these women promiscous. Why? Simple really!! Men play and have fun with these type of women but deep down very few men want to end up with a woman that is the local town whore as the wife or the mother of his children.

Take a close look at the topic again. The defenders of female promiscuity are women and the ones who speak against it are the men, what does that tell you as a woman?
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:

This is something quick to stir things up a bit.

Promiscous women are the scum of the earth. These women are the biggest murderers, the biggest baby killers on the planet. Since they can not control themselves and do not respect themselves as women they take out their mistakes on poor defendless innocents in their wombs through abortions. Check out how much murders these monstrous women commit in a year and then try to justify female promiscuity.

There is no double standards here. It's men who label these women promiscous. Why? Simple really!! Men play and have fun with these type of women but deep down very few men want to end up with a woman that is the local town whore as the wife or the mother of his children.

Take a close look at the topic again. The defenders of female promiscuity are women and the ones who speak against it are the men, what does that tell you as a woman?


Respectfully, I think your position is completely indefensible and abhorrent. Last time I checked there has been only one immaculate conception. nono
quote:
Originally posted by MBM:
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:

This is something quick to stir things up a bit.

Promiscous women are the scum of the earth. These women are the biggest murderers, the biggest baby killers on the planet. Since they can not control themselves and do not respect themselves as women they take out their mistakes on poor defendless innocents in their wombs through abortions. Check out how much murders these monstrous women commit in a year and then try to justify female promiscuity.

There is no double standards here. It's men who label these women promiscous. Why? Simple really!! Men play and have fun with these type of women but deep down very few men want to end up with a woman that is the local town whore as the wife or the mother of his children.

Take a close look at the topic again. The defenders of female promiscuity are women and the ones who speak against it are the men, what does that tell you as a woman?


Respectfully, I think your position is completely indefensible and abhorrent. Last time I checked there has been only one immaculate conception. nono
You have to be a little more elaborate than that that one liner MBM.

What is abhorrent to say promiscuous women commit the greatest number of abortions and therefore the biggest killers on the planet? Don't you think abortions and those who commit them are are abhorrent and abominable people? Maybe you don't. If so then the feeling of abhorrence is on the wrong foot.

Now I don't understand this thing about immaculate conception you are bringing into the discussion. We are talking about bad bad women, what has immaculate conception got to do with it? Confused Maybe you want to stirr things up as well? Big Grin
I have used the word "Promiscuious" referring to a gay man. Unfortunately a gay friend has displayed promiscuious behavior. After sometime of knowing this individual, I realized some gay men prefer a lifestyle of one sexual escapade after another and his lifestyle is like that.

I must say, I am a DEFENDER of women who are called promiscuious. I can't throw that first stone! I believe one's sexual preferences/desires is one's own business.

POPCORN writes:
quote:

"Latoyia Figueroa has been a single mother since her teens, and with this second child on the way... she has been promiscuous."

"It is very possible that her own promiscuity may have contributed to her present situation."


And WHERE did you get that quote from?
Can you imagine a young woman in your family being missing since July 18th and not knowing what happen to her until the middle of August. It seems un-real that anyone would write such a derogatory statement about someone who is 24 years old and pregnant for the second time. I know young women the same age that have 6 children. What do you call them? And besides, I don't care what Latoyia's lifestyle was she deserves the same news coverage and search as NATALEE vacationing in ARUBA. The US is a melting pot of nationalities, ethnic groups and social-economic classes. What's good for one group is good for the others.

Now that we know the boyfriend did it, now is the time to address domestic violence issues.
"There is no double standards here. It's men who label these women promiscous. Why? Simple really!! Men play and have fun with these type of women but deep down very few men want to end up with a woman that is the local town whore as the wife or the mother of his children.

Take a close look at the topic again. The defenders of female promiscuity are women and the ones who speak against it are the men, what does that tell you as a woman?" by Henry38

......where Henry38 puts it bluntly, this is very much a part of the reality of it. There is no reward at the end of the rainbow for having low moral standards, be it male or female.

*********************************
"I am personally outraged that you would have the nerve, that you would dare to post anything on this topic. And you post it to promote the same old sanctimonious song you've been singing since you learned to talk. You use this topic to malign the lives of African Americans. Have you no shame, none whatsoever?

