Black Women and Ward Connelly

Profetessofrage, we all know that Ward Connerly is a demented little man who doesn't even want to be black. Look at who he's campaigning for and look at who is wife is.
I have long come to the sad conclusion that only black women are the ones to save the race. Many of us don't know it yet, but we are. Many black men have fallen into the trap of materialism and have don't respect black women and at times WE allow it. I wish that there was an organization that was a Black feminist/Black power organization for sisters to be involved in nationally. That would be an awesome and powerful organization.

Our people have made the mistake of confusing the methods with the objectives. As long as we agree on objectives, we should never fall out with each other just because we believe in different methods, or tactics, or strategy. We have to keep in mind at all times that we are not fighting for separation. We are fighting for recognition as free humans in this society
Malcolm X, 1965

LOL @ "marybecky"


But who is Ward Connerly's wife?

First Negrospiritual, don't pass out but I know that Ward's wife is not black. I believe she's white specifically.

And Yssys the perspective that you see was articulated in a book that I recently read that was a bit disheartening but very enlightening. The book is entitled "Race Mixing" and it follows the history of interracial relationships in the US since post-WW2. It specifically chronicles the history of black-white unions in the US. Now both black men and women in interracial relationships were at the same pace in the late 1940s and thru the 1950s however the numbers fell off around the 1960s and black men's interracial relationships began to outpace black women's. The book said there was no reason for black women being behind black men when it came to interracial relationships b/c both groups were enjoying the same fruits of the civil rights movement. Both groups were going to college at the same pace, entering the job force and so forth around the same numbers. However what the book saw was that both groups had a different idea of freedom.

A lot of black men until this day believe that freedom is for the individual including marrying whomever you please. But on the contrary a lot of black women believe that freedom is when the whole community enjoys it. A lot of black women feel indebted to the community including their own love life. A lot of black women feel it is their responsibility to keep the community thriving and doing so means marrying within the community, which explains the numbers the book gave that 70% of black women refuse to date outside of their race and would rather marry down than marry white men. Black men on the flip side are 60% more likely to date outside of their race. The fact of the matter is, is that we don't share the same ideas of what freedom is. A lot of black women want it for all black people and a lot of black men just want it for themselves. Black men believe that they've been controlled by America for so long that when they get to a place when they're finally tasting freedom it's unfair that black women do the same "controlling" by telling them who they should marry. They believe that that's a part of freedom, loving whomever you please.

I must also note that the book said that the reason for black women panicking about interracial relationships had something to do with statements expressed around the 60s, 70s and on about the fact that white men weren't exactly coming in droves to court black women which left black women questioning "If black men are gone then who will want us." So it was also this feeling of having to compete w/ white women which was exacerbated by black Nationalist men who used interracial relationships in an attempt to keep black women "submissive." The author gave some details about black Nationalist men would tell black women "If you don't abide by our rules of what your roles are and should be than we will run to white women." Hence the continual stereotypes by a lot of black men that "Black women are just too strong/evil and white women are the antithesis."

But I must also point out that I didn't give this fascinating info to arouse hysteria b/c the fact of the matter is that black-white unions are rare only 8-10% of black men are married to non-black women and 4% (and growing) black women are married to non-black men. More and more black women are dating/marrying outside of the race. And currently there are only around 400,000 black-white unions in the US. Blacks are actually lag behind Asians and Latinos when it comes to interracial dating/marriage. Furthermore the military has higher rates of interracial unions than the civilian population. And the reason black-white unions are so low is not b/c of whites but because of blacks, both men and women. So while "your" eyes tell you one thing it's the opposite in reality. The book is a good book however I didn't feel to good about the perpetual "black women are vindictive" sentiments that the book kept stringing throughout its chapters. I believe the author is a white woman (last name Romano) in her own interracial relationship, so that might be the reason for the feeling of some bias. But it is a good book.

[This message was edited by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual on October 23, 2003 at 10:29 PM.]

