Peace....



Elijah Muhammad taught that a group of Black skinned, straight haired people living in the Arabian Peninsula migrated to the Greek Isles and through a process of birth control and sexual selection produced a race of Albinos. He began teaching this idea in the 1930's.

According to Mr. Muhammad, the Genetic and phenotypical transition took 600 years to complete. According to Mr. Muhammad's writings, the Original stock was inherently genetically polymophic, thus by the process of sexual selection white people were not physically "created" they were instead extracted.


Mr. Muhammad taught that Black North Africans, and Asians, were physically distinct from the Sub-Saharan African due to climatic conditions and other environmental factors. He was specific in assigning the selective process which led to the appearance of the caucasian to Northern Blacks..Not to the Sub-Saharan African.

Mr. Muhammad describes someone similiar (but darker) to the man in the middle of this photo:





The term "Caucasian" seems to have originated with Freidrich Blumenbach, a 19th century Anthropologist who determined race based on certain physiological traits. Blumenbach gathered and compiled various anthropometric measurements of different groups, and then made racial classifications based on simularities in size of things such as the cranium of a specific group.

Caucasians were linked to the ancient Dravidians, black people of the ancient Indus Valley which is also within the Aryan region.

If you watch the video below, you will notice how strikingly similiar white people are to East Indian Albinos..See for yourself..

Was Mr. Muhammad right?


Video for visula effect



Whirling Moat

"Your Comfort zone is your enemies hunting ground" -Unknown

 

Original Post
Originally posted Whiriling Moat
quote:
Caucasians were linked to the ancient Dravidians, black people of the ancient Indus Valley which is also within the Aryan region.

If you watch the video below, you will notice how strikingly similiar white people are to East Indian Albinos..See for yourself..

Was Mr. Muhammad right?



fro I heard this theory before. The word causian.....caucus[mountain] asian[asia]. Also it has bee notated that those from India migrated from Africa after the division of the Panagea or a little before[I forget which]. This is why Indian people are so dark and practice the caste system. Their goal is to be as light as the gods they worship. Many will disagree however....but! If you look at the dynamics of the Indian people....if you look at the original budhha[sp]...his coiled hair: African. But those are FIGHTING words.....Indians just like Arabs [semites] do not want to under any circumstances be associated with any thing BLACK i.e. African/slave....even though their skin color indicate otherwise. Is Muhammad right? All one has to do is look at the dark Indian's skin color....and draw to your own conclusionfro
quote:
Originally posted by urbansun:
I think genetic self selection could occur. But wouldn't there be historical records to document it? Or how long are we talking about it took to get from dark straight haired to white?
A better question is where did dark strait haired people come from that they are farther away from Africa than light skinned curly haired people.

Or an even better question where did Chinese people come from?

Even better what different does it make?
quote:
Originally posted by Wiz:
...

Even better what different does it make?

daz
The difference it makes, my brotha, is that if you overstand the true origins of the devil, you overstand his true wicked nature. This, in turn, prepares you, the original supreme Asiatic black man, for 1) dealing with the wicked ways of this grafted menace to the black man and 2) for the part you would play in helping to eradicate the devil from our midst. Only true knowledge empowers the cypher -- Arm, Leg, Leg, Arm, Head -- the 360 degree circle of completion, which, as you know, consists of the original man you are -- with the power to reclaim your position over the grafted, forked-tongue devil. Peace my brother.
Peace...

quote:
I heard this theory before. The word causian.....caucus[mountain] asian[asia]. Also it has bee notated that those from India migrated from Africa after the division of the Panagea or a little before[I forget which]. This is why Indian people are so dark and practice the caste system. Their goal is to be as light as the gods they worship. Many will disagree however....but! If you look at the dynamics of the Indian people....if you look at the original budhha[sp]...his coiled hair: African. But those are FIGHTING words.....Indians just like Arabs [semites] do not want to under any circumstances be associated with any thing BLACK i.e. African/slave....even though their skin color indicate otherwise. Is Muhammad right? All one has to do is look at the dark Indian's skin color....and draw to your own conclusion


The invading Aryan hordes of 2,000 B.C.instilled this self hatred into the Dravidian people of the ancient indian world.
The invaders robbed the Dravidian of his heritage and claimed it as their own, and then injected the caset system into the land based on colorism. This history is very interesting in light of Mr. Muhammad's teaching as it relates to the origin of racism.

quote:
Even better what different does it make?