You are the author of the two quotes used to start this topic, the two quotes that you have highlighted here." by Popcorn

Think what you will, but any woman who makes mistake number one of having a child out of wedlock, and who failed to learn from her first mistake by having a second child out of wedlock, where both fathers choose not to be responsible, means both parents morals are very bad. It would not be difficult to determine that any woman living this lifestyle is promiscuous, or has the tendency to be promiscuous.

Any biological father who is just as responsible for the care of the child is not being a responsible parent. He would also have low moral standards, which would also make him just as promiscuous. In most cases, the court system will order the biological father to provide child support, even if no more than to reimburse the government for the administrative costs, and other costs associated with providing AFDC benefits for the mother and her illegitimate children.

"Although this case has been bullied onto the national news to prove a point about race and media by political opportunists like Richard Cranium, it never was a case about a missing woman and is not national news. There is nothing particularly unusual about this case. She is an inner-city African-American/Latino woman, living a more than unconventional lifestyle in a high crime area, and now she's missing--big surprise. Furthermore, this story is hurtful to minorities because it has done nothing other than to reinfornce negative stereotypes: (1) LaToyia's father and other relatives are barely literate; (2) LaToyia's best friend said: "She coulda been snatched up by anybody, or one of her baby's fathas, or some guy she's messin wit" (rolling eyes); and (3) rather than save up more money, LaToyia and Baby Fatha No. 2 took their money and bought fried seafood rather than pay the $35 co-pay for prenatal care.

The Natalee Holloway case is national news. She is a beautiful young woman, with a full scholarship to the University of Alabama, who disappears on what would otherwise be a dream vacation to an island resort with the lowest crime rate in the world. Big, big difference, in every respect. I hope LaToyia returns home safely, although I doubt it. In the end, however, we should not have to have our national news littered with this story. I assure you the end result will only cause more embarassment and humiliation, and it's clear that national news anchors are annoyed by having to cover this story because they too, of course, realize it's not national news. Wise up Cranium, this isn't about you and your outdated political agenda".......

........."Now, I will repeat the salient points. The majority of America is interested in the Natalee Holloway story for several reasons. First, Aruba happens to be a favorite vacation resort for tens of thousands of Americans, every year, and one of the reasons is that it historically has a very low crime rate. Second, Natalee is a beautiful young girl with her entire life ahead of her--one filled with promise as evidenced by her full scholarship to college.

By contrast, LaToyia's life was already in ruin. She was working on her second illegitimate kid. She was irresponsible with her money, as evidenced by the fact that her and Baby Fatha No. 2 didn't even have $35 between them to satisfy the insurance co-pay for prenatal care. And, what did they do with the money they did have on them that day?--they went out and bought some greasy seafood lunch. This is pure savagery. This is also the reason why 80% of the American public consider her life to be anathema to proper living and are annoyed that their news is interrupted and littered by the LaToyia case. You can see the obvious backlash, as LaToyia is barely covered now, if at all, while Natalee continues to receive the coverage she deserves. Finally, LaToyia would not have received any coverage at all if her cousin was not a city council member, and if her uncle were not a city detective. This is what makes the LaToyia case an even bigger hypocrisy since all of the whining bloggers were using her as a martyr to make statements about favoritism in the media.

In the end, this was yet another tactical error, not unlike the recent NARAL ad that was pulled, by minorities and liberal bedwetters who can't get acceptance of their unpopular positions and causes through any other means than whining."

*****************************
...and this is from the thoughts of another individual, to share the reality that having low moral standards is not a ticket to prosperity.

Generally, anyone with high moral standards is given an edge over anyone else whose moral standards are very low.


Well, outraged or not, it is about time Black folks stop living in a dream world. The stigma that goes with having children out of wedlock, or having low moral standards is very real. I could care less how outraged you or anyone else become, because it is more important that the reality be stated, in that having low moral standards promotes failure, and does not promote prosperity.

I have a first cousin who finished medical school, and who is a licensed medical doctor. Before my cousin had a child out of wedlock, her peers had the utmost respect for my cousin. After practicing medicine for several years, my cousin had a child out of wedlock. Less respect was shown for my cousin, as a result of her having a child out of wedlock.

In my own life I have had dealings with women who have had children out of wedlock. By and large, this group of Black women, have created their own misery, to be destined for a life of poverty, the exception being the very few who already had a marketable skill, the few who made the necessary sacrifices to acquire a marketable skill, and/or the women who chose not to make the same mistake of having more illegitimate children.

