Skip to main content

quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
We're the only group in the world that cares so much about how they're perceived that we overly obsess over representation even at the expense of cultural productivity.


appl
Somehow, I knew you'd raise this point before I got back to this thread. This is the model minority fallacy at its finest.

If you don't like the music, don't buy it, don't listen to stations that play it, teach people your perspective and encourage those in your reach to follow your lead (if they agree with your assessment).
Ted Nugent - Wango Tango
From the album "Scream Dream"

All right! It's zee Wango, zee Tango
1-2-3-4
Come on boys
Time to Wango

My baby she like to rock
My baby she like to roll
My baby she can dance all night
My baby got no control
She do the Wango Tango

My baby she can scream and shout
My baby she can move it out
My baby she can take a chance
My baby got a brand new dance

Wango Tango
Wango Tango
It's a Wango Tango
Ooooh yeah! (oooooh..)
Baby!

My baby like to rock
My baby like to roll
My baby like to dance all night
She got no control
She do...

Wango Tango
Wango Tango
Wango Tango
Ooooh yeah! (oooooh..)

Yeahhhhhhhhhh!
Baby! Baby! Baby! Ooooh I like the way you look baby
You look like you're made for me honey
If you wanna take a little chance
I'm gonna show you a new dance
Baby I gotta Wango down one time with you honey
I like it, I like it, I like it, I like it, I like it
Well, it's a brand new dance
Yeah been sweepin' the nation
I said a brand new dance
A rock 'n' roll sensation
Yeah I like it baby, I do it every night
I got to do it 'cos I like it so much
Oh honey believe it baby
You see it's a crazed gyration of the rock generation
It's my motivation to avoid the nauseation, frustration
When I need some lubrication - Baby!
Kinda like, goes kinda like this
You take her right ankle out
You take her left ankle out
You get her belly propped down
You get her butt propped up
Yeah lookin' good now baby
I think you're in the right position now baby
Yeah but if you ain't quite ready I'll make sure everything is a little bit nicer 'cos
I'm gonna get a little talcum
I'm gonna borrow it from Malcolm
Yeah you look so good baby I'm startin to drool all over myself
I got the droolin', droolin', get all wet, salivate, salivate
I got slimy legs, slimy legs, slimy legs
Got slimy, slimy, slimy, slimy, heh heh heh
Yeah you look so good baby, I like it, I like it, I like it
You know what I been talkin' about honey
It's a nice dance, we gotta a nice dance goin' here
Now what you gotta do, I'll tell you what you gotta do
You got to pretend your face is a Maserati
It's a Maserati
It's a Maserati
It's a gettin' hotty
It's a Maserati, Maserati, Maserati
It's a fast one too man, that thing's turbocharged
You feel like a little fuel injection honey?
I'll tell ya about it, I'll tell you about it
I'll check out the hood scoop
I gotta get that hood scoop off, shine and shine and buff
I gotta buff it up, buff it up, buff it up, buff it up, buff it up,
Yeah, shiny now baby, heh heh heh
You've been drivin' all night long
It's time to put the old Maserati away
So you look for a garage, you think you see a garage
Wait a minute, Hey!, there's one up ahead
And the damn thing's open
Hello! Get in there!

Is my baby alive? (Is my baby alive?)
Is my baby alive? (Is my baby alive?)
Is my baby alive?
She Wango'd to death

Wango Tango (Wango Tango)
Wango Tango (Wango Tango)
Wango Tango (Wango Tango)
Wango Tango (Wango Tango)
Wango Tango
Wango Tango
Wango Tango
Wango Tango
Wango Wango
Tango Tango
Wango Wango Wango Wango
Tango Tango Tango Tango
Brother Honestbrother, even in the songs "White Rabbit" and "Cocaine Blues," both written and performed by White men, there is an obvious tone of shame and guilt in the lyrics, unlike in rap music where there is usually a boastful, laudatory tone. In typical gangster rap, doing "drug business" is sung as if it were a rite of passage, a badge of honor. The same is true for T-Pain, rather than feeling shame for his fascination with a trife stripper, he sings songs of praise. Now what's culturally-productive about that?
Girls, Girls, Girls
Motley Crue

Friday night and I need a fight
My motorcycle and a switchblade knife
Handful of grease in my hair feels right
But what I need to get me tight are

Girls, girls, girls
Long legs and burgundy lips
Girls, girls, girls
Dancin' down on the sunset strip
Girls, girls, girls
Red lips, fingertips

Trick or treat--sweet to eat
On halloween and new year's eve
Yankee girls ya just can't be beat
But you're the best when you're off their feet