Ladies, if you all get a chance stop by the library or your local Borders Books and check out "Shifting: The Double Lives of Black women in America" by Kumea Shorter-Gooden and Charisse Jones. I thought that the subject matter was so interesting that I went out and purchased the book as soon as I could find where it was available. These ladies headed up a study called "The African American Women's Voices Project" which is what this book is based upon. I found myself agreeing with I'd say 99.9% of what they discussed in the book. I think that it's the black woman's collective voice about how we feel about America and the Black community. I highly recommend it. I've posted two topics about the book. If you all have read it and have any comments regarding it please post them here or here.
Thanks ladies

Our people have made the mistake of confusing the methods with the objectives. As long as we agree on objectives, we should never fall out with each other just because we believe in different methods, or tactics, or strategy. We have to keep in mind at all times that we are not fighting for separation. We are fighting for recognition as free humans in this society
Malcolm X, 1965

Hi Everyone, great responses. It is the hour in which God HAS awakened his most powerful force on planet earth. The Harriet Tubman, Sojourner Truth, Queen Nzingha invincible spirit is in us righteous black women of truth.

Ysyss, how right you are, it is black women who alone can and will save our posterity lest we become extinct, subservient, docile, white worshipping fools as these colored boys would make us. That is, these colored boys are once again, more or less selling we black women and our collective beloved daughters into slavery with a grin on their faces. They are modern day Josiah Hensons whose testimony was that his greatest pleasure was to 'please his white master, and in fact, he was VAIN ABOUT IT. Proud as a peacock everytime his master praised him over the good job he forced him to do. When beaten with the whip, he said, 'he resolved to do his best never to 'HURT MASSA SO, THAT HE WOULD HAVE TO BE UPSET AND WHIP HIM.' In other words, every slash the white fiend gave him he bemoaned not for himself but because the white fiend was upset and had to tire his arm in slashing Josiah's back.

Josiah's mentality is in modern day colored republican boys. This is why they take the subservient disposition that they do. They still worship and adore and seek to please whites at all costs. So this, 'yes massa, I'll erase my 'blackness' rather than demand YOU erase and halt your white demonism' so-called Christian mentality is what they are really all about and as a result, the judgment of God is against them just as it was against their cowardly azz enslaved counterpart.

Let us remember, most of those slaves, especially house negroes were terrified of any talk, let alone, escape, revolt action. They used to turn blacks in, for secretly teaching blacks, as well as, planning an escape, revolt, or sabotage of the white fiend's property. This is the exact mentality of the colored republican boys today. They do always resist the true Holy Spirit while proclaiming their blindness, docility, weakness, cowardliness, subservient mentality Christ-like. Whereas we all know the truth is, the 'warrior, the brave, courageous' blacks like Harriet were the true Christians and acted thereon. To behold True spirituality in action is to behold a black warrior wielding the weapon of truth, fighting a good fight while the docile sat calling Jesus but to fearful, cowardly to let Jesus call them to action. Lest we forget, Harriet had to 'pull a gun' on those colored boys just to get them to go to freedom. Now, the colored boys would point to her what they alone see as 'violence' as proof she wasn't called of God but we all no better now don't we?

Reality is this, the BLACK MATRIARCHY is being birth and each of us manifest it as we withstand the most fierce enemy to our well-being the Enemy within, aka treacherous colored boys fighting for white males to retain 100% rule and power over the wealth, resources, and well-being of Blacks. We destroy them, and the enemy without will collaspe. Unfortunately, that is the FACT and the TRUTH. Weak colored boys and girl's subserviency is that which has always aided white dominion. We would be a lot further advanced without them and our God is determined to prove it, if you will by using Black women to bring those idiots down, which will result in the exaltation of the black woman and our will and ways.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual:
"First Negrospiritual, don't pass out but I know that Ward's wife is not black. I believe she's white specifically."
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MY REPLY:Hi LFBI Yeh, I'm with you, hold on negrospiritual because the fact is yes, that little dumpling is married to a white woman. I mean if you think about it, what decent black woman of truth would have him? He belongs to she whom his tender heart aches, lusts for and treasures. Little Mary Beckys of the world. And TRUTH is, they can have him with the black woman's blessings. And we do mean, NO DIVORCE PLEASSSE!

