I will respectfully disagree with portions of your post. To suggest men only view things in the short term is suspect. To further assert that looks rule over all is suspect. Many of us said that core values & personality carry the day. The physical is the initial attractor, but not the permanent attractor. What that means is a less attractive women with personality has to work a little harder to get a guy to stick around to notice those core values. The same applies for men. Is that fair? Maybe not, but it's honest.

A person can have degrees, status, & wealth and still be lousy in relationships. So choosing by those criteria guarantees nothing.

No one said the ladies do not deserve "doctors or Denzel's" (we know it's metaphor & hyperbole, so stop telling us that ladies!) or dream men. They do! We are trying to understand what is ultimately important to ladies in finding a mate. And yes, there are some commonalities that can be brought forth. Once those common core qualities are stated (because they haven't been!), maybe we can have honest, sincere discussion & assessment of the criteria.
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
A person can have degrees, status, & wealth and still be lousy in relationships. So choosing by those criteria guarantees nothing.

No one said the ladies do not deserve "doctors or Denzel's"


I also want to be clear that many of the examples I put out are people with ADVANCED degrees who are making serious contributions to the world but who might make $40,000-$90,000 versus $100,000-$150,000/yr - and some of them ARE Doctors but not MDs. It's just that these people deal in the world of ideas/knowledge and don't have monetary gain or more conventional types of prestige/status as a motivator. I was deliberately trying to gauge the female response to a group of very educated and ambitious professionals who were not high-end wage earners - but who earn a substantially better living than a janitor. I was also trying to bring in other qualities (talent, drive, ambition, creativity, intelligence, etc.) besides obvious wealth/power/ status that might be desireable in a mate.

So far, ONLY Art Gurl has expressed any interest.

This is not very different from Rowe posting pics of African Models and asking us guys what was wrong with us for having such a limited notion of female beauty. It's all well and good when us guys are being upbraided for being severely shortsighted.

The sad thing is that I was inclined to agree with Rowe. But I'm not feeling the same vibe from the other side on this issue. And I find it extremely disturbing that all I'm getting back from Sistas is "I'm not settling for Janitors" and "these aren't cream of the crop" types of answers. Because the residual feeling is that the only value attached to an ideal mate is purely monetary. I.e. Quality=high end paying job? Can it be that the women aren't demanding quality mates or the right to pursue whoever they like so much as the right to be greedy without the accusation of being gold diggers? Wink

I don't know the answer to this question but I repeat: no one but Art Gurl has issued a denial. Every one else has hemmed and hawed, remained silent, or for some mysterious reason expressed outrage that I should even go there. Why? And if that isn't a serious double standard, what is?

And isn't it embarrassing that I threw out a slate of what I would consider some of the finest out there and the sistas take a whiff and say no thanks?
Last edited {1}
Hang in there HB - we are clearly stating our desire for an honest dialogue (if that wasn't clear before) about criteria in choosing a Black man. Yes, we have presented uncomfortable theories & questions. We may get uncomfortable answers & counter-theories, once we actually get some substantive ones. Now the ball is in the ladies' court. Let's see what happens. Maybe a new thread is in order...
quote:
Here's a helpful hint - If you see a thread in the Den started by RadioRaheem and you click it and pictures start to come up, click your Back button and leave the thread!


I don't need to click on every thread to know what to expect.

quote:
The images must make you very uncomfortable, because you've lead the counter campaign.


Considering the media already bombards us with images of Black women as sluts and hoes, yes I do find these images offensive, and I do become uncomfortable looking at them. I imagine it's the same feeling that you may get whenever you turn on the news to see yet another Black man being handcuffed and hauled off to jail. My purpose for visiting African-America.org, and other progressive venues, is to get away from these demonizing images of Black people. Because I chose not to participate in the discussion Eye Candy for Sandye, I created a thread entitled Are Women Being Socially Conditioned To Be Attracted To Emasculate Men , which was created to challenge some women's ideas of masculinity, based on the pictures that I viewed in the Eye Candy for Sandye thread. Perhaps you should review it.

quote:
If the men we described are keepers, why is there a "man shortage"? Because the criteria set is excluding them, that's why.


