I think it is.

If I were in the NBA I would not abide by it, I would actually sue to not have to wear not faggoty azz "blazer & tie"...

Excuse my French but this is plane dumb.

They will eventually put afros, dreadz & corn rollz on the list just wait and see.

We better stop letting white people define what racism is and whay it aint...

There is no beter way to keep niggas on plantations then to define thier reality for them...
Original Post
I have thought about this over the past couple of days and have concluded, it is racist but should not be likened to the kind of racism that thwarts Black upward mobility.

Truthfully, I looked at myself and asked could I come to work dressed as these brothers dress? The answer is no. So then I asked is my job dress code racist or one meant to project a particular image? I answered the later. The image the company I work for seeks to project is one that they believe will benifit them and has absolutely nothing to do with me personally because everyone is affected by the dress code. I know what you thinking now, the NBA is majority Black and because of that maybe the dress code should be more intune with the majority way of dressing. I agree but when you are a slave to the dollar $$ , a highly paid and rich slave albeit you still do not have control over yourself, your master does.

BTW, I do not think there is anything faggoty about a Blazer and Tie... $$
I have to 'log in' as 'not opposed' to the dress code. I also do not thing the bling-bling, do-rag, etc is racist.

Granted these are things more typically worn by African American players. Notably, those things are NOT synonymous with 'black'.

The African immigrant players don't seem to typically wear the attire.

So it is NOT 'a black thing'.

You may be right that next it will 'fro's' and 'twists'.

You might extend it to gold teeth, and earrings.

I don't think items of dress is the point where we should holler 'foul'.

There was a time when the African American entered the dressing room before the game, and left the dressing room after the game 'choke four-high' well groomed, and 'looking goood'.

Clearly, times have changed, and are 'seen' as going 'downhill.'

Playing basketball is a J-o-b.

The employer has a right to 'draw the line.'

It IS his ball.

The employee has the right to quit.

Or sue.

PEACE

Jim Chester
quote:
I know what you thinking now, the NBA is majority Black and because of that maybe the dress code should be more intune with the majority way of dressing.
Actually, it's exactly the opposite. As you so yourself, many a fan and commentator about this situation will look at the prevailing norms in the "real world", etc. A lot of people's sentiments are, "Hey. If I have to wear certain types of clothes to my job and look "presentable" then they should to." But the problem is, very few people stop and think what their job is and what's necessary to uphold or present the image that should be projected.

MLB basically called the NBA's deal bullshit. Baseball doesn't have and at the same time doesn't make an issue out of what is really a non-issue.

Me, I pretty conservative, dress-wise, myself and damn near despise all that high-end designer wear or bling-bling stuff. But what I like and even what I have to wear to my job, which sure isn't anything comparable to sports, really should have nothing to do with how I view this situation.

What's so "racist" about the NBA Dress Code is the attempt to "control"... It's an obvious response to the racist fans, Black and White, and the fear that the Hip Hop "thug" image via clothing can be "dressed up" in a shirt and tie and, somehow, those same racist fans not be as racist. Well, maybe I'm wrong. If David Stern can show he has good control over his "N*ggers" maybe White folks will flock to the NBA and disregard the tattoos and cornrows and forget, like they did with Jordan, etc. that A.I. and the most Hip Hop of players are actually BLACK. Oops! I meant, as Chris Rock would say, "N*ggers".

There is suppose to be some readily discernable difference that clothing just automatically gives away. Not that PROFILING has anything to do with it.

Seriously, though, when David Stern himself speaks about the situation and basically calls and treat the players as kids and not as adults (see quote below) that stuff definitely can't be separated from the racist-based "image" the NBA that he is supposedly trying to clean up -- superficially. Some of this is due perhaps because of how NBA players are, when they sit on benches in plain clothes, much more visible than players in other sports.

quote:
"If they are really going to have a problem, they will have to ***make a decision about how they want to spend their adult life*** in terms of playing in the NBA or not," Stern said.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2195141
And that's old-school and duly noted as ineffective or counterproductive management. In fact, it's a poor management style. But I guess it looks good and makes David Stern a big man... or THE MAN (coming down on the brothers showing them who's boss).