IFBI YOU STATED:"And Yssys the perspective that you see was articulated in a book that I recently read that was a bit disheartening but very enlightening. The book is entitled "Race Mixing" and it follows the history of interracial relationships in the US since post-WW2. It specifically chronicles the history of black-white unions in the US. Now both black men and women in interracial relationships were at the same pace in the late 1940s and thru the 1950s however the numbers fell off around the 1960s and black men's interracial relationships began to outpace black women's. The book said there was no reason for black women being behind black men when it came to interracial relationships b/c both groups were enjoying the same fruits of the civil rights movement. Both groups were going to college at the same pace, entering the job force and so forth around the same numbers. However what the book saw was that both groups had a different idea of freedom."

MY REPLY:Yes but let me add this, the truth is this, black women since being sold out by wretched weak black males, have been accosted by white males. Even in rags and sackcloth the white fiend enslaver preferred black women over his supposed 'superior' she mate. Yes, he lusted after and by the droves raped black women who would have preferred that his she-mate perform superior in bed in order to keep that ilk off of them.

This 'accostation' reality throughout every day of our existance among caucasoid males is not factored into the stats.. Whether these white males accost black women for the right or wrong reasons, as you well stated, 'the majority of black women will not give the idea a second thought.' In fact, the majority amount would have remained higher except for black males who took to the media proclaiming their 'preference' for the mistress of the white male's who enslaved them over the black enslaved woman who black males sold out in the first place.

Yes, it was at that time that I myself became an advocator of black women allowing the few fair minded caucasian, brown, yellow, red, men to marry them, put them in fine homes, control their wallet and treat black women like the Nubian Queens we deserved to be treated like. In fact, I'll get mad at a black woman who will hesitate when offered a date by a sincere man out of any ethnic group that shows her the respect and dignity due us. And the truth of the matter girls is this, we have never seen happier black women than those married to men of different ethnic groups. In fact, It's sometimes annoying to see them bouncing around, carefree, and by and large, peppy, always peppy, isn't it BLACK WOMEN? Isn't it the truth?!!

YOU STATED:"A lot of black men until this day believe that freedom is for the individual including marrying whomever you please. But on the contrary a lot of black women believe that freedom is when the whole community enjoys it. A lot of black women feel indebted to the community including their own love life. A lot of black women feel it is their responsibility to keep the community thriving and doing so means marrying within the community, which explains the numbers the book gave that 70% of black women refuse to date outside of their race and would rather marry down than marry white men. Black men on the flip side are 60% more likely to date outside of their race. The fact of the matter is, is that we don't share the same ideas of what freedom is. A lot of black women want it for all black people and a lot of black men just want it for themselves. Black men believe that they've been controlled by America for so long that when they get to a place when they're finally tasting freedom it's unfair that black women do the same "controlling" by telling them who they should marry. They believe that that's a part of freedom, loving whomever you please."

MY REPLY: Here, here, exactly! Oh, and let me add with regard to your TRUTH with regard to the selfish, reckless, unconscious thought process of the black male, he is the reason we lag behind. His lusts has been his downfall. He watched to much 'white girl exaltation' on tv and was indelibly TOUCHED. Mesmerized and that is a factor they will have to work out, and as a result, we black women who are not hindered in that sick icky warped degrading way, will henceforth, take control of our own destiny as he's tripped up and will always be halted with the white man's favorite tool, throw the white girl at him.

So come on black women, let's unite, onward and upward for us! See, Our eyes are on the RIGHT PRIZE, freedom, black self-rule, liberation, and all that...the black MATRIARCHY BE BORNE.. Oh, yeah let this FREEDOM ALONE RING!

YOU STATED:"I must also note that the book said that the reason for black women panicking about interracial relationships had something to do with statements expressed around the 60s, 70s and on about the fact that white men weren't exactly coming in droves to court black women which left black women questioning "If black men are gone then who will want us." So it was also this feeling of having to compete w/ white women which was exacerbated by black Nationalist men who used interracial relationships in an attempt to keep black women "submissive." The author gave some details about black Nationalist men would tell black women "If you don't abide by our rules of what your roles are and should be than we will run to white women." Hence the continual stereotypes by a lot of black men that "Black women are just too strong/evil and white women are the antithesis."

MY REPLY: I'm not the 'panicking' sort, it's good riddance to bad rubbish, who needs them. White women please take them, really. We'll just have to learn to do the Indian powwow dance with those BROTHERS, or the Puerto Rican senorita' stuff, etc., and all that.