Girls, girls, girls
At the dollhouse in ft. lauderdale
Girls, girls, girls
Rocking in atlanta at tattletails
Girls, girls, girls
Raising hell at the 7th veil

Have you read the news
In the soho tribune
Ya know she did me
Well then she broke my heart

I'm such a good good boy
I just need a new toy
I tell ya what, girl
Dance for me, ill keep you overemployed
Just tell me a story
You know the one I mean

Crazy horse, paris, france
Forget the names, remember romance
I got the photos, a ménage á trois
Musta broke those frenchies laws with those

Girls, girls, girls
Body shop, marble arch
Girls, girls, girls
Tropicana's where I lost my heart

Girls, girls, girls
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
Brother Honestbrother, even in the songs "White Rabbit" and "Cocaine Blues," both written and performed by White men, there is an obvious tone of shame and guilt in the lyrics, unlike in rap music where there is usually a boastful, laudatory tone. In typical gangster rap, doing "drug business" is sung as if it were a rite of passage, a badge of honor. The same is true for T-Pain, rather than feeling shame for his fascination with a trife stripper, he sings songs of praise. Now what's culturally-productive about that?


White Rabbit was sung by Grace Slick - a white woman

I'm not defending the song "I'm In love With A Stripper"... or saying that it's some sort of model of "cultural production". What I'm saying is that black folk spend too much time worrying about stuff like this... and this impulse is one of the things that get in the way of/hamper our cultural productivity...
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
If you don't like the music, don't buy it, don't listen to...


Yeah right, brother Ddouble, I know the drill, but this method isn't working either. Brother Honestbrother can dig up as many drug-related songs that he can find performed by White artists, but the truth of the matter is that Whites are not in the predicament that we are in. WE have a lot of work to do in our communities and WE cannot afford to dig ourselves in hole that's any deeper than the hole that's already been dug for us.
By the way, I'm not obsessed with how Blacks are "properly represented." I usually don't even entertain discussions about "The Effects of Rap Music" because I know no matter what we do or say, it's not going anywhere. I was into rap music hard at one time, and many of the lyrics recited in these songs were derogatory and offensive. So it's whatever. I just thought the boy who blasted this song in Best Buy had some nerve. There was something cocky about the way he put the song on as if he didn't give a rat's ass about who it offended when HE knew the lyrics were nasty. I don't like that and I should have asked him just who the hell does he think he is. Everyone doesn't want to hear that shit. That's the kind of music that should be played in the privacy of your home or your IPOD, NOT in a place of business. These young kids out here don't have any consideration or respect for people.
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
By the way, I'm not obsessed with how Blacks are "properly represented." I usually don't even entertain discussions about the effects of "rap music" because I know no matter what we do or say, it's not going anywhere. I was into rap music hard at one time, and many of the lyrics recited in these songs were derogatory and offensive. So it's whatever. I just thought the boy who blasted this song in Best Buy had some nerve. There was something cocky about the way he put the song on as if he didn't give a rat's ass about who it offended when HE knew the lyrics were nasty. I don't like that and I should have asked him just who the hell does he think he is.


Rowe, I don't mean to seem obnoxious. I don't like the song either.... It bothers me DEEPLY - and I mean DEEPLY - when my young nieces and nephew are exposed to this stuff...

I'm just saying that one bad reason to be worried about the music is the one that has us being overly concerned over what other people think...This motivation is the one that takes us out of the drivers seat and takes away our creative prerogative.

And moreover it is based on a distorted view of other people and of ourselves in relation to them...
Ok, but damn, when do things like values and human decency come into play? Where do we cross the line? Why not sing a song then about "I'm In Love With The Anus and The Pussy Hole." Or, why not sing a song about having orgies and putting your feet in your nose, or some crazy shit like that? The point is, when do we differentiate between cultural creativity and plain trifling mess? In my view, this "I'm In Love With A Stripper" does not represent anything remotely "African" or individualistic on the part of African-Americans. Ultimately, at some point, we're going to have to take a stand and say, THAT MESS RIGHT THERE DOES NOT REPRESENT US! I'm not communicating this as well as I can, because I'm tired, but do you see what I'm saying?
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
Ok, but damn, when do things like values and human decency come into play? Where do we cross the line? Why not sing a song then about "I'm In Love With The Anus and The Pussy Hole." Or, why not sing a song about having orgies and putting your feet in your nose, or some crazy shit like that? The point is, when do we differentiate between cultural creativity and plain trifling mess? In my view, this "I'm In Love With A Stripper" does not represent anything remotely "African" or individualistic on the part of African-Americans. Ultimately, at some point, we're going to have to take a stand and say, THAT MESS RIGHT THERE DOES NOT REPRESENT US! I'm not communicating this as well as I can, because I'm tired, but do you see what I'm saying?