I do have a suggestion though... How come they couldn't reached a simple agreement to have the players come and go to the arena in some sort of Team Paraphenilia, whether warm-ups or what-have-you, and place an emphasis on promoting that NBA image? Players could choose from any number of their respective teams wardrobe or clothing with their Teams Logo to express a certaim amount of individuality while at the same time presenting team and league spirit/image.

This is pretty interesting:
quote:
Our referees are always attired a certain way based upon their job description when they come into the building. Our coaches are attired a certain way when they come on the court. We decided that it was time [for the players]."
And the players "job description" calls for what exactly?

Are the NBA players going to have "Dress Down Days"? When will they get that treat? I mean, seriously... What part of a basketball players "job description" calls for a shirt & tie? Are the referrees wearing 3-piece suits when they come and go to games?

I just wanna know...

I'd also like to know how come this isn't an issue with any other professional sports league. We know why it's become one with the NBA. Obviously it has reached Critical (and threatening) N*gger Mass.
Firstly fellaz', being an athlete is not the equivalent to having a job...

They have similarities but are not equals.

To put it in automotive terms...

A car salesman is an employee of the company..

What is the car?

Players are the car...

They are what people come to see, purchase or buy...

Employees contribute to the finished product, but they are NOT the finished product.

In the real world the only equal to what players are, is an entertainer / recording artist / actor.
Thank you, Blaqfist...

Very interesting and insightful perspective.
Of course, an argument can be made that NBA players are a combination of both - product and employees. But I see your point.

I just have real problem with all that Power Plays involved, all the overtones/undertones and how this does not compare with other sports or whatever can reasonably be called their "job description".

Maybe Stern should unveil that part of their "job description" that requires this Dress Code. That and the actual common sense behind it...

In my job, I'm required to wear shirt & tie. But, considering the nature of my job, and the instances when we don't have to uphold the highest image via clothing due to less actual contact with the public, my "uniform" has some flexibility that is tailored towards what I'm actually doing on a given day.

So the question becomes: What are the players doing, day in and day out, when they merely come and go to games? What makes it necessary for them to dress up so much? Their contact with the public is minimal. When they have autograph signings, those are hardly in shirt and tie. And, hell, they are athletes. It's their job to be "athletic". So what's really up with that?
quote:
Originally posted by Faheem:
I have thought about this over the past couple of days and have concluded, it is racist but should not be likened to the kind of racism that thwarts Black upward mobility.

Truthfully, I looked at myself and asked could I come to work dressed as these brothers dress? The answer is no. So then I asked is my job dress code racist or one meant to project a particular image? I answered the later. The image the company I work for seeks to project is one that they believe will benifit them and has absolutely nothing to do with me personally because everyone is affected by the dress code. I know what you thinking now, the NBA is majority Black and because of that maybe the dress code should be more intune with the majority way of dressing. I agree but when you are a slave to the dollar $$ , a highly paid and rich slave albeit you still do not have control over yourself, your master does.

BTW, I do not think there is anything faggoty about a Blazer and Tie... $$


tfro
There is nothing "wrong" with wearing a suit to the game...

Making it "maditory" is wrong..

Tim Duncan said he would just sit in the locker room for games he was injured, before he would wear a suit..

And I would do the same thing, or I would either just wear team warm-ups, or the loudest obnoxiously pink & grean suit I could find.
quote:
Tim Duncan said he would just sit in the locker room for games he was injured, before he would wear a suit



Tim Duncan said that.... I have to see the video to believe that, He is too docile to speak like that, but maybe I am wrong.
Oh give me a freaking break!! we have grown men getting paid millions of dollars to play a game and they are complaining because they actually have to dress up like grown people.

Does the term "spoiled rotten" ring true here.
And the fact that they get paid so much money has what to do with the dress code?

The fact that they are grown men, for one, means the NBA could have and should approached this and those grown men in a more MATURE manner as opposed to a REACTIONARY one. PERIOD!

And spoiled people are nothing new... But whether spoiled or not, what does that have to do with with this ruling?

And, yes, FAHEEM... It is being reported pretty widely that even Tim Duncan doesn't like the rule. And, of course, Mark Cuban is telling all the company secrets.

quote:
Contrary to popular belief, the dress code wasnt in response to a problem with any players, it was in response to problems with owners.

...In a nutshell, they dont talk to their players.