There are certain occupations that this society values more than others. Janitor, maintenance man, trash man, and mail clerk are not those occupations. Whether the people who fill such positions are "good people" is irrelevant. These are not occupations that this society values. Perhaps it is because these occupations require very little skill, education, and they pay much less than occupations that require specialized skills and years of educational preparation. In London, for example, teachers are highly valued and very well paid, and their professional status is equivalent to that of a physician in the United States. Do I think that is unfair. YES. Can I do anything about it. NO.

Lastly, some aspects of our society have dramatically changed, while others have (and perhaps always will) remain the same. Though women are now capable of working and educating themselves, they are still expected to increase their wealth and status via marriage. Therefore, realistically speaking, what are the odds of a woman who has a Ph.D, and who is perhaps directing a staff at a major hospital, having anything in common with the local janitor? What would they discuss on a daily basis? This is not an issue of whether or not janitors are "good" or "bad" people, but of realistic compatibility.

Plese consider reading the article Women and The African-American Male-Female Relationship Dilemma: A Counseling Perspective by Patricia Davis-Bethea located in AA.org's Relationship Forum in order to get a better understanding of Black women's concerns in this respect.
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
YOU, Art Gurl, ARE THE ONLY ONE AMONG THE WOMEN stepping forth to make these finer distinctions. The only one expressing a positive desire for ANY of the examples I gave.


Brother Honestbrother, please review these comments to see that the women participating in this thread have been supporting your arguments all along. Perhaps you have chosen to read only what you want to read?

quote:
Originally Posted by Rowe
Do you all think this culture's obsession with mega super stars has interferred with everyday people's interest in the opposite sex? Perhaps our standards are not too high, but have been influenced by someone else's standards.


quote:
Originally Posted By Frenchy
And I would take a nice, respectful Plain Joe over a Denzel any day of the week.


quote:
Originally posted by Vox (Taken From the Eye Candy For Sandye Thread):
Rowe, why don't you post some pictures of what YOU see as attractive males. I'm curious what Rowe's "eye candy" looks like.

I appreciate looking at all types of men, from all races and ethnic groups. I recently saw two very distinctive-looking Asian men who I thought were attractive. It all depends. However, I do usually go for what most people describe as the "intellectual" type (e.g., wears distinctive-looking eyewear, dresses conservatively, trench coat, brief case, etc. You know, Malcolm X looking type brothas, I suppose.

Attachments

Images (1)
I've read every thread you've referenced - I like to see what people have to say, even when I disagree with them frequently. I don't write anybody off (which has been my underlying point with this topic, BTW).

quote:
There are certain occupations that this society values more than others. Janitor, maintenance man, trash man, and mail clerk are not those occupations. Whether the people who fill such positions are "good people" is irrelevant. These are not occupations that this society values. Perhaps it is because these occupations require very little skill, education, and they pay much less than occupations that require specialized skills and years of educational preparation. In London, for example, teachers are highly valued and very well paid, and their professional status is equivalent to that of a physician in the United States. Do I think that is unfair. YES. Can I do anything about it. NO.


Yes, you can do something about it. You can stop being a sheep and following the popular sentiment of "society". Roll Eyes You don't know what you have in common with a blue collar worker unless to take the time to find out. You've made some very dangerous assumptions about the intellect of people in these jobs. Degrees do not ensure a high level of intelligence. Some of the dumbest people I know have MBAs, CPAs, and other advanced degrees & designations. I also know some high school graduates that could run circles around most of the posters at AA.org on a number of topics discussed here. But, continue assuming, it's your loss.