Awwww shucks..Maybe I should peppered my post with "Obama" and then he would have found it relevant to black people...


quote:
The difference it makes, my brotha, is that if you overstand the true origins of the devil, you overstand his true wicked nature. This, in turn, prepares you, the original supreme Asiatic black man, for 1) dealing with the wicked ways of this grafted menace to the black man and 2) for the part you would play in helping to eradicate the devil from our midst. Only true knowledge empowers the cypher -- Arm, Leg, Leg, Arm, Head -- the 360 degree circle of completion, which, as you know, consists of the original man you are -- with the power to reclaim your position over the grafted, forked-tongue devil. Peace my brother.



Pretty good, but you gave yourself away in a few areas..The Bryant Gumbleness crept through in a few spots..


maybe you try rolling your r's or something..I don't know...


Whirling Moat
Originally posted by Whirling Moat
quote:
The invading Aryan hordes of 2,000 B.C.binstilled this self hatred into the Dravidian people of the ancient indian world.
The invaders robbed the Dravidian of his heritage and claimed it as their own, and then injected the caset system into the land based on colorism. This history is very interesting in light of Mr. Muhammad's teaching as it relates to the origin of racism.



fro When it comes down to it...it's all matter of whom invaded whom. Which is typical behavior for those seeking to dominate. It had to be skin color....otherwise what would be the distinction? So. They thought about it for awhile....cuz those aryans....well they're NOT the smartest....as a matter of fact, historically it was not the matter of being SMART as much as it was to be most BARBARIC and violent. Usually folks who can grow their own food, have a roof over their heads and generally are intune to the universe and have a respect for process of life....they don't have a NEED to be vicious or brutal or ruthless. On the other hand, those who have to really LOOK for food and SHELTER cuz it ALWAYS cold do not have the natural cognitive ability to think and reason....these folks use the most conduct to overcome those who are reasonable....as is the history of European MAN.

In addition, I have found individuals from Europe especially are the ones to traditionally conduct this type of behavior....and is why I am not SURPRISED at the findings...but! This is old news. For the behavior of the European has yet to change in modern day..it still exist. It just has a dual name called racism/self hate. fro
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Peace...

[ racism.

quote:
Even better what different does it make?




Awwww shucks..Maybe I should peppered my post with "Obama" and then he would have found it relevant to black people...


Whirling Moat

It would have made more sense if you peppered it with pepper.
quote:
Originally posted by Vox:
quote:
Originally posted by Wiz:
...

Even better what different does it make?

daz
The difference it makes, my brotha, is that if you overstand the true origins of the devil, you overstand his true wicked nature. This, in turn, prepares you, the original supreme Asiatic black man, for 1) dealing with the wicked ways of this grafted menace to the black man and 2) for the part you would play in helping to eradicate the devil from our midst. Only true knowledge empowers the cypher -- Arm, Leg, Leg, Arm, Head -- the 360 degree circle of completion, which, as you know, consists of the original man you are -- with the power to reclaim your position over the grafted, forked-tongue devil. Peace my brother.

laugh 20
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Peace...


Pretty good, but you gave yourself away in a few areas..The Bryant Gumbleness crept through in a few spots..
I thought it was pretty funny, actually... But "Bryant Gumbelness" was funny too, I'll give u that...
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Peace...

quote:
I heard this theory before. The word causian.....caucus[mountain] asian[asia]. Also it has bee notated that those from India migrated from Africa after the division of the Panagea or a little before[I forget which]. This is why Indian people are so dark and practice the caste system. Their goal is to be as light as the gods they worship. Many will disagree however....but! If you look at the dynamics of the Indian people....if you look at the original budhha[sp]...his coiled hair: African. But those are FIGHTING words.....Indians just like Arabs [semites] do not want to under any circumstances be associated with any thing BLACK i.e. African/slave....even though their skin color indicate otherwise. Is Muhammad right? All one has to do is look at the dark Indian's skin color....and draw to your own conclusion


The invading Aryan hordes of 2,000 B.C.instilled this self hatred into the Dravidian people of the ancient indian world.
The invaders robbed the Dravidian of his heritage and claimed it as their own, and then injected the caset system into the land based on colorism. This history is very interesting in light of Mr. Muhammad's teaching as it relates to the origin of racism.


Ok, I'm confused... Were the invading Aryan hordes(a history I am familiar with) supposed to be basically the 'returning' albinized Dravidians?

The Indians (used in the video are phenotypically a mixture of Dravidian and those exact invading Aryans... The Aryans, like many of their progeny, the Northern Indiam castes in the video (Brahmans, Kshatriyas, & Vaishyas), have a 'European' look, to varying degrees(hence their higher caste)...

Aren't you using the mixed offspring to prove the theory that their parents originated 'from them'? That doesn't make sense... The unmixed 'tribal' Dravidians of the South(Check Runoko Rashidi's sight for examples) do not have the European phenotype and look much like the Australian aboriginal... Sub-Saharan African with straighter hair... That look Albinized looks nothing like a European... Neither do the Dalits... not even the Shudras..