Its amazing to me that this is really only a problem in professional sports. In "regular" business... I can trust my managers to maintain relationships with all of our employees. When there is a corporate initiative, we know how to work through any trouble spots and to learn as an organization how to overcome problems, whether internal or external.

Those skills dont exist everywhere in the NBA.

For many teams, I dont even want to say most teams, if the team wants to try something different , they are truly afraid of how their players, particularly their stars might respond. Its the teams that are afraid of their players.

Its funny how the media likes to talk about the fundamentals of the players on the court being lacking, the real lack of fundamentals is in the teams' executive suites.

A couple corporate customers of the league... were uncomfortable with the appearance of some players.
...Ownership didnt feel comfortable asking those players to work with the teams for the best of the league.
http://www.blogmaverick.com/entry/1234000247063975
They'll say we're playing the race card, but this is off the wall. The majority of the NBA IS Black, and it's obvious that they are trying to do away with the cultural influences Blacks have on basketball. Trying to get more white people involved is all it is.
quote:
Originally posted by SistahSouljah:
They'll say we're playing the race card, but this is off the wall. The majority of the NBA IS Black, and it's obvious that they are trying to do away with the cultural influences Blacks have on basketball. Trying to get more white people involved is all it is.


So lets get this straight, by telling folks to dress better or more professional is somehow trying to get rid of the cultural influences blacks have on basketball, dressing better is not going to do that, having more European league players will do that quicker than a dress code.
quote:
Originally posted by Nmaginate:
And the fact that they get paid so much money has what to do with the dress code?

The fact that they are grown men, for one, means the NBA could have and should approached this and those grown men in a more MATURE manner as opposed to a REACTIONARY one. PERIOD!

And spoiled people are nothing new... But whether spoiled or not, what does that have to do with with this ruling?

And, yes, FAHEEM... It is being reported pretty widely that even Tim Duncan doesn't like the rule. And, of course, Mark Cuban is telling all the company secrets.

quote:
Contrary to popular belief, the dress code wasnt in response to a problem with any players, it was in response to problems with owners.

...In a nutshell, they dont talk to their players.

Its amazing to me that this is really only a problem in professional sports. In "regular" business... I can trust my managers to maintain relationships with all of our employees. When there is a corporate initiative, we know how to work through any trouble spots and to learn as an organization how to overcome problems, whether internal or external.

Those skills dont exist everywhere in the NBA.

For many teams, I dont even want to say most teams, if the team wants to try something different , they are truly afraid of how their players, particularly their stars might respond. Its the teams that are afraid of their players.

Its funny how the media likes to talk about the fundamentals of the players on the court being lacking, the real lack of fundamentals is in the teams' executive suites.

A couple corporate customers of the league... were uncomfortable with the appearance of some players.
...Ownership didnt feel comfortable asking those players to work with the teams for the best of the league.
http://www.blogmaverick.com/entry/1234000247063975


And how is the fact that being asked to dress better racist?
That's the point.

BETTER?!

Is this BETTER all inclusive of the BLACK COMMUNITY?

OR is it merely a EUROPEAN imposed opinion of what's FASHIONABLE?
When these guys are not on the court they are officially OFF-DUTY...

Should your job be able to dictate what you were OFF-DUTY?
quote:
Originally posted by HeruStar:
That's the point.

BETTER?!

Is this BETTER all inclusive of the BLACK COMMUNITY?

OR is it merely a EUROPEAN imposed opinion of what's FASHIONABLE?


So when you wear a suit do you consider it copying a European idea of dress or just the fact being well dressed includes the idea of wearing a suit.
quote:
And how is the fact that being asked to dress better racist?
JD, you got some questions of mine to address first. Plus I've stated my reasons already.

I await your responses to my questions to you.

BTW, clothing is an cultural artifact. And it matters not what someone "thinks" when they wear a suit. But please, do tell: Wearing a suit has what to do with Basketball?

Stern said it was about clothing to fit their "job description"... A suit or "business casual" has what to do with Basketball?
quote:
Originally posted by HeruStar:
When these guys are not on the court they are officially OFF-DUTY...

Should your job be able to dictate what you were OFF-DUTY?


