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quote:
Originally posted by Empty Purnata:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Blacksanction
the police have a tough job, which justifies their abuse of power, if not outright brutality, and they mostly protect us from the criminals in our midst so we should consider their side of the "story" before jumping to conclusions.


To be fair EP, the above is my quote. However, the quote is my interpretation of what he has posted.
update -

URL: http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/local/article/0,1...N_15_4245601,00.html
quote:



Janea Monroe, top, shows what she says she witnessed when Denver police arrested Thomas Armstrong last week. Monroe, 19, says police held a gun to the man's head as he lay handcuffed. The re-enactment was held at the arrest site at East 11th Avenue and Xenia Street. One of the officers who helped subdue Armstrong last week had arrested him in February 1999.

Injured man, officer had crossed paths six years before

Cop in confrontation arrested Armstrong in February 1999

By Brian D. Crecente, Rocky Mountain News
November 17, 2005

One of the officers who helped subdue the man injured in a confrontation with police had arrested Thomas Charles Armstrong six years earlier.

The second officer to arrive at the scene of the struggle early Friday was Jarrod Foust, who arrested Armstrong in February 1999 on a warrant out of Aurora.

Police say the incident began when officer Daniel Swanson stopped to check on Armstrong because he was behaving strangely, crossing back and forth across the street near East 11th Avenue and Xenia Street. Police say Armstrong lunged at the officer and a struggle ensued and that Swanson was struggling by himself before Foust arrived on scene.

Janea Monroe, 19, a witness who came forward in a news conference organized by Armstrong's family members Wednesday, said she saw Armstrong handcuffed, in custody and uninjured that night, but that a second officer sped past her toward the scene as she left.

Armstrong was hospitalized after the run-in with police. Rebecca Romero, his mother, said that he is connected to seven machines, including a respirator and dialysis machine.

Earl Armstrong, Thomas Armstrong's brother, said his brother was transferred from University Hospital to Denver Health Medical Center Wednesday afternoon without the family's knowledge.

University Hospital spokeswoman Sarah Ellis confirmed that Armstrong was no longer at her hospital and that he was last listed in critical condition, but she could not say where he was transferred.

Earl Armstrong said his brother is still in critical condition and being cared for in the Intensive Care Unit.

Armstrong's family and a group of concerned citizens held a news conference on the corner of 11th Avenue and Xenia Street where Monroe told reporters what she saw that morning.

Monroe said she was in a car with two friends when they drove by the intersection and slowed to a near stop to see what was going on about 12:40 a.m.

She said Thomas Armstrong was lying face down on the ground in the center of the intersection. She said that Armstrong's hands were handcuffed behind his back. An officer had a knee pressed into his back, Monroe said, and a gun or a Taser pointed at his head.

Monroe said Armstrong was looking up and screaming for help and that he had a gash on the left side of his head and blood in his eyes.

The officer, Monroe said, looked flushed as if he had been in a struggle and seemed scared.

She said she saw a police car "flying" along the street toward the officer and Armstrong. The car had its overhead lights on, but no siren, Monroe said.

Throughout the news conference, Monroe seemed emotional, at times shaking and, when asked her name, breaking down in tears.

Later Monroe said she didn't go to police because she is scared.

"I know there are a lot of good cops out there; I want to be a cop," she said, sobbing, her hands trembling, "But I'm afraid of the bad cops."

She said she didn't really want to get involved, but felt she had to.

Monroe's emotional recounting of the incident happened amid a bizarre series of events at the news conference.

Shortly after arriving, Earl Armstrong said he had been cited on the way to the news conference for obstructing traffic and not having insurance after he jumped out of his car to videotape a police car following him.

He then pointed out a patrol car parked down Xenia Street and another parked a block away on 11th Avenue.

As Armstrong waited for Monroe to show up to talk to the media, another woman came forward and told the man that she too had witnessed the events of Friday morning.

The woman, who would not give her name, said she is a house cleaner at Fitzsimons Army Medical Center. She said she lives in the neighborhood and was just coming home about 1:10 a.m. when she heard a man screaming for help.

