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In another thread our good brother CF, when talking about black mayors and the problems of our community, suggested the following:

quote:
Originally posted by Constructive Feedback:

When we note the economic state of cities that are DOMINATED BY PEOPLE WHO THINK LIKE YOU (meaning Empty, Pace, Isome and some others - I don't know enough about Negrological to include you yet) you are not yet willing to accept a possible correlation between these two factors.


If we accept his premise, then it leads me to think about the correlation between black political conservatives (or even conservatives in general) and the black community. What has political conservatism, and in particular black conservatism, done for black people in America?

© MBM

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I will focus upon THE INTERNALS OF THE BLACK COMMUNITY since this is where you all fear to venture as you highlight how you have gotten WHITE FOLKS TO CHANGE for the comfort of Black people.


The Black culture in America AMONG fellow Blacks is a conservative culture. As Whites explored new styles of living in the 1960's the Black community rejected "shacking up", "open homosexual relationships" and disrespect of the matriarchal or patriarchal figure by children. How many times have you heard a Black person listen to how a White kid talked to his parents and await him to be slapped down, only to be surprised when nothing happened?

The Black church has a long, long history of traditional and/or conservative values that it has streessed WITHIN the Black community. It has long been the source of our moral basis that now seems to be slipping away.

It seems to me that as the Black migration took hold and we began to more in great numbers to the industrial northern cities - a great loss of community was had. This served to erode the value of marital unions between Black males and females. As a reference - the controversial report by Daniel Patrick Moynehan sounded the alarm bells about Black unwed pregnancy when the rate was 25% as this was a threat. Today, more than 30 years later the rate is at 72% and possibly higher.

It seems that certain policies have stepped into common practice and allowed the cultural bonds that allowed us to endure great pain as a people. The unintended consequences of these policies is that we now have a fracture and infighting between the Black male and the Black woman as the man departs from his responsibilities and the women seeks assistance from the government provided court system to receive conpensation from the father of her children. This rate of engagement with the court system for child support is a phenomenon of the past 40 years. The courts have replaced the TRADITIONAL cultural admonition to DO RIGHT BY YOUR CHILDREN.

TRADITIONAL values can be found in the Kwanza cerimony in which we give tribute to our bygone elders and reference to several important core values - self determination, responsibility, purpose, faith, etc. I don't see a call for the LIBERAL - "do it if it feels good to you" in any part of the tradition of Kwanza.


ONCE AGAIN - THE ULTIMATE TEST OF THE "CORRECTNESS" OF YOUR OWN IDEOLOGY IS NOT IT'S POPULARITY. THE BEST EVIDENCE IS TO MEASURE IT'S EFFECTIVENESS IN TRANSFORMING YOUR PEOPLE OVER TIME CLOSER TO THE COMMON GOALS THAT HAVE BEEN STATED.

"Popularity" could mean that masses of people are similarly LOST just as you are and thus IN ITSELF means nothing. You need to UNIFY behind a set of ideals that have proven to TRANSFORM the people toward the better from their own initiative and not just having WHITE FOLKS TO STOP assaulting you. This alone is not going to bring salvation to Black people.
quote:
Originally posted by MBM:

If we accept his premise, then it leads me to think about the correlation between black political conservatives (or even conservatives in general) and the black community. What has political conservatism, and in particular black conservatism, done for black people in America?


The topic is about political conservatism.
Please define what "Political Conservatism" is.


I don't consider myself a "political conservative".

I consider myself as being educated on the function and importance of BUSINESS, for example, and how these businesses provide a platform for people to be motivated to educate themselves for the pursuit of employment, healthcare and he quality of life that this brings.

When I see POLICIES that are punitive in nature against BUSINESS due to someone's ideological bias and then note that their basis is totally flawed as they don't make note of their interactions and benefits from the goods and services that these businesses provide to them (Isome) THEN I WILL VOICE OPPOSITION TO THESE POLICIES.

Does this make me a CONSERVATIVE - MBM?

I have an article on how the problems with General Motors threatens to impact the suburbs of Detroit. We can look at how the move of the big 3 to the suburbs has hurt innercity Detroit.

In my inferences about the standard of living that these corporations make AM I BEING A "CONSERVATIVE" MBM?

When I note how Black communities are always talking about ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT - do you hear them talking about setting up more GOVERNMENTS to hand out money to lift all the people out of poverty OR ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT CREATING COMPANIES THAT DEVELOP JOBS that allow these individuals to channel their productive potential?

So you see MBM - the word "Conservative" really means nothing to me. This is nothing more than the POPULARITY story once again.

I would like to debate you and others head on with regard to THE INTERNALS OF THE BLACK COMMUNITY and how you are going to create infrastructure that allows more of us to prosper.

You are only interested in labels and power - trampling over minority voices as you seek to steamroll others with your POPULAR notions. Let us talk about IDEAS THAT WORK and the dropping of ideas that don't work.
quote:
Originally posted by Constructive Feedback:

Please define what "Political Conservatism" is.


I'm not trying to play games or get into a semantics debate about terminology. If you pretend not to know what the term means then perhaps this topic is not for you.

quote:
I don't consider myself a "political conservative".


Great. No one asked though. sck

quote:
Does this make me a CONSERVATIVE - MBM?


Again, for the purposes of this thread, I could care less.


quote:
In my inferences about the standard of living that these corporations make AM I BEING A "CONSERVATIVE" MBM?


Who cares? Answer the question.


quote:
So you see MBM - the word "Conservative" really means nothing to me. This is nothing more than the POPULARITY story once again.


Well, perhaps someone who is better informed on the topic can contribute.
quote:
Has political conservatism done anything for the black community?
---MBM

I struggle with what 'conservatism' is as it pertains to political persuasion.

As I have said, I identify political conservatims as being synonamus with Republican.

For as much of that as is true, conservatism gave the African American population less than full participation in all of the assets of American citizenship, most of economic opportunity, and little of political power.


PEACE

Jim Chester

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