Gee I throught the article said when they were on team/NBA business. Sounds like they are on the clock to me.
I'm not sure if anyone will write about this but I heard Scoop Jackson (one of those NBA insider reporters for those who don't know him) mention yesterday that the dress code was part of the new collective bargaining agreement signed in late June. So, either we have some players that are feigning surprise at the dress code or a lot of players that didn't read everything they agreed to.
quote:
And how is the fact that being asked to dress better racist?
The reason they are being asked to "dress better" is what?

To appease the racist mindset of the NBA's White Corporate Sponsors and White Fan base who see "N*gger" when they see "Hip Hop".

It's not that hard to see...
quote:
Originally posted by Nmaginate:
quote:
And how is the fact that being asked to dress better racist?
JD, you got some questions of mine to address first. Plus I've stated my reasons already.

I await your responses to my questions to you.


Nmaginate,

Maybe the money issue has to do with the fact they are paid to represent a business in which they are very well compensated for and while the compensation is tied directly to their skills, no one should be surprised that representing the league while on league business is part of the package deal.

Granted that David Stern could have approached this in a better manner, but the way I read it the rule only talks to clothing worn while on team or NBA business. i doubt that you would find anybody in corporate america who would disagree with the notion that while on the "clock" you dress in a manner that gives a good image of the company. If the matter was what they wore all the time, I would consider it an invasion the players rights, but since the issue is tied directly to business conducted in the name of the league I have no problem with it.
DD,

I'm not sure, for what I've read, how clear the dress code, and the specifics were. Plus when bargaining on things that were probably of much greater priority, that was something that was sacrificed in a lot of ways.

There could have been a mere agreement in principle without a lot of specifics, I dunno. But that sounds like something the players union, if no one else, should have been sure to make clear.

But even so, there's still the issue where this issue should never have had to be a contract table issue only. As Mark Cuban noted, it should have been discussed through the proper team channels where, if nothing else, they could have put the onus on the players to come up with a "professional" dress code they could agree to of their own making that would not be at odds with the image the league wants to have.

It's just bad management, all the way around.
quote:
Originally posted by jazzdog:
quote:
Originally posted by SistahSouljah:
They'll say we're playing the race card, but this is off the wall. The majority of the NBA IS Black, and it's obvious that they are trying to do away with the cultural influences Blacks have on basketball. Trying to get more white people involved is all it is.


So lets get this straight, by telling folks to dress better or more professional is somehow trying to get rid of the cultural influences blacks have on basketball, dressing better is not going to do that, having more European league players will do that quicker than a dress code.


But if having more Euro league players means having less Black players, forget about it. They want to gain a larger white audience, not lose the Black one they have.
quote:
Originally posted by Nmaginate:
quote:
And how is the fact that being asked to dress better racist?
The reason they are being asked to "dress better" is what?

To appease the racist mindset of the NBA's White Corporate Sponsors and White Fan base who see "N*gger" when they see "Hip Hop".

It's not that hard to see...


Considering that the overwhelming number of fans who go to NBA games are white, while they may see N*ggers, that is certainly not stopping them from spending their money on the game. Reigning in the hip hop image would make sense if it threatens the bottom line which any business would do with a disruptive element if it effects business.

If the league does anything to appease the white mindset it would be to develop and bring into the league more of the European league players (white) as a counterbalance to what as overwhelming being a mostly black league.
quote:
Originally posted by SistahSouljah:
quote:
Originally posted by jazzdog:
quote:
Originally posted by SistahSouljah:
They'll say we're playing the race card, but this is off the wall. The majority of the NBA IS Black, and it's obvious that they are trying to do away with the cultural influences Blacks have on basketball. Trying to get more white people involved is all it is.


So lets get this straight, by telling folks to dress better or more professional is somehow trying to get rid of the cultural influences blacks have on basketball, dressing better is not going to do that, having more European league players will do that quicker than a dress code.


But if having more Euro league players means having less Black players, forget about it. They want to gain a larger white audience, not lose the Black one they have.


That would imply that on their part they are using some common sense, but if there idea is a league that represents and looks like the majority of the ticket buyers, then yes I can see them making the league more white. You would still have your black "All Stars" because they bring in the bucks, but what about the guys sitting on the bench, the role players, as long as they are plenty of big name black stars, why couldn't all the support role players be white. After all you don't go to the game to see the guys sitting on the bench, in fact most people probably couldn't name some of those guys.
quote:
i doubt that you would find anybody in corporate america who would disagree with the notion that while on the "clock" you dress in a manner that gives a good image of the company.
JD, I listed the thoughts of a "business man" and team owner, Mark Cuban. So, sorrry... I already found somebody. And even he agrees with the dress code... and, personally, I really don't. But ain't a damn thing about this about me.