I mean honestly, black women could never, ever respect them for their sick, twisted, mindset and subsequent actions anyway. They are ants beneath our feet at this point. Can you imagine what future generations of black women living under a matriarchy running their own queendoms will say when they review history and see how and why the black male was tripped up? It's a wonder if they won't call for immediate 'enslavement of the males' in their midst.

Oh, one more thing, with regard to the black nationalist and their need to 'RULE' the black woman. Get Real! They should be down on their knees praising African/American women for NOT being SERIAL KILLERS and for so much as being willing to LET THEM WORK BESIDE US instead of them having the gall to be making plans on the black woman's place. Her place is as it always has been when victory abounded, THE LEADER! THE MATRIARCHY! After all, It was strictly the patriarchy that let in the white fiend in the first place.

YOU STATED:"But I must also point out that I didn't give this fascinating info to arouse hysteria b/c _the fact of the matter is that black-white unions are rare only 8-10% of black men are married to non-black women and 4%_ (and growing) _black women are married to non-black men._ More and more black women are dating/marrying outside of the race. And currently _there are only around 400,000 black-white unions in the US._ _Blacks are actually lag behind Asians and Latinos when it comes to interracial dating/marriage._ Furthermore the military has higher rates of interracial unions than the civilian population. _And the reason black-white unions are so low is not b/c of whites but because of blacks, both men and women._ So while "your" eyes tell you one thing it's the opposite in reality. The book is a good book however I didn't feel to good about the perpetual "black women are vindictive" sentiments that the book kept stringing throughout its chapters. I believe the author is a white woman (last name Romano) in her own interracial relationship, so that might be the reason for the feeling of some bias. But it is a good book."

MY REPLY: Hey LFBI, no hysteria on my calm part... No seriously, you are right about the stats, and that just shows some of our breeding in collective black males worked. It also shows they can be 'redeemed' if they choose to let Truth redeem them.

Actually, the major stats. show that 75% of white jewish males marry anglo white women, followed by 60% of Asians, somewhere from up to 40 to 50% of Hispanic males, with black males coming in last with only 10-15%. This is all the more remarkable in that 100% have been accosted by white females.

Still more power to all the black males who do date/marry out of their race. And God bless black women who are no longer settling for the dross, but will allow any decent fair-minded, loving, handsome man out of any walk of life to lift her up to her Nubian Queen status.

[This message was edited by Prophetessofrage on October 24, 2003 at 02:05 PM.]

Well this post and many others I've just read illustrate a point I've been trying to make for sometime now. The majority of African American women DO NOT suffer from lack of self-esteem. Quite to the contrary a good portion have too much of it. Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge.

Prophetess (if that the way you want to play it)you speak of YAH constantly,but in my 31 years on this planet I can't recall a more haughty person than yourself. If your so eager to quote scripture why not read Prov.16:18, Is.2:11,17, Ezek.16:50, Zeph.3:11, Rom.11:20, Is.14:13-15, Dan.5:20-23, mark 7:21,22, luke18:11,12, Hos.7:9,10, Ps.73:6 there are more and I can go on-and on. Haughtiness and highminded people are at the top of the lord YAH's most hated of sins so just why pray tell do you expect to be rewarded for yours. And how do you explain your anti-patriarchal stance when it comes directly from the architect, creator, and sovreign ruler of existence it's self,this I've got to hear.

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Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

quote:

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Originally posted by Yssys:
Profetessofrage, we all know that Ward Connerly is a demented little man who doesn't even want to be black. Look at who he's campaigning for and look at who is wife is.
I have long come to the sad conclusion that only black women are the ones to save the race. Many of us don't know it yet, but we are. Many black men have fallen into the trap of materialism and have don't respect black women and at times WE allow it. I wish that there was an organization that was a Black feminist/Black power organization for sisters to be involved in nationally. That would be an awesome and powerful organization.

Our people have made the mistake of confusing the methods with the objectives. As long as we agree on objectives, we should never fall out with each other just because we believe in different methods, or tactics, or strategy. We have to keep in mind at all times that we are not fighting for separation. We are fighting for recognition as free humans in this society
Malcolm X, 1965

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Black men are one's who're materialistic...that's a joke right?...Right?

