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quote:
"I've got to move [on] but I want to stay, I gotta find me somebody who won't give me love and then take it away." --Calvin Richardson


Those lyrics, unfortunately, ring so true to brothers like me"”brothers that know how give and receive love, however, instead of receiving the love they want, they are confronted with some women that have a plethora of unresolved personal issues, skeletons in their closets, and create drama.

Before I continue with this discussion, I will let you know that this isn't a shouting match, a pity party, a form of female-bashing nor is it an invitation to start another gender war forum. I will just let you ladies, and brothers too, check out this hilarious site known as Elements of the Ladder Theory.
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You also consider the topic to be interesting, Sandye but you didn't comment any further--let me pose this question to you then:

Being interpersonally savvy can be a two-edged sword: on the one side, being able to steer clear of drama, and games and preventing arguments and confrontations, as well as, knowing how to initiate and maintain romantic endeavors can be a plus, however, the downside is this: there are a lot of people out there, both men as well as women, that have a lot of issues"”many of these issues stemming from a harsh childhood due to coming from a broken home and or having multiple negative experiences with members of he opposite sex.

Being interpersonally savvy can keep the drama down to a minimum in your life but it will also keep you, more often than not, single. My question to you, Sandye, is this: How would one, that is well experienced, effectively deal with a person that is emotionally unstable or interpersonally inexperienced? Better yet, how would you deal with the ordeal, Sandye?
This answer is on the fly, as I haven't pondered your question long enough to give a full and complete answer. Forgive in advance if I need to post an addendum or edit this.

Off the cuff - If I perceive someone as being emotionally unstable or interpersonnally inexperienced, I would run the hell out the room with the quickness and not involve myself in the ordeal.

I would rather be single with my home being the place of sanctuary where I can restore and renew the positive energy required for me to attain my higher goals and pursue my dreams.

I want to wine, dine, and engage in stimulating discussion. That can't happen with an insecure brother who brings yesterday's garbage to the dinner table. Being weak is a choice - an excuse, if you will, to avoid being accountable for the choices one makes.

The key word is - avoidance. Avoid people who don't empower you. Avoid people who are still blaming their childhood for choices that they make as adults. Avoid people who don't take time to emotionally heal and resolve the issues of their last painful breakup. Avoid people who vex your spirit.

I am not eithout empathy. I would refer such a brother to a counselor with the skills necessary to provide him with the power to resolve and reconcile issues that prevent him from reaching his own manifest destiny. That is not my area of expertise.

There are far too many wonderful, strong, self-sufficient, and confident brothers out there for sisters to "settle" for the unstable brother just to say "I gotta man!" when they merely have a male companion.

My man must be stronger than me in 5 important areas: 1)emotionally, 2)physically, 3) mentally, 4)intellectually, and 5)spiritually. I want to know that if I need to lean on him (which is not often) that he has the strength to hold us up.

Maybe more later ....
Good answer, my twin.

It is our primary responsibility to choose that which is best for us; and avoiding toxic relationships is high on the list of things that are best for us.

The troubling thing is that so many of those unstable people, fail to recognize/acknowledge their toxicity, and attempt to lay their issues on others.

But, then again, that is where being responsible for our choices come in. We must be secure enough in ourselves to walk (or run) out of the room.

But one question about something you wrote: My man must be stronger than me in 5 important areas: 1)emotionally, 2)physically, 3) mentally, 4)intellectually, and 5)spiritually.

How do you determine that the man is "stronger" than you? Is it determined through struggle-him being strong and you resisting and/or testing him until he proves worthy, at which point you "submit" to his strength?

[Forgive the ackward construction of the question. My choice of words are not intended to be inflammatory]
Thank you, Twin!

I do not think that strength is measured or recognized through struggle, battles, wins and losses, but rather the lack thereof. Quiet storms produce rather dramatic results. When a person is sure of themself, they have nothing to prove and don't have to jockey for position. They know who they are.

I can tell when my man is stronger than me when he demonstrates that he is desious of performing the duties that are required for him to assume his rightful position as the head of the household.

He has no problem wearing the pants, (I wear Victoria's Secret) and he will do whatever is required for the good of the household without being confrontational. He brings his issues to me and I to him and we discuss them as the intelligent human beings that we are.

We empower each other and feed from each other's energies. I recognize that men and women have different roles in relationships, and I understand that sometimes I must be his shoulder. I have no problem with that.

Knowing that my wishes are considered and that he has his priorities straight, I can safely rest in his arms and know that he has my back, and encourages me in my efforts to be the woman of destiny that is deserving of a man such as he.

Being a real man is his first priority in life, and he doesn't have to shout to be heard.
quote:
Originally posted by IRONHORSE:
quote:
"I've got to move [on] but I want to stay, I gotta find me somebody who won't give me love and then take it away." --Calvin Richardson


Those lyrics, unfortunately, ring so true to brothers like me"”brothers that know how give and receive love, however, instead of receiving the love they want, they are confronted with some women that have a plethora of unresolved personal issues, skeletons in their closets, and create drama.

Before I continue with this discussion, I will let you know that this isn't a shouting match, a pity party, a form of female-bashing nor is it an invitation to start another gender war forum. I will just let you ladies, and brothers too, check out this hilarious site known as Elements of the Ladder Theory.