The women with one or more illegitimate children, who did not have a marketable skill, or who refused to make the necessary sacrifice to acquire a marketable skill, and who also chose to have more illegitimate children out of wedlock are dependent on social welfare, some have resorted to criminal activity for survival, a few are on the verge of being homeless, and/or wish for a miracle that a "Sugar Daddy" comes to their aid, to bail them out from under the serious financial problems that each of these individuals face.

Mind you in each case the biological father deserted each of these women, both financially, and/or from a mutual parenting responsibility standpoint.

I have helped a few of them by buying them groceries, making a car payment for one or two of them, etc. I'm not about to become that "Sugar Daddy" for anyone of them. Having lived in poverty, and risen from extreme poverty, I'm not about to be driven back into poverty behind the life style of anyone whose low moral standards, and/or whose intentional desire is to remain unmarketable, in a world that requires a marketable skill for survival, that is if your goal is to make a legal living. Should your desire be to immoral, or refrain from acquiring a marketable skill, then you can be as criminal, and uncouth as you want to be, but eventually any individual who chooses this option, will pay a steep price for such a life style. Developing a relationship with anyone of these individuals will eventually contribute to my detriment also,....that is, in the event I were to jump through any hoop of financial misery, to be that "Sugar Daddy", at my own expense.

This is why it is a waste of my time, to reply to a Popcorn, a Kevin41, etc., because it is about time Black people stop dreaming, and share the reality of this situation, as opposed to living in "LA LA Land" by dreaming, that having low moral standards is some ticket to prosperity!
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:

Maybe you want to stirr things up as well? Big Grin


Of course! bsm

My only point is that it seems patently unfair to demonize women in the way that it appears you do here when every pregnancy in the history of humanity - save one - has also involved a man. Men share equal culpability in sex and childbirth as do women.
I think it was Eve who is responsible for women having the burden of bearing children, biblically speaking. Whether Biblically or through the natural selection process of nature, genders have specific roles. Nature created the double standard and the idealistic thinking of humans cannot and should not attempt to believe they are wiser than the laws of nature.

I think if women want to be promiscuous and attempt lower themselves to the behavior of men, they must be able to accept the consequences. Nature gave women the greater responsibility, which means the women should be more responsible concerning who they lay with and as a general rule, they are.

A person only has 50% control over any one-on-one relationship of equals. That 50% control is of themselves. However, a woman incubates and brings forth life through the womb, meaning that she has more than a 50% stake in a one-on-one sexual encounter. She has the stake of the child born from the gift/burden that nature affixed to her.

Women should not make a sexual decision based upon expectations of what a man [should] do. Again, she has no control over what the many [will] do, but she has total control over what she will do, assuming self-control. Given empirical evidence of the behavior of men a woman who lays with a man is taking a much greater risk than a man takes when he lays with a women.

A promiscuous man only risks a sexual transmitted disease. A promiscuous women risk, STDs, pregnancy and caring for a child because of the bond formed between mother and child in the womb. It is much easier for a man to walk away from a child when they have not bonded with them. Women have the bond formed in the womb. Consequently, should be more responsible because their risks are simply greater.
quote:

A promiscuous man only risks a sexual transmitted disease. A promiscuous women risk, STDs, pregnancy and caring for a child because of the bond formed between mother and child in the womb. It is much easier for a man to walk away from a child when they have not bonded with them. Women have the bond formed in the womb. Consequently, should be more responsible because their risks are simply greater.


I agree with this.......i also think that a promiscuous man/woman have 'mental issues'.....that will cause other problems.



Yes its funny, society accepts/encourages men to be promiscuous, but will bash a woman....if she has a child out of wedlock. (And she doesnt have to be promisuous for this to happen!)

There is nothing we can do about the way society thinks...........but we (women) can take charge of the situation.
I am as tired of this topic as anyone, but I won't let this piece of "moralising" by Michael go unchallenged...

quote:
Quote:"Natalee is a beautiful young girl with her entire life ahead of her -- one filled with promise as evidenced by her full scholarship to college".


This sounds like supremesist bullshit to me.

quote:
By contrast, LaToyia's life was already in ruin. She was working on her second illegitimate kid..." Blah blah. "...this is pure savagery...blah"


Exactly who gives you the divine right to aportion value to one human being as being better than another? OK it's just your opinion. Gasp...!

Who has a crystal ball to say beyond doubt that Natalee mightn't go on to become a lawyer and showed promise for fraudulent behaviour... and fcuked over 100s of people? So what if she was "BEAUTIFUL" or "full of promise"... she is NOT BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE. Certainly not "better" than LaToyia!