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Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

quote:

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Originally posted by IMMORTAL LOGIC:

Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge.

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Respectfully . . .


There is no passion to be found playing small, in settling for a life
that is less than the one you are capable of living. - Mandela

quote:

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Originally posted by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual:
First Negrospiritual, don't pass out but I know that Ward's wife is not black. I believe she's white specifically.

And Yssys the perspective that you see was articulated in a book that I recently read that was a bit disheartening but very enlightening. The book is entitled "Race Mixing" and it follows the history of interracial relationships in the US since post-WW2. It specifically chronicles the history of black-white unions in the US. Now both black men and women in interracial relationships were at the same pace in the late 1940s and thru the 1950s however the numbers fell off around the 1960s and black men's interracial relationships began to outpace black women's. The book said there was no reason for black women being behind black men when it came to interracial relationships b/c both groups were enjoying the same fruits of the civil rights movement. Both groups were going to college at the same pace, entering the job force and so forth around the same numbers. However what the book saw was that both groups had a different idea of freedom.

A lot of black men until this day believe that freedom is for the individual including marrying whomever you please. But on the contrary a lot of black women believe that freedom is when the whole community enjoys it. A lot of black women feel indebted to the community including their own love life. A lot of black women feel it is their responsibility to keep the community thriving and doing so means marrying within the community, which explains the numbers the book gave that 70% of black women refuse to date outside of their race and would rather marry down than marry white men. Black men on the flip side are 60% more likely to date outside of their race. The fact of the matter is, is that we don't share the same ideas of what freedom is. A lot of black women want it for all black people and a lot of black men just want it for themselves. Black men believe that they've been controlled by America for so long that when they get to a place when they're finally tasting freedom it's unfair that black women do the same "controlling" by telling them who they should marry. They believe that that's a part of freedom, loving whomever you please.

I must also note that the book said that the reason for black women panicking about interracial relationships had something to do with statements expressed around the 60s, 70s and on about the fact that white men weren't exactly coming in droves to court black women which left black women questioning "If black men are gone then who will want us." So it was also this feeling of having to compete w/ white women which was exacerbated by black Nationalist men who used interracial relationships in an attempt to keep black women "submissive." The author gave some details about black Nationalist men would tell black women "If you don't abide by our rules of what your roles are and should be than we will run to white women." Hence the continual stereotypes by a lot of black men that "Black women are just too strong/evil and white women are the antithesis."

But I must also point out that I didn't give this fascinating info to arouse hysteria b/c _the fact of the matter is that black-white unions are rare only 8-10% of black men are married to non-black women and 4%_ (and growing) _black women are married to non-black men._ More and more black women are dating/marrying outside of the race. And currently _there are only around 400,000 black-white unions in the US._ _Blacks are actually lag behind Asians and Latinos when it comes to interracial dating/marriage._ Furthermore the military has higher rates of interracial unions than the civilian population. _And the reason black-white unions are so low is not b/c of whites but because of blacks, both men and women._ So while "your" eyes tell you one thing it's the opposite in reality. The book is a good book however I didn't feel to good about the perpetual "black women are vindictive" sentiments that the book kept stringing throughout its chapters. I believe the author is a white woman (last name Romano) in her own interracial relationship, so that might be the reason for the feeling of some bias. But it is a good book.

[This message was edited by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual on October 23, 2003 at 10:29 PM.]

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interracial coupling was illegal up until the 'Loving v. Virginia' Supreme court decision in the early 1970. This was the law 'on record' in not just VA, but in most of the South [which has the highest pops of Blk Americans] This law prevented just confirmed Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall from living in the State of VA [Northern VA suburb of DC] because he was interracially married. So the facts you post, should be understood under the law of the land from the beginning of this country up until about 1970. Also, the highest rate of IR marriage involves past and present member of the military [Semper Fi] and is growing rapidly

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'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