So how could the Aryans be the albinized offspring of the 'origial' folk of the Indus valley? Of course those people that are alread of mixed Aryan blood if Albinized are gona look like their fathers... Confused
Peace....



quote:
Ok, I'm confused... Were the invading Aryan hordes(a history I am familiar with) supposed to be basically the 'returning' albinized Dravidians?


Not necessarily. Elijah Muhammad claims that there was a mass exodus from Arabia, not Harrapa or Mohenjo Daro. I provided the photo of the Indian man simply to provide the reader with a visual aid which approximates what he meant when he spoke of a black person from the North of Africa, or Asia during that time period. Now, I will say that there was a cultural unity of sorts between the ancient kingdoms occupied by the Dravidian and the various kingdoms of North Africa, including KMT. I do believe that phenotypically, the people of this entire region would have appeared very similiar to one another..Of course their would be some variations, but nothing material.

quote:
The Indians (used in the video are phenotypically a mixture of Dravidian and those exact invading Aryans... The Aryans, like many of their progeny, the Northern Indiam castes in the video (Brahmans, Kshatriyas, & Vaishyas), have a 'European' look, to varying degrees(hence their higher caste)...


The Dalits, or "Untouchables" are not genectically distinct from those of higher caste..they are just darker..The groups within the caste system was called "varna" which translates to mean "color". The stratification was designed to separate the dark black from the lighter and so forth....

quote:
Aren't you using the mixed offspring to prove the theory that their parents originated 'from them'? That doesn't make sense... The unmixed 'tribal' Dravidians of the South(Check Runoko Rashidi's sight for examples) do not have the European phenotype and look much like the Australian aboriginal... Sub-Saharan African with straighter hair... That look Albinized looks nothing like a European... Neither do the Dalits... not even the Shudras..


Well, once again, several studies were conducted to provide scientific justification for the caste arrangement. What was determined was that was no significant variant besides color of the northern higher caste Brahmans, Kshatriyas, & Vaishyas from lower caste Dalit- Shudras. Now of course the introduction of the Aryan strain did provide some genetic diversity, however, according to what I have studied the Aryan injection provided for a significant change in color yet did not structurally change the other dominant features of the Dravidian in any significant way.

Runoko Rashidi and Professor Cheikh Anta Diop spoke to this:

The term "Dravidian," however, encompasses both an ethnic group and a linguistic group. The ethnic group is characterized by straight to wavy hair textures, combined with Africoid physical features. -Runoko Rashidi


"There are two well-defined Black races: one has a black skin and woolly hair; the other also has black skin, often exceptionally black, with straight hair, aquiline nose, thin lips, an acute cheekbone angle. We find a prototype of this race in India: the Dravidian. It is also known that certain Nubians likewise belong to the same Negro type...."-Professor Diop

I think it is well established by our own scholars that the straight hair, aqualine nose, and thin lip features of our people is just as ancient and "black", as broad noses, lips and woolly hair.

Those who argue against the afrocentric worldview have discovered this aspect of our past and have tried to hijack our history arguing that Northern Kingdoms and asiatic blacks were more caucasian than black due to structural similiarities with whites..In making this argument they simply confirm Mr. Muhammad's teaching..


Wiz wrote:
quote:
It would have made more sense if you peppered it with pepper.




You know what Bruh...don't even stress yourself about it..Maybe one of the other posters will tuck you in...shhh..I'll hit the lights..



Whirling Moat
These people have thin lips, aquiline noses and are just 'darker' than the other Indian castes?

I know about 'varna'... but I also think there are many other aspects... These people look like the Africanoid facial features present in many ancient Indian and other East Asian artifacts... They are not the North/African & Dalit Aquiline looking folk that also exist...





Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
quote:
Elijah Muhammad claims that there was a mass exodus from Arabia, not Harrapa or Mohenjo Daro.



fro Question! Do you have other references besides the Honorable Elijah Muhammad? Or...are your full acceptance on this analogy is based totally on his theory ONLY?fro
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Elijah Muhammad taught that a group of Black skinned, straight haired people living in the Arabian Peninsula migrated to the Greek Isles and through a process of birth control and sexual selection produced a race of Albinos. He began teaching this idea in the 1930's.

...


Mr. Muhammad taught that Black North Africans, and Asians, were physically distinct from the Sub-Saharan African due to climatic conditions and other environmental factors. He was specific in assigning the selective process which led to the appearance of the caucasian to Northern Blacks..Not to the Sub-Saharan African.
I thought that this belief system has it that African-Americans are descended from the original man. But you're saying that Elijah Muhammad said the "Asiatic" North African black man was distinct from the Sub-Saharan. We are descended from Sub-Saharan Africans. What, then, is our relationship with this "Asiatic" black man?
quote:
Originally posted by Vox:
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Elijah Muhammad taught that a group of Black skinned, straight haired people living in the Arabian Peninsula migrated to the Greek Isles and through a process of birth control and sexual selection produced a race of Albinos. He began teaching this idea in the 1930's.