Interesting sites and topic.....I do find myself agreeing with a good number of things especially on the links as I look back on my early adulhood back in college and grad school...so sad. I too was that young kid in the 15 lessions and I am still learning. But I have learned to be patient. Interesting stuff.
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Considering that no one is born without character flaws (including you Ironhorse), I believe that it is impossible to go through life dodging and avoiding confrontations and rejection. At some point, we must grow up and realize that each of us is a unique individual with our own personality, character, and values. Some of these values and character traits may or may not be compatible with your own. We must also be reminded that everyone deals with life's disappointments differently. Some of us are not as resilent as others. In any case, the ultimate joy of being "interpersonally savvy," in my view, is meeting new people and enjoying the positive qualities they have to offer rather than concentrating on those aspects of the person that you perceive to be "negative." And if you're going to waste your entire life looking for everything that is wrong with the people you encounter, then you may as well remain single. Its better that some people remain single anyway than to make others feel guilty for not living up to their warped expectations. Lastly, your introduction adamantly announces that your thread will not be a form of female-bashing; however, from my observations I notice that you consistently associate "drama," "instability," and "unresolved personal issues" to females, as if these characteristics are unique to women. You realize of course that men bring just as many unresloved issues to a relationship as do women. I'm certain every woman in this thread can provide a list of experiences confirming this point. Therefore, my recommendation for anyone interested in attracting positive companionship is to do a self-inventory to make sure you are being the positive, drama-less individual that you seek. Do you have unresolved issues with women???

FYI: I think a better topic title for this thread would be Deconstructing Relationship Dogma, perhaps?
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Sandye, babygirl, as much as I would love to respond to you first, I think Rowe's misconceptions need to be rectified first.

First, Rowe, you're an intelligent sister--please start a new paragraph with each new thought you express in your posts. It's much easier on my eyes.

Secondly, Rowe, the reason why I entitled this discussion, "Deconstructing Diva Dogma" is because of the site I linked to my discussion on the ladder theory, which clearly deconstructs some of the issues that many women would deny but operate under nevertheless.

Thirdly, Rowe, I thought you said you didn't have the time to be concerned with trivial things like what the title of a discussion is, rather, you would prefer to deal with the content of the topic.

As you could also see, Rowe, Sandye has expressed, to a great degree, pretty much the same personal philosophy I abide by in my life:

quote:
The key word is - avoidance. Avoid people who don't empower you. Avoid people who are still blaming their childhood for choices that they make as adults. Avoid people who don't take time to emotionally heal and resolve the issues of their last painful breakup. Avoid people who vex your spirit. --Sandye


The problem with this site, so far, is the majority of the regulars, male and female, have invested so much time in hating on me for my opinionated statements, no one except for a small number has employed their better judgement and dealt with my expressions objectively. You want to make it seem like I have issues with women when I have expressed both the good and bad sides of my experiences in interacting with women.

quote:
"interpersonally savvy," in my view, is meeting new people and enjoying the positive qualities they have to offer rather than concentrating on those aspects of the person that you perceive to be "negative." --Rowe


As I expressed earlier, Rowe, in the event of being interpersonally savvy, it is a two-edged sword. I explained both the up side, which was, "knowing how to initiate and maintain romantic endeavors" and the down side of interpersonal savviness, which was, "Being interpersonally savvy can keep the drama down to a minimum" which inevitably and, more often than not, leads to being single, if the person you're involved with doesn't share your desire to keep unecessary drama to a mininmum.


This comment was quite unecessary, Rowe:

quote:
I notice that you consistently associate "drama," "instability," and "unresolved personal issues" to females, as if these characteristics are unique to women. --Rowe


As I recall, Rowe, I even made an entire discussion supporting you for having the courage to confront brothers that do not have themselves together, which means I try to be equally critical of both sexes instead of being biased to one. I don't recall you insinuating that I had unresolved issues with women then, and I most definately didn't insinuate that you had unresolved issues with men, which I am begining to think otherwise.

I am more than an understanding man when it comes to being in a relationship with a woman that has 'character flaws' because I, myself, have character flaws. I am often the one that is willing to establish an open, sincere, and consistent line of communication, comprimise, relate to, and understand the woman I'm involved with, however, it's one thing to work with a woman that may have a few issues, it's quite another to put up with someone that is consistently counterproductive to the progress of the relationship because they chose to use their own unresolved issues as a crutch to hinder themselves and the person they're involved with. This is where I also agree with Sandye in this personal philosophy:

quote:
I am not eithout empathy. I would refer such a [sister] to a counselor with the skills necessary to provide [her] with the power to resolve and reconcile issues that prevent [her] from reaching [her] own manifest destiny. That is not my area of expertise.

There are far too many wonderful, strong, self-sufficient, and confident [sisters] out there for [brothers] to "settle" for the unstable [sister] just to say "I gotta [woman]!" when they merely have a [female] companion. --Sandye



I don't care how much a person loves someone--if the relationship causes more harm than good, it is not worth maintaining that relationship. Maintaining a relationship with someone that does not have your best interests at heart, as much as you have theirs, is not a sign of maturity, as you so conspicuously put it, but a sign of despair and being in denial.
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