Maybe LaToyia, because of all her own experiences, might have gone on to be a social worker or mentor, who might have a profound influence of 1000's of people's lives and made a real difference. We will never know.

Michael - you are missing compassion and empathy big time. No wonder you frequent some of the sites you do without a second thought.

GEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESH!
quote:
Originally posted by qty226:
There is nothing we can do about the way society thinks...........but we (women) can take charge of the situation.

Thank you qty226. Thank you. That I believe this is the crux of the matter. The SOLUTION decisions and control of the situation is in the hands of our women. We can not force you to be morally upright but it would be BEST if you are. All we ask is for you to remember you carry the responsibilty as our mothers, our sisters, our daughters and finally you are our pride and joy as black men. Unfortunately what many of you have become is not very nice and makes some of us black men downright ashamed of you.
]
quote:
Originally posted by art_gurl:
I am as tired of this topic as anyone, but I won't let this piece of "moralising" by Michael go unchallenged...

quote:
Quote:"Natalee is a beautiful young girl with her entire life ahead of her -- one filled with promise as evidenced by her full scholarship to college".


This sounds like supremesist bullshit to me.

quote:
By contrast, LaToyia's life was already in ruin. She was working on her second illegitimate kid..." Blah blah. "...this is pure savagery...blah"


Exactly who gives you the divine right to aportion value to one human being as being better than another? OK it's just your opinion. Gasp...!

Who has a crystal ball to say beyond doubt that Natalee mightn't go on to become a lawyer and showed promise for fraudulent behaviour... and fcuked over 100s of people? So what if she was "BEAUTIFUL" or "full of promise"... she is NOT BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE. Certainly not "better" than LaToyia!

Maybe LaToyia, because of all her own experiences, might have gone on to be a social worker or mentor, who might have a profound influence of 1000's of people's lives and made a real difference. We will never know.

Michael - you are missing compassion and empathy big time. No wonder you frequent some of the sites you do without a second thought.

GEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESH!

*************************************

"Although this case has been bullied onto the national news to prove a point about race and media by political opportunists like Richard Cranium, it never was a case about a missing woman and is not national news. There is nothing particularly unusual about this case. She is an inner-city African-American/Latino woman, living a more than unconventional lifestyle in a high crime area, and now she's missing--big surprise. Furthermore, this story is hurtful to minorities because it has done nothing other than to reinfornce negative stereotypes: (1) LaToyia's father and other relatives are barely literate; (2) LaToyia's best friend said: "She coulda been snatched up by anybody, or one of her baby's fathas, or some guy she's messin wit" (rolling eyes); and (3) rather than save up more money, LaToyia and Baby Fatha No. 2 took their money and bought fried seafood rather than pay the $35 co-pay for prenatal care. The Natalee Holloway case is national news. She is a beautiful young woman, with a full scholarship to the University of Alabama, who disappears on what would otherwise be a dream vacation to an island resort with the lowest crime rate in the world. Big, big difference, in every respect. I hope LaToyia returns home safely, although I doubt it. In the end, however, we should not have to have our national news littered with this story. I assure you the end result will only cause more embarassment and humiliation, and it's clear that national news anchors are annoyed by having to cover this story because they too, of course, realize it's not national news. Wise up Cranium, this isn't about you and your outdated political agenda."

**************************************
Well artgurl,

Although I'm not the author of this material, it makes sense. I have chosen to distance myself from those whose moral standards are in the toilet, rather than join their ranks.

Following in their footsteps, or forming an alliance with anyone whose moral standards are in the toilet, would more so than not, keep me in poverty, lead to criminal prosecution, and/or call for increased government intervention in my life, which more so than not would severely limit my success, and/or ruin my own future.


Authorities on the subject, and proof of the connection between single parenthood, illegitimate child birth, and poverty, are definitely worth paying attention to.

The misleading lip service from an art_gurl and/or anyone else of similar expression has little value!

It is certain that an art_gurl would be ignored or put in her place by her own Caucasian community if an art_gurl encouraged low moral standards, illegitimate birth, etc., in the Caucasian community!

If I were you, Black people, I wouldn't place much credence in the misguided or misleading views of any misleading liberal Caucasian in an art_gurl..

More so than in any other community, as applied to the Black community, encouraging low moral standards, and illegitimate birth, are contributing factors to single parent families, poverty, and/or criminal activity!