BTW, do you know any handymen or janitors? Those positions pay better than you know - maybe you have only seen people employed by your school system (they are likely underpaid). In the private sector, that work is usually outsourced. Many times, those handymen and janitors have a stake in the company.

quote:
Considering the media already bombards us with images of Black women as sluts and hoes, yes I do find these images offensive, and I do become uncomfortable looking at them. I imagine it's the same feeling that you may get whenever you turn on the news to see yet another Black man being handcuffed and hauled off to jail.



I represent me, not the Black race when I make my decisions. If you want to carry the impossible burden of trying to convince others that you're not like "those" Black folk, knock yourself out. Again, you have projected "hoes" & "sluts" on those pictures.

We're still waiting to see some of those criteria & standards for mates explicitly stated!!
I too await that list. Though I'm married, I've always wondered what it was the sisters were looking for. They tend to get rather vague. I remember those long walks to a table of sisters"”while in the "club""”and introducing myself. First question: "What do you do?" I was always dismissed. After a while I stopped, but I still wondered. Have you noticed that even the sisters without collage degrees have "high standards?"

Also, to Honest Bro, Thank you for this:

"Yes qty226 you are right. You are a black woman. You are the mother of civilization. And hence always right. And Pure. Your actions are always good and wise. Black women have the SOLE claim to racial victimhood. Queens without Kings ... We are only black men. We are not Kings. We are slime. Janitors who clean up the slime they love so much. We are N-I-G-G-A-Z: Never-Innocent-Gorillas-Getting-Ass-(in)-Zoos. Never up to any good. Lazy. Poor and incapable of earning 6 figures - which is what it takes to adequately support the black woman and provide the things she deserves. We are stupid. Liars. Having deep criminal tendencies. We have no love for or devotion to our children. Instead we LOVES us some white woman because of our vileness and low self-esteem. Black women deserve much better than us. They deserve the cream of the crop...."

And to qty226, especially, this:

"That is bullshit semantics. There IS a hierarchy. The top is the top. PERIOD. Men put women in a hierarchy as well. Don't come encouraging women to "broaden" jack shit. We already do. We make a whole lot of compromises because of the plethora of men who are not about SHIT who are circulating in the dating pool. We make the MOST compromises when it comes to dating, so men need to go kick rocks somewhere before they start doling out "advice." We would not be in this piss-poor situation if it wasn't for the failings of Black men. Ugh."

You see, I didn't know I was a failure...until my sisters told me...(Thank God my wife didn't think so!)
quote:
Instead we LOVES us some white woman because of our vileness and low self-esteem. Black women deserve much better than us. They deserve the cream of the crop...."

you posted it so I have to comment....not every black man dates a white woman due to the above.
My guy has dated black women, hispanic women and white women.
When he was in college he found a few issues where sistas did not want to date him coz he was black not brown, and he was a studious type. Now, he has a degree and a career, is older, works out, and has lots of life experience and he can date whoever he wants. He does get approached by women from time to time. The first question they ask is what do you do? When he's in a good mood, he just laughs and walks away. Coz he is NOT impressed. Women who ask that as the first question are in effect just asking, "hi, tell me what's in your bank account and what car do you drive, before I even bother talking to you". And that sucks. I don't see that as an AA.org sistas' style, but it does seem to happen an awful lot over there. Frown
.
quote:
Originaly posted by HonestBrother:
Yes qty226 you are right. You are a black woman. You are the mother of civilization. And hence always right. And Pure. Your actions are always good and wise. Black women have the SOLE claim to racial victimhood. Queens without Kings ... We are only black men. We are not Kings. We are slime. Janitors who clean up the slime they love so much. We are N-I-G-G-A-Z: Never-Innocent-Gorillas-Getting-Ass-(in)-Zoos. Never up to any good. Lazy. Poor and incapable of earning 6 figures - which is what it takes to adequately support the black woman and provide the things she deserves. We are stupid. Liars. Having deep criminal tendencies. We have no love for or devotion to our children. Instead we LOVES us some white woman because of our vileness and low self-esteem. Black women deserve much better than us. They deserve the cream of the crop...."