The woman said she would not talk to police, only to the Armstrongs' lawyer.

She said when she went to investigate, she saw two police officers kicking a prone and handcuffed Armstrong in the middle of the intersection.

The woman said she was frightened so she left the area.

Monroe arrived at the news conference almost an hour late and appeared reluctant to talk. After being asked to give her name she did and then asked to leave, saying she couldn't talk about the incident anymore.

Monroe walked to the end of the street with a friend, and a few minutes later, the friend returned and confronted two men standing in the group of people who had been watching the news conference, accusing them of being Denver Police officers.

Both men acknowledged that they were homicide detectives, produced IDs and gave their names. The two detectives said they were there trying to gather information for their investigation into the incident.

Earl Armstrong saw the detectives walking toward their car, and the witness, and shouted to those around him: "We need to protect our witness."

Armstrong and a group of men ran down the street toward the witness.

The men stopped running when they saw the detectives getting in their car and leave.

About 15 minutes later, a tearful Monroe called Armstrong on his cell phone and said that a marked police car was following her.

__________________________________________________
Isome
quote:
Originally posted by Empty Purnata:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Blacksanction
the police have a tough job, which justifies their abuse of power, if not outright brutality, and they mostly protect us from the criminals in our midst so we should consider their side of the "story" before jumping to conclusions.



To be fair EP, the above is my quote. However, the quote is my interpretation of what he has posted.
_____________________________________________________

Isome please don't do me any favors like interpreting what I have posted as it clearly confuses others. Most of the readers can read what I have written for themselves and should be capable deciding for themselves w/o your twist as to what you believe I really said- as you clearly miss my points in an base attempt to discredit what I write. Wink
quote:
Originally posted by Blacksanction:

Isome please don't do me any favors like interpreting what I have posted as it clearly confuses others. Most of the readers can read what I have written for themselves and should be capable deciding for themselves w/o your twist as to what you believe I really said- as you clearly miss my points in an base attempt to discredit what I write. Wink


Trust me, there's nothing further from my mind than doing a favor for you. I posted in response to you. If you believe your points were "clearly" missed, then you need to write them more succinctly. Based on what was written however, my interpretation is accurate.

The fact is you clearly failed to meet the challenge posed by Pace-- you never did find a white man beaten unconscious by the police --and are now trying to deflect attention away from your inability to find information that supports your assertion.
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quote:
Originally posted by Empty Purnata:
^Amen.

Police officers should be held to the same standards and codes of conduct as other people. If a civilian had beaten up that man like that, they would be in jail for aggrivated assault. So should those police officers.

Reply>>> The police are not like the rest of us,
THey have duty to up hold the law. If the police are found to have broken th elaw, then they too should stand trial. It's the law.<<<<

It is possible to take a perp down with force without maiming or putting them in the hospital, or damn near dead. They seem to do it all the time with White perps. lol
REPly>>>Yes is it possiable, and we both know they are trained to do so. That's why there are only a few cases like this. That most of us find out about.

Unless Blacksinaction and Shadow are saying that Black perps are more violent than White perps.......


response>>>>
If you notice, I din't bring race into this. It is behavior of the non-thinking as the bases of this. But if you want to use, crime stats, in some areas of the nation, some black folks are more violent than white folks. <<<<<
quote:
Originally posted by MBM:
quote:
Originally posted by Shadow:

no resisting arress.

'The law is the law'


The punishment for resisting arrest (which by the way has not been proven in this case) is not the death penalty.


Hold on a second? THis man is not dead yet.

"Where there is no vision, the people perish. I beleive that a man should be treated like a man until he proves to you that he should be treated otherwise. If that is his wish, let it be granted">>>>Samuel Vance
quote:
Originally posted by Kweli4Real:
quote:
Originally posted by Shadow:
Funny! how folks always have a cam when they think the police is wrong.