...


Mr. Muhammad taught that Black North Africans, and Asians, were physically distinct from the Sub-Saharan African due to climatic conditions and other environmental factors. He was specific in assigning the selective process which led to the appearance of the caucasian to Northern Blacks..Not to the Sub-Saharan African.
I thought that this belief system has it that African-Americans are descended from the original man. But you're saying that Elijah Muhammad said the "Asiatic" North African black man was distinct from the Sub-Saharan. We are descended from Sub-Saharan Africans. What, then, is our relationship with this "Asiatic" black man?


19 munch I smell a similar convo brewing that I had with a Moorish brother a while back, but I'm sure this one will have a different 'twist'...
Peace...


quote:
These people have thin lips, aquiline noses and are just 'darker' than the other Indian castes?

I know about 'varna'... but I also think there are many other aspects... These people look like the Africanoid facial features present in many ancient Indian and other East Asian artifacts... They are not the North/African & Dalit Aquiline looking folk that also exist...


Sister, ethnoarcheological studies have confirmed that more than one ethnic group settled in the urban areas of the early Harrapan civilization. Several physical types were present.

The Proto-Austroloid, the Twa, and other varieties of “Negroid” people, which includes blacks with thinner lips, and straight hair. They were all part of one Kingdom and are collectively referred to as Dravidian. This same multi-ethnic composition can be found in all of the great cities of the ancient world.

The Ancient world was multi-cultural. History provides that our people had open borders. We found no greater pleasure than inviting foreigners in to enjoy the bounty of our world.

Of course we eventually let the wrong people in…

quote:
Question! Do you have other references besides the Honorable Elijah Muhammad? Or...are your full acceptance on this analogy is based totally on his theory ONLY


The basis of this topic comes from the assertions of The Honorable Elijah Muhammad, however, the evidence and information I have provided all comes from outside sources. Several scholars have undertaken the task of resolving the origin of the European. If you would like I could direct you to a few good books relating to this subject.



quote:
I thought that this belief system has it that African-Americans are descended from the original man. But you're saying that Elijah Muhammad said the "Asiatic" North African black man was distinct from the Sub-Saharan. We are descended from Sub-Saharan Africans. What, then, is our relationship with this "Asiatic" black man?


According to NOI doctrine, we are all descended from the original Asiatic man. “Asia” is the name of the planet. “Asiatic” refers to the human population.

The Honorable Elijah Muhammad taught that a group of Asiatics ventured away from the North, into the hostile environments of the South below the Sahara. The purpose of this departure was experimental. There were those who believed that by subjecting themselves to a harsher environment they would become more physically powerful, and also become spiritually more awakened and refined. According to Elijah Muhammad, the people were called “Shabazz”. He taught that the members of this tribe were successful in mastering what he called a “Jungle life”. They became stronger, faster, and more durable. In the process they experienced a morphology which resulted in the Nubian phenotype. In the process however, they lost some of their cultural refinement, moved away from their original sciences and language. This made them susceptible to what was to come later.



Wiz wrote:
quote:
it stems from an acquired inferiority conplex.






Shhhhh....









Awwww....



Whirling Moat
You do feel inferior to white people. Anytime you have to look for (make up) some historical shit to show how black people are better than white people, which is what all the jakub shit alludes to, it come from the fact that you initially feel inferior to them. If you did not, you would not give a fuck where they come from and you certainly would not feel the need to mythologize it or the pretense of black superiority. If black people are superior, there would be no need to mention it, you would simply be it. No need to substantiate it, just be it.

But you can't because begin feeling inferior. You need to deal with that first. I do not feel inferior to white people and could not give less of a shit where they come from.

So get your ass out on that corner selling Muhammad Pimps Newspapers.

...bean pie my brutha?
Originally posted by Whirling Moat
quote:
The basis of this topic comes from the assertions of The Honorable Elijah Muhammad, however, the evidence and information I have provided all comes from outside sources. Several scholars have undertaken the task of resolving the origin of the European. If you would like I could direct you to a few good books relating to this subject.



fro Yes, I would to know which books indicated this. As a former member of the Nation of Islam....I am very well aware of the teachings of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad. However, through my own tireless studies/research I have found several flaws and misinterpretations from anthropologists and scientists who have convey these findings. I have discovered "Asiatic" simply means African and Asian i.e. the invasion[as I say over and over] of the Hyksos from Asia Minor[aka Turkey]. The other connection to this term "Asiatic" is a result of migration from Africa to India to Asia thousands of years before. So. I confused...but! I look forward to reading those books to clear things up.thanks fro
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
...I do believe that phenotypically, the people of this entire region would have appeared very similiar to one another..Of course their would be some variations, but nothing material...