That's the point... beyond the fact that this is driven by some racist White sentiments with dollars attached to them.

But, somehow you seem to have forgotten to answer my questions. And, beyond that, you're addressing me as if I said some "off-duty" stuff like HERU did.

"Good Image Of The Company"... WTF is that?

And they are paid to play basketball. When they are on NBA business what they do is directly related to the basketball court. So their "job description" and hence their attire shouldn't have to be anything other than related to that court.

And if the deal is about "representing the league" then what I suggested about a alternative dress code with players wearing their own choice of their respective teams' apparel would seem a good way to do it. And, if you link to that Mark Cuban blog-thread, you'll see how he's entertaining that very notion as he effectively approached his players for some feedback and that's what they came up with.

"Job Description" = Basketball player.
B-Ball player clothing = Basketball wear.

That's their "job". Not corporate meetings or addressing a public like that.

And HOW MUCH THEY GET PAID has nothing to do with this. Again, they are paid to play basketball.
quote:
Originally posted by jazzdog:

That would imply that on their part they are using some common sense, but if there idea is a league that represents and looks like the majority of the ticket buyers, then yes I can see them making the league more white. You would still have your black "All Stars" because they bring in the bucks, but what about the guys sitting on the bench, the role players, as long as they are plenty of big name black stars, why couldn't all the support role players be white. After all you don't go to the game to see the guys sitting on the bench, in fact most people probably couldn't name some of those guys.


That's a good point too. I don't have a problem with the leauge wanting the players to look professional, but I think it's natural to question their motives. Plus, is it their job to say what the guys must wear when they're not on the court?
quote:
Considering that the overwhelming number of fans who go to NBA games are white, while they may see N*ggers, that is certainly not stopping them from spending their money on the game.
And?? You asked how was it "racist". Well, now you're saying it okay even while saying the supposedly bad [dress] "image" doesn't seem to have an effect on stopping Whites from spending their money.

There is nothing surprising in White people paying to see "them N*ggers" play. You know, as long as they know their place and don't act like "N*ggers".

And Slavery was "Bottom Line" driven... but that didn't make it any less RACIST, in its effect if not in its intentions or in what motivated it.

This case is one that's clearly motivated, as I said, by some clear racist sentiments. But, I guess, all that racist (however you see it) is okay as long as a "N*gger" is getting paid.
quote:
Originally posted by Nmaginate:
quote:
i doubt that you would find anybody in corporate america who would disagree with the notion that while on the "clock" you dress in a manner that gives a good image of the company.
JD, I listed the thoughts of a "business man" and team owner, Mark Cuban. So, sorrry... I already found somebody. And even he agrees with the dress code... and, personally, I really don't. But ain't a damn thing about this about me.

That's the point... beyond the fact that this is driven by some racist White sentiments with dollars attached to them.

But, somehow you seem to have forgotten to answer my questions. And, beyond that, you're addressing me as if I said some "off-duty" stuff like HERU did.

"Good Image Of The Company"... WTF is that?

And they are paid to play basketball. When they are on NBA business what they do is directly related to the basketball court. So their "job description" and hence their attire shouldn't have to be anything other than related to that court.

And if the deal is about "representing the league" then what I suggested about a alternative dress code with players wearing their own choice of their respective teams' apparel would seem a good way to do it. And, if you link to that Mark Cuban blog-thread, you'll see how he's entertaining that very notion as he effectively approached his players for some feedback and that's what they came up with.

"Job Description" = Basketball player.
B-Ball player clothing = Basketball wear.

That's their "job". Not corporate meetings or addressing a public like that.

And HOW MUCH THEY GET PAID has nothing to do with this. Again, they are paid to play basketball.


I through I answered your questions and the off-duty was a reference to the article and how it stated they were representing the league, wasn't trying to tied you to Heru.
quote:
Originally posted by Nmaginate:
DD,

I'm not sure, for what I've read, how clear the dress code, and the specifics were. Plus when bargaining on things that were probably of much greater priority, that was something that was sacrificed in a lot of ways.