Folks, I want to be ABSOLUTELY CLEAR that the above was intended as a PARODY. A parody of what seems to be an all too common complaint among women. I was in no way claiming to represent the actual views of a real person. But to our ears you ladies do sorta sound like this at times even if you don't use the actual words. Wink

Art Gurl, I realize there are many legitimate reasons to date interracially. The statement above was a spoof. In fact, your guy friend's experience sounds very familiar to me because I've lived it in my own life.

quote:
Originally posted by Thayfen:
You see, I didn't know I was a failure...until my sisters told me...(Thank God my wife didn't think so!)


But the sistas need to reread this statement. It's profound. And an experience had by all too many hard working black men. Again I have a Ph.D., several other degrees (one from an Ivy League school) and I've had sistas treat me like I'm not shit.

Lastly, even when I was a 20 year old janitor, I took philosophy books with me on my lunch break and I loved Mozart and classical music: You don't know what you have in common with someone simply based on their job title, folks.
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
quote:
Originaly posted by HonestBrother:
Yes qty226 you are right. You are a black woman. You are the mother of civilization. And hence always right. And Pure. Your actions are always good and wise. Black women have the SOLE claim to racial victimhood. Queens without Kings ... We are only black men. We are not Kings. We are slime. Janitors who clean up the slime they love so much. We are N-I-G-G-A-Z: Never-Innocent-Gorillas-Getting-Ass-(in)-Zoos. Never up to any good. Lazy. Poor and incapable of earning 6 figures - which is what it takes to adequately support the black woman and provide the things she deserves. We are stupid. Liars. Having deep criminal tendencies. We have no love for or devotion to our children. Instead we LOVES us some white woman because of our vileness and low self-esteem. Black women deserve much better than us. They deserve the cream of the crop...."


Folks, I want to be ABSOLUTELY CLEAR that the above was intended as a PARODY. A parody of what seems to be an all too common complaint among women. I was in no way claiming to represent the actual views of a real person. But to our ears you ladies do sorta sound like this at times even if you don't use the actual words. Wink

Art Gurl, I realize there are many legitimate reasons to date interracially. The statement above was a spoof. In fact, your guy friend's experience sounds very familiar to me because I've lived it in my own life.

quote:
Originally posted by Thayfen:
You see, I didn't know I was a failure...until my sisters told me...(Thank God my wife didn't think so!)


But the sistas need to reread this statement. It's profound. And an experience had by all too many hard working black men. Again I have a Ph.D., several other degrees (one from an Ivy League school) and I've had sistas treat me like I'm not shit.

Lastly, even when I was a 20 year old janitor, I took philosophy books with me on my lunch break and I loved Mozart and classical music: You don't know what you have in common with someone simply based on their job title, folks.


off
HB, just curious, but how did you jump from janitor to doctor? That's a catapultic leap.
quote:
Originally posted by Huey:
off
HB, just curious, but how did you jump from janitor to doctor? That's a catapultic leap.


And this is precisely the point the sistas are missing. Because I'm brilliant, man... You never know what kind of potential you're going to find within your humble janitor laugh
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
quote:
Originally posted by Huey:
off
HB, just curious, but how did you jump from janitor to doctor? That's a catapultic leap.


And this is precisely the point the sistas are missing. Because I'm brilliant, man... You never know what kind of potential you're going to find within your humble janitor laugh


I feel you, HB.....we both have humble beginnings ( I was a nursing assistant while in college) and I am kinda still in it...residency is a long trip. But I'm happy and there is light at the end of the tunnel.
While in college, I was a librarian, technically a book shelver at the University of Georgia. Is that humble enough of a start? hat
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
quote:
Originally posted by Huey:
off
HB, just curious, but how did you jump from janitor to doctor? That's a catapultic leap.