...Sister, ethnoarcheological studies have confirmed that more than one ethnic group settled in the urban areas of the early Harrapan civilization. Several physical types were present.

The Proto-Austroloid, the Twa, and other varieties of “Negroid” people, which includes blacks with thinner lips, and straight hair. They were all part of one Kingdom and are collectively referred to as Dravidian. This same multi-ethnic composition can be found in all of the great cities of the ancient world....


Which is it?

quote:
Asiatics ventured away from the North, into the hostile environments of the South below the Sahara. The purpose of this departure was experimental. There were those who believed that by subjecting themselves to a harsher environment they would become more physically powerful, and also become spiritually more awakened and refined. According to Elijah Muhammad, the people were called “Shabazz”. He taught that the members of this tribe were successful in mastering what he called a “Jungle life”. They became stronger, faster, and more durable. In the process they experienced a morphology which resulted in the Nubian phenotype. In the process however, they lost some of their cultural refinement, moved away from their original sciences and language.


I remember learning this when I dealt with the NOI for a very brief period of time... It made me squirm then, but causes violent disgust and a lingering sadness now... sck
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:

According to NOI doctrine, we are all descended from the original Asiatic man. “Asia” is the name of the planet. “Asiatic” refers to the human population.

The Honorable Elijah Muhammad taught that a group of Asiatics ventured away from the North, into the hostile environments of the South below the Sahara. The purpose of this departure was experimental. There were those who believed that by subjecting themselves to a harsher environment they would become more physically powerful, and also become spiritually more awakened and refined. According to Elijah Muhammad, the people were called “Shabazz”. He taught that the members of this tribe were successful in mastering what he called a “Jungle life”. They became stronger, faster, and more durable. In the process they experienced a morphology which resulted in the Nubian phenotype. In the process however, they lost some of their cultural refinement, moved away from their original sciences and language. This made them susceptible to what was to come later.
I see.
Peace.....



quote:
You do feel inferior to white people. Anytime you have to look for (make up) some historical shit to show how black people are better than white people, which is what all the jakub shit alludes to, it come from the fact that you initially feel inferior to them



This is very interesting....I provide science and history and you combat it with outrage...Wiz, whatever my motive, or Elijah Muhammad's motive may have been, is only relevant once you or anyone else can prove that what he has presented is fabricated or false.

You may not like what he taught, but the most important question is whether or not what he taught is true.

History stands with him, Archeology stands with him, Genetics stands with him, Anthropology stands with him, and reason stands with him...There is no sound reason to reject his explanation for the genesis of the caucasian because in truth there is absolutely no plausible scientific explanation for the appearance of an entire group of albinos except the one The Honorable Elijah Muhammad offers..none..What is the accepted theory?? What do those in the field say?

They argue that at some point a group of black people wandered away from the abundant and rich environments of the east into an area which was experiencing a dramatic climate change..An emerging Ice Age...This group of hunter gatherers settled in this hostile region, and were subsequently trapped by some unknown geographic barrier which prevented them from leaving and returning to the rich environment..During this period of time the environment grew harsher, and it became genetically more advantageous for lighter skinned people since light skin allows for greater vitamin d absorption...Since the environment lacked natural sources of vitamin D, greater absorption of sunlight became necessary..

This is the academic model in a nutshell...The above idea is severely flawed..Severely....

I won't go into yet...Because I have a feeling that even if everything I am saying is true it still wouldn't matter to you..

The origin of a group and the selective traits which they possess are immensely relevant. If caucasian developed traits which do not allow their group to live in peace with the rest of the world..Isn't that something you would want to know before struggling to join on to their society..The caucasian by his own theory is the offspring of poverty..He is genetically disposed to greed..When you come from an impoverished environment you learn to horde..It is part of surviving, sharing is not advantageous when the pickings are slim..For the record..I was taught this by a white professor in Anthropology 101..I kid you not..

In light of their history, and knowing that the caucasian has never sustained peace..ever...They have been fighting and killing on a massive level since their history was recorded..So much so that Great barriers were constructed to keep them out..What makes you think that you can live with them in peace?

Or does that not matter as well?



Whirling Moat
All of the above is only hard to swallow for:

1. People who hate NOI irrationally...
2. People who are so fervently enraptured by and immersed in the culture and knowledge of white people they can't conceive of anything else.. (so the "Sun" theory where white people are just a product of a lack of sunlight seem more plausible.. )
4.. People who believe in superiority of the Bantu phenotype.. and believe those blacks with aquiline noses etc.. are products of miscegenation and Not the original people...