RadioRaheem what are you talking about, babe? Did you read my admission that those facts came from a book chronicling the history of interracial black-white unions since post-WW2? And furthermore there's a very famous black man who has been married to white women since the 1940's. Who? Quincy Jones. And yes interracial marriage was illegal in a lot of states but not in all of the states-that's a big difference. And what is your point about interracial coupling being illegal? Sodomy laws didn't prevent gays and lesbians from being together nor did homophobic violence. And all of the info you gave, disputed not one of the facts I posted. Hell 'Loving vs Virginia' is even addressed in the book. I certaintly didn't post all of that information in opposition to interracial sex/dating/marriage, I posted those facts to show that black women and men have been taking different paths since the Civil Rights movement. A lot of black men want individual freedom which means the power that white men enjoy and black women want freedom for the whole community. 70% of black women say they refuse to date outside of their race and would rather marry down, educationally and financially, than marry outside of their race b/c they feel they have an obligation to the community. So instead of being haste and subjective why don't you re-read my post and/or purchase the book "Race Mixing: Black-White Marriage In Postwar America" by Renee Christine Romano then disagree or agree relevantly. I am not (and feel comfortable stating explicitly) anti-black male nor am I anti-interracial coupling, I am more anti-misinformation and misconception.

So if you and Immortal Logic want to argue me sans ad hominen attacks and superficiality then I am game. But statements like black women are EGOTISTICAL and the condescending irrelevant facts you posted are just farcical. Again my primary point w/ my initial post was that black men and women are increasingly taking different paths. Care to argue me?

"Show me someone or something that has not been scrutinized and I'll show you the wind and even the wind has received its fair share of questions." It's inevitable, if you're here they want to know why- just ask animals, gravity, molecules and/or the moon."

-Babette Thomas

quote:

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Originally posted by IMMORTAL LOGIC:
Well this post and many others I've just read illustrate a point I've been trying to make for sometime now. The majority of African American women DO NOT suffer from lack of self-esteem. Quite to the contrary a good portion have too much of it. Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge.

Prophetess (if that the way you want to play it)you speak of YAH constantly,but in my 31 years on this planet I can't recall a more haughty person than yourself. If your so eager to quote scripture why not read Prov.16:18, Is.2:11,17, Ezek.16:50, Zeph.3:11, Rom.11:20, Is.14:13-15, Dan.5:20-23, mark 7:21,22, luke18:11,12, Hos.7:9,10, Ps.73:6 there are more and I can go on-and on. Haughtiness and highminded people are at the top of the lord YAH's most hated of sins so just why pray tell do you expect to be rewarded for yours. And how do you explain your anti-patriarchal stance when it comes directly from the architect, creator, and sovreign ruler of existence it's self,this I've got to hear.

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

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I gotta say, I agree with this wholeheartedly. What is this garbage about women are the ONLY ones who can save black people? If that isn't an egotistical statement, then I do not know what is. Reading that statement, you would have to believe that black men were given the chance to save his race (by himself, mind you) and failed. If you believe that, then I got a deal on the Brooklyn Bridge for you. I got news for you black women; you can't save us. Here's some more news; black men alone can't save us either. It takes the will of the black family to bring us out of our doldrums. The black family, mother and father, will be the saviour. That isn't anti-women, it isn't pro-male, it is pro-black. No one person can save us. A true leader knows that she doesn't know everything.
Finally, when exactly did men become so materialistic?? That was the worst statement I read in the whole post. Lest we not forget that there are plenty of women out there who willingly show their bodies for money. Music videos are filled with women who get practically naked for the love of dough. Black men have many problems, there is no doubt, but we have enough problems without people making them up. I love my black women, and in conjunction with her black man, our race will be saved.

whip

quote:

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Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

interracial coupling was illegal up until the 'Loving v. Virginia' Supreme court decision in the early 1970. This was the law 'on record' in not just VA, but in most of the South [which has the highest pops of Blk Americans] This law prevented just confirmed Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall from living in the State of VA [Northern VA suburb of DC] because he was interracially married. So the facts you post, should be understood under the law of the land from the beginning of this country up until about 1970. Also, the highest rate of IR marriage involves past and present member of the military [Semper Fi] and is growing rapidly

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The supremes decided Lovings v Virginia in 1967. At that time there were 16 states that still had miscegination laws on the books.

quote:

---

The Lovings appealed to the Supreme Court, which had no trouble concluding that anti-miscegenation laws violated the Equal Protection clause barring race-based discrimination. Besides Virginia, the states with such laws in 1967 were Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas and West Virginia. All were Southern and border states where all sorts of equal rights battles raged in the 1950s and 1960s.