And this is precisely the point the sistas are missing. Because I'm brilliant, man... You never know what kind of potential you're going to find within your humble janitor laugh


Wow, HB. You humility preceeds you. Roll Eyes laugh
quote:

Wow, HB. You humility preceeds you. Roll Eyes laugh


I never claimed to be humble ... All I know is that the only sista who believed in me when I was a janitor was my mom and I had doubts about her sometimes ... If I don't believe in me who will? ... A little arrogance is the only way a brother can survive out here. Know what I mean?
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
I never claimed to be humble ... All I know is that the only sista who believed in me when I was a janitor was my mom and I had doubts about her sometimes ... A little arrogance is the only way a brother can survive out here.


Tell me about it. Actually I would use the word confidence, but then again I've never met any shy arrogant people.

Btw, do you know how much does a landscaper makes? Would they be considered as a "blue collar" worker or "white collar" worker? I'm just curious because there's a movie coming out this weekend called Something New starring Sanaa Latham, I think. It's about a black female professional who falls in love with a white male landscaper.

The movie looks interesting.
quote:
Originally posted by Huey:
Btw, do you know how much does a landscaper makes? Would they be considered as a "blue collar" worker or "white collar" worker? I'm just curious because there's a movie coming out this weekend called Something New starring Sanaa Latham, I think. It's about a black female professional who falls in love with a white male landscaper.


Blue Collar vs. White Collar can be very misleading when it comes to salaries. Some so-called blue collar jobs can earn more than some white collar jobs. For example, a construction worker - especially a skilled one - can earn more than some desk jobs.

I think the distinction is more about the nature of the work. Blue collar is manual labor. It's physical. So I'd call a landscaper blue collar definitely.

But everyone knows that a white landscaper is worth more than a brother who works in a white skyscraper. Wink
Whoa gentleman! You're getting off

Don't provide any excuses for lack of responses now that the question has been clearly set:

We're still waiting to see some of those criteria & standards for mates explicitly stated!!
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
Whoa gentleman! You're getting off

Don't provide any excuses for lack of responses now that the question has been clearly set:

We're still waiting to see some of those criteria & standards for mates explicitly stated!!


ddouble, I've given up expecting a response.
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
the only sista who believed in me when I was a janitor was my mom and I had doubts about her sometimes ...

lol I know that's not funny, but it is. Wink

The last few responses reminded me of two extremely cool work friends from way back, Jenny & Malclom.
I used to work with Jenny and one day she introduced me to one of the Reps/Suppliers called Malcolm. Nice guy, he had his own partnership in a retail office supply store. He also had a great sense of humour and was very left wing. Malcolm was 40+ when I met him. Both had had divorces and each had a teenage child. Malcolm hated elitism of any kind, so every tme anyone asked what he 'did' for a living he'd deliberately say he was a delivery boy delivering office supplies. Big Grin He would love to see the reactions from people, which ranged from "oh sure", to "at your age?" [speech bubble: what a loser] etc. etc. lol Jenny and Malcolm got married about 2 years after they met and as far as I know are still happily together.
quote:
Originally posted by Huey:
While in college, I was a librarian, technically a book shelver at the University of Georgia. Is that humble enough of a start? hat


Huey, you were at UGA? So was I....
quote:
To further assert that looks rule over all is suspect.


Suspect? Ok. You'll have to forgive me if I'm a little confused...I guess going into the Den to "view" the "images" of "beautiful" women....and very few if any post about OTHER qualities of women would cause that confusion.

Big Grin
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
You've made some very dangerous assumptions about the intellect of people in these jobs. Degrees do not ensure a high level of intelligence. Some of the dumbest people I know have MBAs, CPAs, and other advanced degrees & designations.


I've made no assumptions about anyone's intelligence. I've given you possible explanations as for why some occupations are less valued than others. And though you and I may have encountered people from all walks of life who we thought were "dumb," our society still rewards people for continuing their education. Why else have many of AA.org's members (myself included) pursued advanced degrees? And before you give me the speech about how "college isn't for everyone," the fact still remains that the more education and specialized skills that one has, the more opportunities that one has at her or his disposal.

quote:
We're still waiting to see some of those criteria & standards for mates explicitly stated!!