I belong to none of these groups... however... I am waiting on your Shabazz explanation...and the justification for the extreme, hurtful, insensitive and sometimes outright irrational biases against Bantu phenotype.. (particularly wooly hair) I find it another level of caste and you know it... (I'm trying not to got there on this board.. but doggonit.. ugh)

*yes, I put that out there* since you're starting this thread.. I'm waiting..


*I can't BELIEVE you started this thread by the way* and yes.. I am still going to do that thing but no matter why you started this thread.. you KNOW this is bait.. damnit.. I tried to stay away from it.. but HAD to comment... grrrrr....
quote:
Originally posted by Oshun Auset:
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
...I do believe that phenotypically, the people of this entire region would have appeared very similiar to one another..Of course their would be some variations, but nothing material...

...Sister, ethnoarcheological studies have confirmed that more than one ethnic group settled in the urban areas of the early Harrapan civilization. Several physical types were present.

The Proto-Austroloid, the Twa, and other varieties of “Negroid” people, which includes blacks with thinner lips, and straight hair. They were all part of one Kingdom and are collectively referred to as Dravidian. This same multi-ethnic composition can be found in all of the great cities of the ancient world....


Which is it?

quote:
Asiatics ventured away from the North, into the hostile environments of the South below the Sahara. The purpose of this departure was experimental. There were those who believed that by subjecting themselves to a harsher environment they would become more physically powerful, and also become spiritually more awakened and refined. According to Elijah Muhammad, the people were called “Shabazz”. He taught that the members of this tribe were successful in mastering what he called a “Jungle life”. They became stronger, faster, and more durable. In the process they experienced a morphology which resulted in the Nubian phenotype. In the process however, they lost some of their cultural refinement, moved away from their original sciences and language.


I remember learning this when I dealt with the NOI for a very brief period of time... It made me squirm then, but causes violent disgust and a lingering sadness now... sck




You asked: "Which is It?"

I am not suggesting that all of the asiatic people of North Africa and the Indus valley had the same physiological appearance. I am saying that the great majority of them possessed certain physical traits in common which would have made them appear very similiar. There were however, some living in these societies who were offspring of, or descendants of our people from the Subsaharan areas of Africa. Once again, there were no border restrictions as we see today imposed upon travellers in the ancient world. The arrival of foreign populations was common at our urban centers, and even along the coastal areas of the ancient world.

You pointed to those with Austroloid/Africoid features living in Dravidian territories, and I am agreeing that this physical type was present as the record provides, however, the greater percentage of those living in this region during the neolithic period to the arrival of the Aryan hordes had features which were relatively consistent with the Straight hair, dark skin, Aqualine nose section of the population.

quote:
I remember learning this when I dealt with the NOI for a very brief period of time... It made me squirm then, but causes violent disgust and a lingering sadness now...



I don't get it..Why?

Elijah Muhammad taught that we mastered the southern environment to become more powerful...mission accomplished..wherein lies the problem?

Sister Oshun, I dont think we disagree that the Sub-Saharan people were re-trained in the mysteries by their Northern brethren from Kush, Punt, and Kemet. We have talked about this before. You have even agreed that the Ifa spiritual system was transmitted to the Yoruba via KMT.

We are a diverse and beautiful people...



Whirling Moat
Peace....



quote:
I belong to none of these groups... however... I am waiting on your Shabazz explanation...and the justification for the extreme, hurtful, insensitive and sometimes outright irrational biases against Bantu phenotype.. (particularly wooly hair) I find it another level of caste and you know it... (I'm trying not to got there on this board.. but doggonit.. ugh)



Once again, according to the doctrine, our hair became stronger...We became more powerful...

According to Mr. Muhammad it was our conditioning in Sub Saharan Africa which prepared us for ascension. It was this preparation which allowed us to endure the Transatlantic slave trade, and it was the mastery over the South which allowed us to rise from the South in America..And still we rise...

Mr. Muhammad called us "The cream of the planet". Because while we start below we always rise to the top.

Our women of the south no longer possessed long flowing hair..however, our women created some of the most feminine and beautiful styles this world has known with their wooly hair. It was never an insecurity for them..They were loved, admired, and lusted after by their own men, and men around the world..Hell, and the sisters added a few things that the black man would never trade..(ahem)..

There is no woam more beautiful or even as beautiful as the black woman fashioned by this process.

As to a new caste...I don't see that..

If you are speaking specifically to those who are registered..I would say that this is not the venue..


What do you want to know about Shabazz?