I don't think we're that far apart here... I'm not saying we should be free to just put anything out there in the name of "cultural productivity"...What I'm saying is we need to take the energy we spend being ashamed over "I'm In Love With A Stripper" .... take that energy and that shame impulse and do something creatively productive with it....
Final statement: I just get tired of the constant clamor - even among ourselves - to distinguish 'good' negroes from 'bad' ones, 'positive' from 'negative'.... It's time we begin to consider ourselves as being fully possessed of all the complexities that human beings have. I can be positive and I'm proud of it. I can be negative as hell and I embrace that too. I can be everything inbetween. Art needs to reflect that complexity. Art is NOT about putting the best positive face on the group. It IS about expressing the identity of the group.

We need to deal with all that inner shame that surfaces every time we're confronted with something like "I'm in Love With A Stripper" or "it's Hard Out Here For A Pimp". This is stuff that belongs in a private session with a therapist and not in discussions of art.
No, HonestBrother ... I think Sorry 2004 is just a stupid ass song!! With the only intent being a song in his voice range that possibly could generate him some money!! Eek And he really is sorry just for singing it! But that's another thread. Razz

However, if I'm understanding your argument here right, I think I disagree with you insofar as what is wrong with songs such as "I'm In Love With A Stripper" is that our kids sing and revere and emulate and are bombarded with such crap via BET and the radio day in and day out without interruption!

I have no problem agreeing that it is tasteless and definitely lacks anything in the way of positiveness and/or creativity. But, if there is a good reason to "focus" our energy on such, it would be because our 8- and 9-year-olds know songs like these (and worse) better than they know they're math and English!

And just because you stop your kid from watching BET and learning the lyrics, their classroom is filled with about 20 other students who know and can teach it to yours! Eek And that's why I have a problem with such songs and "music" and focus energy on denoting it as the crap that it is.

I'd rather my youngun sing to me "And this is my sorry for 2004" (grabbing the trash can at the thought of hearing it!) than singing that he's "In Love Wit A Stripper" and he's going to "get her over to my crib and do that night thang"!!

That just isn't right. Roll Eyes
John Lee Hooker
One Bourbon, One Scotch, One Beer

One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer
One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer
Hey mister bartender come here
I want another drink and I want it now

My baby she gone, she been gone two night
I ain't seen my baby since night before last
One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer

(spoken: )
And then I sit there
Gettin' high
Mellow
Knocked out
Feeling good
And by the time
I look on the wall
At the old clock on the wall
By that time
It was ten thirty daddy
I looked down the bar
At the bartender
He said
"Now what do you want Johnny?"

One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer
Well my baby she gone, she been gone two night
I ain't seen my baby since night before last
I wanna get drunk till I'm off of my mind
One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer

(spoken: )
And I sat there
Gettin' high
Stoned
Knocked out
And by the time
I looked on the wall
At the old clock again
And by that time
'T was a quarter to two
Last call
For alcohol
I said "Hey mister bartender!"
"Well what do you want?"

One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer
One bourbon, one scotch, and one beer ... (fade)
quote:
Originally posted by EbonyRose:
And just because you stop your kid from watching BET and learning the lyrics, their classroom is filled with about 20 other students who know and can teach it to yours! Eek And that's why I have a problem with such songs and "music" and focus energy on denoting it as the crap that it is.


Isn't it easier to influence the 40 parents of the kids in your child's class than to determine what's playing on BET?
Crawling King Snake Blues
John Lee Hooker

You know I'm a crawlin' kingsnake baby, and I rules my den
You know I'm a crawlin' kingsnake baby, and I rules my den
I don't want you hangin' around my mate, wanna use her for myself

You know you caught me crawlin' baby when the, when the grass was very high
I'm just gonna keep on crawlin' now baby until the day I die,
because I'm a crawlin' kingsnake baby, and I rules my den
Don't you hangin' around my mate, wanna use her for myself

You know I'm gon' crawl up to your window baby,
wanna crawl up to your door, you got anything I want baby,
wanna crawl up on your floor
Because I'm a crawlin' king snake baby, and I rules my den

You know you caught me crawlin' baby when the, when the grass was very high
I'm just gonna keep on crawlin' now baby until the day I die,
because I'm a crawlin' kingsnake baby, and I rules my den
I don't want you hangin' around my mate, wanna use her for myself
I'm Bad Like Jesse James
John Lee Hooker
(John Lee Hooker)
Recorded NYC August 30, 1966
Original release- Bluesway 'Live At The Cafe Au Go-Go' 1966
W/Otis Spann & Muddy Waters
Album: The Best of (1965-74)

Spoken:
A little thing I'm going to do called
'I'm Bad Like Jesse James'

I'm bad
I'm bad
Like Jesse James, uh-huh

I had a friend one time
Least I thought I did
He come to me
Said, 'Johnny?'
Said, 'What man?'
'I'm outdoor'
I say, 'Yeah?'