In just about all case's of the police being caught on tape, happens when a thug, or stupid person high on illegal drugs get their azz beat down, for not follow the rules.
/Excepe Dollo case./




If you look up these caeses. You'll will find the same pattern over and over again. Crimimal records long as the day.

Where are the pictures on nation tv, NEt, new papers, of the thousands of cases, where the thugs beat , kill, and rape their VICTIMS?
Where is the out cry for them? ANy one can check any city in this nation for crimes against the law abiding citizens. But you won't find folks standing up against the treatment of these VICTIMS?
AfricanAmerica, peeps Post some VICTIMS pics after these humans picecs of waste get finshed with them.


I'm with you Shadow. Let's just abort those criminals to be before they are born. That way they will not rob, rape or kill us good folk. And, we won't have to kill them in the alleys of our cities. bs


lol '
Were have you been?
We are ready have the tech knowledge to do so.
But the good folks like myself is against ABortion, so let them live, we'l get them later, in the alleys and side streets. Thanks Goodness we have the police to keep them in check.

'WEak people never give way when they ought to.">>Jean Francois
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quote:
Originally posted by Blacksanction:
Kweli4Real "I'm with you Shadow. Let's just abort those criminals to be before they are born. That way they will not rob, rape or kill us good folk. And, we won't have to kill them in the alleys of our cities. "

A bit much.

Yeah the police have nothing better to do than to go out find some poor asshole and beat the living shit out of them then when the person is in medical distress render CPR and call more witnesses to the scene so that they could be investigated by both their own department, tv and the community. How bloody brilliant is that?
That certainly smacks of coverup and intent.

It"s always the po po's fault, far be it for the drug addled to take responsibility for taking an unknown quantity/quality of drugs.

Excited delirium look it up.


5^
quote:
Originally posted by Shadow:
response>>>>
If you notice, I din't bring race into this. It is behavior of the non-thinking as the bases of this. But if you want to use, crime stats, in some areas of the nation, some black folks are more violent than white folks. <<<<<


In you notice, I DID BRING IT UP.

I brought it in because cops seem to have no problem using force on White arreste resisters without putting them in the hospital.

Black folks are more violent than White folks? POST CERTIFIABLE SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE OR STFU. You're doing nothing but relying on White stereotypes of "those damn violent niggers".

POST EVIDENCE OR STFU. I'll take none of your Pat Buchanon-rhetoric. Typical non-thinking Neocon scrub.
Also, I would like for you to defend your notion that cops are somehow above orderly conduct laws and should be allowed to beat people up and put them in the hospital for no justifiable reason. Giving some resistance is not an excuse to beat someone into a coma, they seem to avoid doing that with equally violent (and sometimes more violent) White resisters.


That last people who believed that police should be allowed to act above the law and kill people without reprocussions were the Nazis and Gestapos.......
Oh my Eek I failed to find a white person who ended up unconscious from a beating by the police.
you are correct i started to go down that path and then I said to myself fuckit i have better things to do with my time Smile but am not sure if this would qualify as the person died not just hospitalized.

http://www.ocap.ca/legal/vassverdict.html

I have never said or implied that blacks resist more that whites and thus the police escalate their level of force.

I still remain some what unsympathetic to persons who use drugs go out of control and subsequently get injured. Here's a novel idea don't do drugs.
Do not lump law abiding citizens who get assaulted by bad police with idiots who take drugs or just want to fight police (suicide by cop).

I know it's hard but there is a big difference between the groups.
quote:
Originally posted by Blacksanction:

But am not sure if this would qualify as the person died not just hospitalized.

http://www.ocap.ca/legal/vassverdict.html


Blacksanction,

I'm not going to argue particulars or qualifications over a case of such unnecessary police brutality as the Otto Vass case appears to be. To do so would be exceedingly insensitive. Let's just forget I ever asked.
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I'm too lazy to find the appropriate thread to post this so I'll put it here.