Whirling Moat
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Peace....



quote:
I belong to none of these groups... however... I am waiting on your Shabazz explanation...and the justification for the extreme, hurtful, insensitive and sometimes outright irrational biases against Bantu phenotype.. (particularly wooly hair) I find it another level of caste and you know it... (I'm trying not to got there on this board.. but doggonit.. ugh)



Once again, according to the doctrine, our hair became stronger...We became more powerful...

According to Mr. Muhammad it was our conditioning in Sub Saharan Africa which prepared us for ascension. It was this preparation which allowed us to endure the Transatlantic slave trade, and it was the mastery over the South which allowed us to rise from the South in America..And still we rise...

Mr. Muhammad called us "The cream of the planet". Because while we start below we always rise to the top.

Our women of the south no longer possessed long flowing hair..however, our women created some of the most feminine and beautiful styles this world has known with their wooly hair. It was never an insecurity for them..They were loved, admired, and lusted after by their own men, and men around the world..Hell, and the sisters added a few things that the black man would never trade..(ahem)..

There is no woam more beautiful or even as beautiful as the black woman fashioned by this process.

As to a new caste...I don't see that..

If you are speaking specifically to those who are registered..I would say that this is not the venue..


What do you want to know about Shabazz?



Whirling Moat


Why are you selling me spin..?? I know better Moat..

since this is not the proper venue...

we'll talk later...

take care...
The Yoruba are a combo of the pre-existing NOK and thoughs who travelled from the Nile Valley region...

I doubt the pre-existing NOK culture had to be 'schooled' per say, the combo and resulting Yoruba civilization was more than likey a complimentary situation where spiritual science was concernened... since both parts were already living with nature...

I remember this portion of Message to the Black Man... wasn't it referred to as 'wilderness'?(I could very well be wrong, it was so long ago)

I just cringe at anything that has the remote smell of the mental continuation of the current colour/phenotype/cultural caste system that so dominates our reality today. Even if that isn't the motivation. I cringe at even the appearance of it...
I don't understand why people cannot accept the fact that human beings are no different than any other species on this planet when it comes to adapting to and surviving in a particular environment. Everything about what the varying colors, sizes, features, of people on this planet can be attributed to surviving (and thriving) in a particular environment over a vast period of time.

Environment, climate, and nature has more to do with people being different colors, shapes and sizes than any grand design, which makes racism speak volumes about the level of ignorance of those who promote it, and, therefore, is proof that "racial supremacy" is a figment of the imagination of narcissism with a great following comprised of those incumbencing a level of ignorance equal to superstition.

White people look the way they do for the same reason that the polar bear is white, which is adaptation to a particualar environment; Black people look the way they do, likewise, due to adaptation to their environment; the same with Asians, Native Americans, South Americans, Greeks, Germans, etc., etc.,

Of course there has been an enourmous amount of mixing of the races to create groups that have similarities of different races on this planet, but in reality, I'm sure that Adam and Eve (so to speak) did not look very much like or at all like any human beings living today.
Peace...


quote:
I don't understand why people cannot accept the fact that human beings are no different than any other species on this planet when it comes to adapting to and surviving in a particular environment. Everything about what the varying colors, sizes, features, of people on this planet can be attributed to surviving (and thriving) in a particular environment over a vast period of time.


We are not in disagreement. The question becomes what were the natural forces and environmewnt which made light skin advantageous...Where did this happen, and when?


quote:
White people look the way they do for the same reason that the polar bear is white, which is adaptation to a particualar environment; Black people look the way they do, likewise, due to adaptation to their environment; the same with Asians, Native Americans, South Americans, Greeks, Germans, etc., etc.,



Once again, I do not think that we are too far away in position. I think you should do a little research on variables outside of environment which contribute to human appearance..such as sexual selection and social pressure. Some groups have a common appearance because a certain phenotype was considered superior than others..I can provide numerous examples..


But check it out beloved..

A polar bear is not designed to adapt as human beings are..We have the ability to suit ourselves to an environment or simply leave an environment. Polar Bears do not have such capabilites.


Jason believes the same thing..


Whirling Moat
quote:
Originally posted by Khalliqa:
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Peace....



quote:
I belong to none of these groups... however... I am waiting on your Shabazz explanation...and the justification for the extreme, hurtful, insensitive and sometimes outright irrational biases against Bantu phenotype.. (particularly wooly hair) I find it another level of caste and you know it... (I'm trying not to got there on this board.. but doggonit.. ugh)



Once again, according to the doctrine, our hair became stronger...We became more powerful...

According to Mr. Muhammad it was our conditioning in Sub Saharan Africa which prepared us for ascension. It was this preparation which allowed us to endure the Transatlantic slave trade, and it was the mastery over the South which allowed us to rise from the South in America..And still we rise...