There could have been a mere agreement in principle without a lot of specifics, I dunno. But that sounds like something the players union, if no one else, should have been sure to make clear.

But even so, there's still the issue where this issue should never have had to be a contract table issue only. As Mark Cuban noted, it should have been discussed through the proper team channels where, if nothing else, they could have put the onus on the players to come up with a "professional" dress code they could agree to of their own making that would not be at odds with the image the league wants to have.

It's just bad management, all the way around.


I agree. This issue should have been handled much better. I thought NBA licensed gear (warmups, polos, etc.) with the team or league logo would have been a smarter option.

This will backfire on Stern over time. You can't tap into hip hop culture to put the fans' butts back in the seats, then try to put it back on the shelf once you make your money.

You think there might be some P-I-M-P in Stern's blood? $$
quote:
Originally posted by Nmaginate:
quote:
Considering that the overwhelming number of fans who go to NBA games are white, while they may see N*ggers, that is certainly not stopping them from spending their money on the game.
And?? You asked how was it "racist". Well, now you're saying it okay even while saying the supposedly bad [dress] "image" doesn't seem to have an effect on stopping Whites from spending their money.

There is nothing surprising in White people paying to see "them N*ggers" play. You know, as long as they know their place and don't act like "N*ggers".

And Slavery was "Bottom Line" driven... but that didn't make it any less RACIST, in its effect if not in its intentions or in what motivated it.

This case is one that's clearly motivated, as I said, by some clear racist sentiments. But, I guess, all that racist (however you see it) is okay as long as a "N*gger" is getting paid.


What you did was inject your idea that whites all see nothing but "N*ggers" playing, all I did was continue the idea/discussion that what white ticket holders see obiviously does not influence their decision to pay good money to go to a game, and remember you described the players as "N*ggers". And just how is stating a fact equated to me being ok with it, I never said it was ok, but the fact is whites are continuing to go to games while decrying what they see in the league, which in my mine doesn't make awhole lot of sense but hey its their money.
Last edited {1}
quote:
Never said it was ok, just stated a fact that whites are continuing to go to games while decrying what they see in the league.
Then you are very uninformed. Or, as usual being very disingenuous.

What was the BOTTOM LINE comment for, JD?
That's exactly what the league is concerned about. You make a vague reference to Whites "continuing to go to games" without even thinking to reference whether attendance or ratings have fallen off or if it's projected to be threatened in the short/long term somehow by the "image" problem.

So you said something that amounts to some of your typical unthinking and typical inability to support your points and contend with the points of others.

As far as it being "racist"... DUDE, you practically conceded that: while they may see N*ggers

Your whole premise is based on BS.
"They may still be coming" but since there is this sentiment and NBA ratings definitely have been down since the end of the Jordan Era... "They are not coming" and viewing in the same numbers... and "growing the league" against that backdrop poses some BOTTOM LINE issues.

So please talk to me after you've had some coffee or something.

"Never said it was okay"

You called the players "spoiled" this and that for not graciously conceding to the dictate and for dare saying something about what they feel is driving this.

You did, in fact, say it was okay when you said, in essence, it's what they have to do to "represent the league" and those "grown men" should be crying about it. They're getting paid right? Paid very well, didn't you say?

So everything you've said has been about you saying it was "okay". You've definitely said nothing to the contrary. You're still saying, in essence, "It's Not Racist. Prove It." So, unless you're fully accepting that it is, you can't try to pretend you're saying that "it's not okay" the way these racist sentiments dictate things in the NBA (in a way things aren't in other sports that do have more of a balance).

quote:
all I did was continue the fact that what they see does not influence their decision to pay good money to go to a game.
Check that with some real FACTS.

The NBA is trying to make sure they sale those luxury boxes. When these White corporate sponsors haggle over the "image" their saying they don't want to pay for those luxury boxes to see those "images". NBA TV ratings, down since the Jordan Era because the White public generally is not as interested, with well documented racist sentiments that have everything to do with them associating cornrows and tattoos to "thugism".
quote:
What you did was inject your idea that whites all see nothing but "N*ggers" playing
Please, dude... Get a grip!

There is nothing surprising in White people paying to see "them N*ggers" play.
You know, as long as they know their place and don't act like "N*ggers".