Many veteran AA.org members are already familar with my family values and criteria for marriage. They know that I'm old school. I believe that only men should work and woman should stay home and manage the family and household. Both the man and woman should never work simutaneously, especially if there are young children involved (review my family and children discussions for reasons why).

Presently, in the Black community, however, the roles have completely reversed. And ultimately, this is the real reason why our relationships and communities are suffering. Black women are running Black communities. Black women are paying the bills, paying for mortgages, car notes, and day care expenses practically on their own, while the men sit around complain about "why can't you just give a brotha some slack?" No one seems to want to discuss this matter though. We'd rather be distracted from this issue by having trivial ongoing squabbles that have anything to do with the status of our communities. Brother Honestbrother posted a topic awhile ago encouraging people to discuss what we should do to rebuild our communities. Only one person responded to thread, but the problems aren't going anywhere. Women making poor mate choices does not take away from the fact that a disproportionate number of Black men are not pursuing higher education (compared to Black women), are crowding jails, and are not fully benefitting from what society has to offer. Period. Therefore, it doesn't matter what our criteria is, none of these can be met until we deal with these issues.

But for those who must know, here are my personal criteria:

Finances/Education

  • Advanced degree and/or earns enough to independently support a family, including sending children to private schools and financing college tuitions.

  • Has a very strong appreciation for education.

  • Has good credit, manages money well, pays bills ON TIME.

  • Is well read, not illiterate.

    Personal Development

  • Has strong convictions about the state of the Black community. Takes full responsibility for it, doesn't shift blame onto the women or punkishly uses women as scapegoats for what is happeining in his community.

  • Holds very traditional values.

  • Believes men should take responsibility for their communities, men should have leadership roles in the community.

  • Is compassionate, has a strong take-charge character, is loving, caring, has integrity, and is dedicated and committed to a cause.

    Health/Spirituality

  • Very health conscious. Eats very little meat product or dairy.

  • Believes prevention is the best medicine.

  • Has a very natural and organic way of living (spiritually conscious).

  • Prefers foods that are as close to their natural state as possible.
  • Last edited {1}
    • "The point is NOT that "janitors aint shit" or however else things were apparently interpreted." (-Frenchy, 1/19/06, 6:10 PM, Page 2)

    • "And I would take a nice, respectful Plain Joe over a Denzel any day of the week. But that's not the issue." (-Frenchy, 1/19/06, 7:32 PM, Page 2)

    • "I am not talking about the merits of a blue collar man. There's nothing wrong with a janitor or whatever else. I've expressed that several times now." (-Frenchy, 1/20/06, 5:43 PM, Page 2)

    • "This is NOT about specifically dating Denzels and Halles. This is NOT about lowering dating expectations. It's not about speicifcally dating anyone at all really. It is an observation of WHAT IS." (-Frenchy, 1/21/06, 6:55 AM, Page 3)

    • "I think we all know that the "perfect" partner doesn't exist." (-Frenchy, 1/21/06, 2:36 PM, Page 3)

    • "And I NEVER said there was only the cream of the crop and everyone else was shit. In fact, I went out of my way to repeatedly point that out even though it was irrelevant to my point." (-Frenchy, 1/22/06, 4:04 PM, Page 3)

    • "I don't give a shit what makes a particular woman the "cream of the crop" to a man. I'm only saying that there is such a thing as the "cream of the crop" and that is what I am referring to when I talk about each gender being allowed to pursue "the best" freely without being admonished to settle for something less." (-Frenchy, 1/23/06, 12:12 AM, Page 4)