Mr. Muhammad called us "The cream of the planet". Because while we start below we always rise to the top.

Our women of the south no longer possessed long flowing hair..however, our women created some of the most feminine and beautiful styles this world has known with their wooly hair. It was never an insecurity for them..They were loved, admired, and lusted after by their own men, and men around the world..Hell, and the sisters added a few things that the black man would never trade..(ahem)..

There is no woam more beautiful or even as beautiful as the black woman fashioned by this process.

As to a new caste...I don't see that..

If you are speaking specifically to those who are registered..I would say that this is not the venue..


What do you want to know about Shabazz?



Whirling Moat


Why are you selling me spin..?? I know better Moat...

appl tfro
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
A polar bear is not designed to adapt as human beings are..We have the ability to suit ourselves to an environment or simply leave an environment. Polar Bears do not have such capabilites.


It would seem to me that this claim needs to qualified.

It is more true now than it might have been 50,000 years ago because of technological advances (and perhaps even climactic changes)
that take the pressure off of biological adaptation.

But perhaps the polar bear is a much more specialized creature.
Peace....



quote:
appl fro



I think she was referring to something other than what you may be thinking...As a matter of fact i am sure she was referring to something else.. Smile



As it relates to this subject, I am not "spinning" the information. I am simply putting forward what the science dictates. The reality is that while many hold that "Whiteness" is the result of evolutionary pressure, the evidence says something different. If you include sexual selection as being an evolutionary force then you would come closer to what the evidence provides for.

The theory of simple evolution of white people is troublesome because there is no physical evidence to substantiate the claim. Where did this mutation occur? When did it occur? What areas were so affected by glaciation that the geographic impediment would have been so severe? How long does it take for a skin mutation to result in the appearance of an entirely new phenotype?

There is no solid theory that I know of which addresses these questions in a sound manner.

Does the above failure or lack of evidence mean that the Yakub Theory becomes stronger? No...

However, in light of the weak thesis offered by academia thus far, it is not justified to dismiss other plausible theories without review.

quote:
It would seem to me that this claim needs to qualified.

It is more true now than it might have been 50,000 years ago because of technological advances (and perhaps even climactic changes)
that take the pressure off of biological adaptation.

But perhaps the polar bear is a much more specialized creature.



The appearqance of white skin is recent according to what archeologist have (When I get a chance I will provide a citation). The earliest known "White" not "caucasian" but white ethnic group discovered is supposedly around 6,000 to 8,000 years old. "Caucasian" includes some black folk so we cannot go with the oldest caucasian remains.

African migrants were sophisticated enough by this time to know how to leave an environment which was suffering the onset of an Ice Age. Normally such hunter gatherer people will migrate with the natural resources. Glaciation, and climate change is not something which would have happened overnight..Not even over thousands of nigts..Maybe tens of thousands of nights..

Like other mammals, the african would have understood that it was dangerous remaining in an environment which was dying. And again, they would have easily found there way out..If they chose to leave..If they stayed due to other non-environmental factors, then that ties into another theory.



Whirling Moat
Peace....



quote:
Okay Moat, what was I thinking?


Well brother, I cannot tell you exactly what you were thinking, but I do know what you weren't thinking i.e, you were not thinking of the time when you used to be a female race horse on Jupiter's largest Moon Ganymede...

This sister has very specific issues as it relates to being an MGT in the Nation Of Islam. I know what these issues are since she and I have gone over these things in the past...

From what I understand you have never been an MGT (A female muslim in the Nation) , or a registered Muslim in the NOI.



Whirling Moat
quote:
Originally posted by Whirling Moat:
Peace....



quote:
Okay Moat, what was I thinking?


Well brother, I cannot tell you exactly what you were thinking, but I do know what you weren't thinking i.e, you were not thinking of the time when you used to be a female race horse on Jupiter's largest Moon Ganymede...

This sister has very specific issues as it relates to being an MGT in the Nation Of Islam. I know what these issues are since she and I have gone over these things in the past...

From what I understand you have never been an MGT (A female muslim in the Nation) , or a registered Muslim in the NOI.



Whirling Moat

This is correct.
My concern goes back to the issue of what seems to be a phenotype bias within the teachings of the NOI as well as with respect to the upper leadership.

Secondarily to this is the attempt to ascribe scientific validity/facticity with the Nation's teaching on human genesis and evolution. For example, does the NOI still teach that the origin of monkeys and gorillas is the effort of Caucasians to "graft" themselves back to black by reverse breeding. [Elijah Muhammad, Message to the Blackman in America,Chicago: The Final Call, Inc., 1965, pp. 117 and 119.] If so, this hardly coheres with science. The same holds for the notion of two-germs theory of "genetics."

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