What I actually said doesn't match with what you're trying to say. In fact, I already covered that. So, no. I said nothing like [ALL] Whites see "nothing but n*ggers".

And all the players for sure don't subscribe to or wear the "Hip Hop" garb.
Gee, and to think that all I said was that whites are continuing to go to ballgames, guess all those white folks on tv must be cardboard cutouts, just how am I uniformed if in fact they are going. Granted attendance has been going down since his Airness left the game but overwhelming the majority of ticket holders continue to be white or has that changed?

"Never say that it was okay" please skip the coffee and go get yourself an adult beverage, as you usually do, you try to muddy up the conservation with BS, my response and go back and read it slow was in response to your ending statement about "is okay as long as the N*ggger is getting paid" I mean that was your statement was it not. I believe I even asked you how is stating a fact equated to being ok with a situation, the statement that whites continue to pay serious money for games while complaining about the games image.

As for real facts, this clothing issue is a blip on the screen of what is really going to happen to change the league which I believe will be the continued development, marketing and inportation of players from Europe and down under, that is what is going to fill those luxory boxes.

And as for what I believe I think my initial statement on the subject makes it clear that I don't think that its racist or a big issue, you trying to make it sound like I'm pretending otherwise is pretty sad.

By the way:

June 18, 2004: Final 2003-04 NBA Season Attendance

This year's average regular season attendance of 17,050 fans per game is the highest since the 1997-98 season (17,135), the last season the NBA averaged more than 17,000 fans per game. NBA arenas were filled to more than 89.2% capacity, the fourth highest percent capacity all-time and the highest total since the 1997-98 season. Team-by-team attendance.
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Granted attendance has been going down since his Airness left the game but overwhelming the majority of ticket holders continue to be white or has that changed?
IRRELEVANT... The question is whether the number of White ticketholders, viewers and corporate sponsors are getting thinner and thinner particularly under the pretext of the "image".

That's a certainty with viewers. The quotes and NBA insiders say that's what's up with certain corporate sponsors.

quote:
all I said was that whites are continuing to go to ballgames, guess all those white folks on tv must be cardboard cutouts
I'm not sleep or dreaming of what caused you to say that and what you thought you were responding to and contending with. You said:
What white ticket holders see obiviously does not influence their decision to pay good money to go to a game...

When attendance is falling off and, via White "used to be" or would-be fan sentiments, some of that is attributed or suspected to be related to the "image" then the ticket buying decisions are being influenced by what they see.

quote:
Contrary to popular belief, the dress code wasnt in response to a problem with any players, it was in response to problems with owners.

...A couple corporate customers of the league... were uncomfortable with the appearance of some players.
Link on Page 1.

The story is about the overall revenues (and sustaining or increasing them) and not just the fans (alone) buying mere tickets. And umm... It is a league with 30 teams. The ones you most likely see on TV won't be the ones with the lesser fan bases.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4752194
When these guys are not on the court they are officially OFF-DUTY...---HeruStar

Typically, such contracts extend to off-court issues.

This demand by the players will ultimately get back to the societal demand that 'No one can tell me what to do; even if I work for you.'

Make no mistake, basketball players are employees. If nothing else is convincing, why do they think they need, and have, unions.

They are employees albeit with a contract.

AND...they are NOT management.

Someone tells them what to do, when to do it, and how to do. They are even told how often to do it.

they are told when to come to work, and when to stay home, and when to walk and when to run.

And...when to jump and how high.

They are employees.

Iverson is being quote as saying the ruling is 'wrong, and fake'. I forget the third thing.

What he did not say is the ruling is racist.

Right on Allen.


PEACE

Jim Chester
I'm not sure whether this has been mentioned yet, but I see EXTRAORDINARY hypocrisy in this move. The Hip Hop movement/culture has profited the NBA in absolutely profound ways. It's embrace of throwback jerseys alone has, no doubt, lined the NBA's coffers tremendously over the years. To now repudiate the culture that it got rich from is, in my view, not only ignorant and bad business, but just plain dumb!

White America has a problem with young black men making millions of dollars. America should deal with that problem and not concern itself itself with how black men want to express their culture.

nono fro td6
Is this dress code racist?

I think it is ;the mention of wearing chains, is a shot at black people. Who else wears that type of stuff?

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