    • "This is NOT the point, AG. No one is encouraging women to date only a Denzel. No one is saying Denzels are the only quality men. No one is saying that we want the right to hold out for a Denzel. WOMEN SHOULD HAVE THE OPTION OF STRIVING FOR A "DENZEL" WITHOUT HEARING A BUNCH OF FRIGGIN LIP ABOUT HOW WE NEED TO REFOCUS/REVISE/RETHINK BECAUSE WE DON'T DESERVE IT OR BECAUSE WE'RE NOT GIVING THE "LOWER-RUNG" OF BROTHAS A CHANCE OR WHATEVER OTHER REASON." (-Frenchy, 1/23/06, 5:41 PM, Page 4)


    quote:
    We're still waiting to see some of those criteria & standards for mates explicitly stated!!

    Then you need to open up a new thread, D. Because that has never been what THIS thread was about. What you hope to gain from that, I don't know, because it will be a repeat of this thread. Women will answer the question about the ideal and men will shoot it down, like this:

    quote:
    But my point is not that women need to "lower" their vision. They need to broaden/expand their vision.

    Denzel/Doctor/Lawyer is tunnel vision.


    quote:
    I'm glad my mom wasn't such an elitest. Otherwise, I might not be here! Maybe I'm an exception, but my non-Denzel, non high-status dad did a HELL of a job as a father (and my Mom's pretty happy too!).


    quote:
    Women who think they're "lowering" standards by dating people on the list above DESERVE to be single


    quote:
    This is why guys like me wind up with white women.


    Etc.

    And this is when we are not even articulating what it is exactly we are looking for/hoping for. The mere suggestion of wanting the best possible mate brings out this filthy crap. Just like I said all the way back on Page 2. I would certainly not participate in any discussion where I actually detailed what I'm looking for in a mate, just so people could glide right over what I actually say and launch into their histrionics. Perhaps the other ladies want to go down that road.

    With love,
    French hat
    quote:
    Originally posted by Rowe:
    For those who are interested, here are my personal criteria...
    Why didn't you just say you wanted me??!! lol
    quote:
    Originally posted by Frenchy:
    [And this is when we are not even articulating what it is exactly we are looking for/hoping for. The mere suggestion of wanting the best possible mate brings out this filthy crap. Just like I said all the way back on Page 2. I would certainly not participate in any discussion where I actually detailed what I'm looking for in a mate, just so people could glide right over what I actually say and launch into their histrionics. Perhaps the other ladies want to go down that road.

    With love,
    French hat


    You can have whatever standards you want and at this point I've lost interest in the discussion. But I deny that the statements you point out, taken within the original context, constituted "filthy crap". But whatever.... I'm done.
    quote:
    And this is when we are not even articulating what it is exactly we are looking for/hoping for. The mere suggestion of wanting the best possible mate brings out this filthy crap. Just like I said all the way back on Page 2. I would certainly not participate in any discussion where I actually detailed what I'm looking for in a mate, just so people could glide right over what I actually say and launch into their histrionics. Perhaps the other ladies want to go down that road.


    First, thanks for the love. kiss Nothing wrong with a spirited discussion! I think any set of criteria can be subject to analysis. Getting to the base reasons for preferences can be very enlightening. I'm curious about the women's preferences here & what drives those preferences. I do recognize that challenging a person's values & beliefs is the quickest way to create tension, but it's also a good way to garner understanding.

    This discussion can be whatever the participants choose to make it.

    Sincerely with heart
    quote:
    Originally posted by AudioGuy:
    quote:
    Originally posted by Rowe:
    For those who are interested, here are my personal criteria...
    Why didn't you just say you wanted me??!! lol


    I would have, if you didn't think wearing dress up clothes was gay. Smile
    quote:
    Originally posted by folobatuyi:
    quote:
    Originally posted by Rowe:
    I would have, if you didn't think wearing dress up clothes was gay. Smile


    Oh boy, Rowe is flirting!