I taken the cat in
Get him a place to stay
And I found out
He goin' 'round town
Tellin' ev'rybody that he
He got my wife

Then I gets mad
I goes to the cat
Like a good guy should
I said, 'Look man'
'I'm gonna warn you just one time'
Next time I warn you'
'I'm gonna use my gun'

'Cause I'm mad, I'm bad, like Jesse James

I'm so mad, I'm so mad.
I'm gonna ruin you this mornin'.
I've got three boys
Do my dirty work
Now, you don't see me
I'm the big boss
I do the payin' off
After they take care of you

In their own way
They may shoot you
They may cut you.
They may drown you
I just don't know
I don't care
Long as they take care of you
In their own way

I'm so mad, I'm bad this mornin', like Jesse James.

They gon' take you right down
By the riverside
Now four is goin' down
Ain't but three comin' back
You read between the line
We're gonna have a deal

'Cause I'm mad, I'm bad, like Jesse James.

They gonna tie yo' hands
They gonna tie yo' feet
They gonna gag your throat
Where you can't holler none

An cryin' won't help you none
Set you in the water
Yeah, the bubbles comin' up.
Whoa
Rrrrrrr
Rrrrrrr

Oh yeah, I'm so mad
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
Final statement: I just get tired of the constant clamor - even among ourselves - to distinguish 'good' negroes from 'bad' ones, 'positive' from 'negative'.... It's time we begin to consider ourselves as being fully possessed of all the complexities that human beings have. I can be positive and I'm proud of it. I can be negative as hell and I embrace that too. I can be everything inbetween. Art needs to reflect that complexity. Art is NOT about putting the best positive face on the group. It IS about expressing the identity of the group.

We need to deal with all that inner shame that surfaces every time we're confronted with something like "I'm in Love With A Stripper" or "it's Hard Out Here For A Pimp". This is stuff that belongs in a private session with a therapist and not in discussions of art.


appl
HB- you are batting 1.000 tonight! tfro
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
Art needs to reflect that complexity.


I agree! But the question is, do you think music complexity and/or diversity is being fairly represented in Black music today, because there is nothing remotely complex about the lyrical composition of "I'm In Love With The Stripper."

And as far as shame is concerned, anyone who sings these lyrics should be ashamed (or at least mindful that his song may be offensive to some, if not many, people). The fact that T-Pain clearly doesn't give a shit and the producers and radio stations don't give a shit either is what I find so incredibly disturbing. If this song received a seal of approval, I shudder to think what will be heard on the radio 20 years from now.

There is an ignored genre of quality music that in my opinion, truly, represents musical complexity and diversity. Meshell N'Degeocello, revered as "The Mother of Neo-Soul," has led this genre since her first solo album Plantation Lullabies, was released in 1993. Her latest musical compilation, The Spirit Music Jamia: The Dance of the Infidel, which requried the playing of a total of 10 or more musical instruments (e.g., horns, drums, piano, harmonica, guitar, percussion, bass, programming, clay drum, and keyboards), most of which were played by N'Degeocello HERSELF! is never heard on the radio. The general public hardly ever gets the opportunity to hear and savor the extensive work of artists like Meshell, not a single track. Yet as soon as someone complains about the monolithic filth that we ALWAYS hear on the radio, suddenly, the censoring of musical complexity comes into question.
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
I agree! But the question is, do you think music complexity and/or diversity is being fairly represented in Black music today


No... Not on commercial radio....Or on TV... or in the movies for the most part.... I think it's generally lacking in contemporary black oriented arts/entertainment... Don't ask me what I think of Tyler Perry...

quote:

... because there is nothing remotely complex about the lyrical composition of "I'm In Love With The Stripper."


I never said there was... Great we're in agreement!

quote:

Meshell N'Degeocello, revered as "The Mother of Neo-Soul," has led this genre since her first solo album Plantation Lullabies, was released in 1993. Her latest musical compilation, The Spirit Music Jamia: The Dance of the Infidel, which requried the playing of a total of 10 or more musical instruments (e.g., horns, drums, piano, harmonica, guitar, percussion, bass, programming, clay drum, and keyboards), most of which were played by N'Degeocello HERSELF! is never heard on the radio.


Thanks for the recommendation... I'll check it out! kiss

PS: I really did go out and get the CD Smile
Last edited {1}

Add Reply

Post
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×