Mind you, statistically, more so than the family structure of any other ethnic group, Black families:

A. are headed by a single parent.

B. have a higher illegitimate child birth rate.

C. are dependent on social welfare, and/or increased government intervention for its' survival.

These factors contribute to the increased poverty rate, welfare dependency, and/or criminal activity in our community!

....and the points or authorities are valid, neither of which come from any KKK, StormFront, or similar website.

Although it is certain that some of the same material can be found on a KKK website, as it concerns the high illegitimate birth rate of Black children, the high incidence of Black families dependent on social welfare, the high crime rate that exists in the Black community, etc.


The same information comes from many sources, and Black people who have lived in the inner-city with their eyes, ears, and minds open know this is true!

.....art_gurl, and/or anyone else of similar expression, I could care less what you think of me, because you are not an ingredient to my success.

Sincerely,

Michael Lofton
"
quote:
Originally posted by http://www.neo-kem.com:
Hey I know I don't post much here, but I check this forum often. And I have learned a lot here.

I need to know something: is this guy michael supposed to be a black person?

If so why is he quoting a conservative think tank?"

If not why is he allowed to spread dissention unchecked?


If the Truth is Ever Told....

.....and having lived under this foolishness, the foolishness of having to be subjected to the treason of that Black middleclass, and/or the liberal Caucacian community who promote this disgraceful Black leadership, to unwarrantedly, and illegally, break up the law abiding Black family structure for profit, I don't have to consult the views of any conservative think tank to prove it!

Sincerely,

Michael Lofton
Ok Ok I get it.... you hate black people.

So why do you post here?

If you fell as strongly as you do and if you are as succesful as you claim, why not run for office or something.

This is not the place to insult degrade and or offend black people.

The people here are trying to find solutions to the problems.

If you have suggestions why not post those instead of wasting energy posting things that incite anger and discord?

http://www.saywordradio.com
quote:
Originally posted by http://www.neo-kem.com:
Ok Ok I get it.... you hate black people.

So why do you post here?

If you fell as strongly as you do and if you are as succesful as you claim, why not run for office or something.

This is not the place to insult degrade and or offend black people.

The people here are trying to find solutions to the problems.

If you have suggestions why not post those instead of wasting energy posting things that incite anger and discord?

http://www.saywordradio.com


....and reading literature, no matter what form, is not even close to being the root cause of poverty and/or death in the Black community.

Poor choices, poor decisions, disregard for property rights, and disregard for life has resulted in the unwarranted property damage and/or death of other Black people, and/or many other individuals.


...more likely Black people hate themselves, because Black people are in fact their own worst enemy!
The people who post here don't hate themselves or their people.

THey are here trying to find solutions.

If you have suggestions post them.

Cease and desist from wasting your energy insulting us.

You will find their are a number conservative and rascist forums in which you can post your views and hear nothing but handclaps in agreement. This is not the place for you you should leave.

http://www.saywordradio.com
quote:
Originally posted by http://www.neo-kem.com:
The people who post here don't hate themselves or their people.

THey are here trying to find solutions.

If you have suggestions post them.

Cease and desist from wasting your energy insulting us.

You will find their are a number conservative and rascist forums in which you can post your views and hear nothing but handclaps in agreement. This is not the place for you you should leave.

http://www.saywordradio.com


....being respectful to self, others, setting good moral standards, etc., etc., would be a big step in the right direction.

This solution would not require an intense brainstorming session, any thinktank, etc., because the solutions are easy to understand and to make use of.


...more likely Black people hate, disgrace, and/or insult themselves, because Black people are in fact their own worst enemy!

Perhaps you should take your own advice, because I'm not about to flip this script, or make tracks because you suggest that I do!
quote:
Originally posted by http://www.neo-kem.com:
you also should take your own advice in regards to being respectful to others.

Your posts here most all find disrespectful.

Your conduct here is a perfect example of a black person acting ignent. Not caring what others think and only thinkng of themselves.

http://www.saywordradio.com


....it is certain the individuals facing the music would have an entirely different view point as to where the true ignorance and disrespect lies. More likely, the finger of blame would be directed at this misfit set that surely exists in the Black community!

....as for ignorance, etc., etc., again Black people are major contributors to their own ignorance, self destruction, etc.,

.....and again, I'm not about to flip this script to please anyones eyes, ears, or thoughts!

..or give praise to that misfit and/or treasonous set of individuals, that surely exists within the Black community.

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