    What's the matter! Didn't I give you some lovin a few days ago? Huh? I should have warned you that I'm too much woman to be satisfied with just one man. Big Grin
    Hello, Max here! I just wanted to make sure I understand what Frechy is saying:

    When black men lust after Halle Berry-types, they are not reprimanded, because it is expected/accepted-practice for black men to aspire to have a woman like Halle without any REAL justification.

    But...

    When black women lust after Denzel-types (even when the black women who ARE justified in wanting someone like him), they're harshly criticized as being materialistic, shallow and hated-on for overlooking that funky-ass chimney-sweeper with the "heart of gold".

    If this is the double standard that Frenchy is talkin about..then that's kinda fucked up.

    Oh yeah, Pam from Martin is HOT. I always wanted to give her a ride on my long, slippery tongue. Razz
    quote:
    Originally posted by HonestBrother:
    quote:
    Originally posted by Huey:
    While in college, I was a librarian, technically a book shelver at the University of Georgia. Is that humble enough of a start? hat


    Huey, you were at UGA? So was I....


    When did you graduate? I finished at Fall (Dec.) 1993.
    In regards to Black men in America, I love and support Black men 100% and I always have. I am a bi-racial woman (mother is black father is white) and I have always been attracted to Black men only, now in the past year I did go out on dates with White men and they are okay but, I just prefer the Black man no other race of men can compare. No, I don't want a black thug but, I wouldn't want a white thug either. Black folks love to keep stereo type stuff going. Sisters have alway been very critical of things I as a lightskin, slim, long hair (did I mention "Good hair") Smile have experienced the negotive comments all my life and I have to be the most down to earth person anyone has ever met. My thing is ladies just look at it this way when you see a brother with a White woman; just think he was looking for you but he couldn't find ya so he settled. Brothers stop lumping all of the sisters together we aren't all loud, controlling, bossy and have attitudes. The only time I have a problem with a Black man dating a White woman is when I know that he only dates White women because he thinks they are better. We as Black woman truly need to start dating out of our race more and stop focusing on what the Black man is doing, they will always come back home ladies we are Queens. There are tons of White men out there who would love to date Black women but, we are so busy starring Brothers with White women down we miss them. I moved from NY a year ago where there were tons of wonderful Black men to date to Phoenix, Arizona where there are 5 Black men and 4 are gay and met and married my handsome, a great man,sexy intelligent, well rounded, caring, great cook did I say HOT husband and yes he is Black. We married after only 6 months and we are the best thing to ever happen to eachother. Another words all is not lost if you want a good Black man they are out there but check yourself first be honest with you and love you. The same with Brothers know what the hell you want and go for it, if you want to date White woman go the hell on but don't turn your back on all sisters just because you dated a few bad apples.
    I think after my experiences i would be very careful of dating anyone. In my experience, for a black man, being a loving man that has a good heart does not really matter.

    I've even had this told to me directly and with actions. That to me speaks volumes. I have never dated a white woman and don't find them attractive ( as they would have to look like a sista ) however i will keep my options open for a foreign sista.

    BTW, i read this thread and I like all shades of sistas but i've always gravitatied to more of the dark chocolate variety.

    HonestBrotha, have you even got to know a sista from other countries? Like France or Brazil or Trinidad? The problem is this culture.
    quote:
    Originally posted by LovNThySoul:
    I think after my experiences i would be very careful of dating anyone. In my experience, for a black man, being a loving man that has a good heart does not really matter.

    I've even had this told to me directly and with actions. That to me speaks volumes. I have never dated a white woman and don't find them attractive ( as they would have to look like a sista ) however i will keep my options open for a foreign sista.

    BTW, i read this thread and I like all shades of sistas but i've always gravitatied to more of the dark chocolate variety.

    HonestBrotha, have you even got to know a sista from other countries? Like France or Brazil or Trinidad? The problem is this culture.


    i like how you like the dark chocolate Wink

    Add Reply

    Post
    ×
    ×
    ×
    ×
    Link copied to your clipboard.
    ×