My opposition to the DP continues. And further, I think that in cases where prosecutors and/or police engage in misconduct that results in a not guilty person being convicted, they should be charged with felony perjury, and serve at a minimum however much time the wrongfully convicted person served. And in the case where the misconduct results in a wrongfully convicted person's execution, then the prosecutor(s) and/or police officer(s) should be charged with manslaughter.


http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/printstory.mpl/metropolitan/3471520
Did Texas execute an innocent man?
By LISE OLSEN
© 2005 Houston Chronicle

Texas executed its fifth teenage offender at 22 minutes after midnight on Aug. 24, 1993, after his last request for bubble gum had been refused and his final claim of innocence had been forever silenced.

ADVERTISEMENT

Ruben Cantu, 17 at the time of his crime, had no previous convictions, but a San Antonio prosecutor had branded him a violent thief, gang member and murderer who ruthlessly shot one victim nine times with a rifle before emptying at least nine more rounds into the only eyewitness "” a man who barely survived to testify.

Four days after a Bexar County jury delivered its verdict, Cantu wrote this letter to the residents of San Antonio: "My name is Ruben M. Cantu and I am only 18 years old. I got to the 9th grade and I have been framed in a capital murder case."

A dozen years after his execution, a Houston Chronicle investigation suggests that Cantu, a former special-ed student who grew up in a tough neighborhood on the south side of San Antonio, was likely telling the truth.

Cantu's long-silent co-defendant, David Garza, just 15 when the two boys allegedly committed a murder-robbery together, has signed a sworn affidavit saying he allowed his friend to be falsely accused, though Cantu wasn't with him the night of the killing.

And the lone eyewitness, the man who survived the shooting, has recanted. He told the Chronicle he's sure that the person who shot him was not Cantu, but he felt pressured by police to identify the boy as the killer. Juan Moreno, an illegal immigrant at the time of the shooting, said his damning in-court identification was based on his fear of authorities and police interest in Cantu.

Cantu "was innocent. It was a case of an innocent person being killed," Moreno said.
Kweli4Real

My opposition to the DP continues. And further, I think that in cases where prosecutors and/or police engage in misconduct that results in a not guilty person being convicted, they should be charged with felony perjury, and serve at a minimum however much time the wrongfully convicted person served. And in the case where the misconduct results in a wrongfully convicted person's execution, then the prosecutor(s) and/or police officer(s) should be charged with manslaughter.
________________________________________________

That is an out standing idea. The fly in the ointment though is if they acted in good faith but had to rely on the testimony of a snivelling coward as the one example that you provided.
_______________________________________________
Cantu's long-silent co-defendant, David Garza, just 15 when the two boys allegedly committed a murder-robbery together, has signed a sworn affidavit saying he allowed his friend to be falsely accused, though Cantu wasn't with him the night of the killing.
__________________________________________________

I oppose malicious prosecutions as there is no place for it in or society. if there was a consequence for the attorney ,defence and prosecution and the judge and police to find a just verdict)i do belive that there would be less wrongfully convicted on death row.

That is fine by me because it means that the folks on the row are guilty as sin.
quote:
Originally posted by Blacksanction:
I oppose malicious prosecutions as there is no place for it in or society. if there was a consequence for the attorney ,defence and prosecution and the judge and police to find a just verdict)i do belive that there would be less wrongfully convicted on death row.

That is fine by me because it means that the folks on the row are guilty as sin.


Well, that's a start.
quote:
Originally posted by Kweli4Real:
I'm too lazy to find the appropriate thread to post this so I'll put it here.


This is an appropriate place. (And you beat me to this one... Wink )

quote:
Texas executed its fifth teenage offender at 22 minutes after midnight on Aug. 24, 1993, after his last request for bubble gum had been refused and his final claim of innocence had been forever silenced.

Ruben Cantu, 17 at the time of his crime, had no previous convictions, but a San Antonio prosecutor had branded him a violent thief, gang member and murderer who ruthlessly shot one victim nine times with a rifle before emptying at least nine more rounds into the only eyewitness "” a man who barely survived to testify.


I wonder if the crusaders for bloodlust would condone Cantu's family having a go at all those complicit in his wrongful execution?

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