This was not just a Southern issue, however. Between 1952 and 1967 the following 14 states repealed long-standing anti-miscegenation laws: Arizona, California, Colorado, Idaho, Indiana, Maryland, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, North Dakota, Oregon, South Dakota, Utah and Wyoming. All but Indiana and Maryland were Western states where the bans on mixed-race marriage were primarily targeted at Native Americans (and, on the West Coast, Asians) rather than blacks.

---

http://www.elkin.com/race_claims_echo_in_gay_marriage_debate.htm

Illegal, noun: A term used by the descendents of European Immigrants to refer to descendants of Native Americans Plowshares Actions The Nuclear Resister School of the Americas Watch

Cauca, Colombia

quote:

---

Originally posted by ricardomath:

quote:

---

Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

interracial coupling was illegal up until the 'Loving v. Virginia' Supreme court decision in the _early 1970_. This was the law 'on record' in not just VA, but in most of the South [which has the highest pops of Blk Americans] This law prevented just confirmed Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall from living in the State of VA [Northern VA suburb of DC] because he was interracially married. So the facts you post, should be understood under the law of the land from the beginning of this country up until about 1970. Also, the highest rate of IR marriage involves past and present member of the military [Semper Fi] and is growing rapidly

---

The supremes decided Lovings v Virginia in _1967_. At that time there were 16 states that still had miscegination laws on the books.

quote:

---

The Lovings appealed to the Supreme Court, which had no trouble concluding that anti-miscegenation laws violated the Equal Protection clause barring race-based discrimination. Besides _Virginia_, the states with such laws in 1967 were _Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Missouri, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas and West Virginia_. All were Southern and border states where all sorts of equal rights battles raged in the 1950s and 1960s.

This was not just a Southern issue, however. Between 1952 and 1967 the following 14 states repealed long-standing anti-miscegenation laws: Arizona, California, Colorado, Idaho, Indiana, Maryland, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, North Dakota, Oregon, South Dakota, Utah and Wyoming. All but Indiana and Maryland were Western states where the bans on mixed-race marriage were primarily targeted at Native Americans (and, on the West Coast, Asians) rather than blacks.

---

http://www.elkin.com/race_claims_echo_in_gay_marriage_debate.htm

_Illegal_, noun: A term used by the descendents of European Immigrants to refer to descendants of Native Americans http://www.plowsharesactions.org/ http://www.nonviolence.org/nukeresister/ http://www.soaw.org/

_Cauca, Colombia_

---

thanks for the backing, I could not remember the exact year. I think there was a movie or something about it. The topic came up in a college class I was taking a class in which someone mention that they never see old old IR couples...and that's why. Even Justice Marshall had to change his plans due to that 'law'. Thank God it's gone.

***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

quote:

---

Originally posted by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual:
RadioRaheem what are you talking about, babe? Did you read my admission that those facts came from a book chronicling the history of interracial black-white unions since post-WW2? And furthermore there's a very famous black man who has been married to white women since the 1940's. Who? Quincy Jones. And yes interracial marriage was illegal in a lot of states but not in all of the states-that's a big difference. And what is your point about interracial coupling being illegal? Sodomy laws didn't prevent gays and lesbians from being together nor did homophobic violence. And all of the info you gave, disputed not one of the facts I posted. Hell 'Loving vs Virginia' is even addressed in the book. I certaintly didn't post all of that information in opposition to interracial sex/dating/marriage, I posted those facts to show that black women and men have been taking different paths since the Civil Rights movement. A lot of black men want individual freedom which means the power that white men enjoy and black women want freedom for the whole community. 70% of black women say they refuse to date outside of their race and would rather marry down, educationally and financially, than marry outside of their race b/c they feel they have an obligation to the community. So instead of being haste and subjective why don't you re-read my post and/or purchase the book _"Race Mixing: Black-White Marriage In Postwar America" by Renee Christine Romano_ then disagree or agree relevantly. I am not (and feel comfortable stating explicitly) anti-black male nor am I anti-interracial coupling, I am more anti-misinformation and misconception.

So if you and Immortal Logic want to argue me sans ad hominen attacks and superficiality then I am game. But statements like black women are EGOTISTICAL and the condescending irrelevant facts you posted are just farcical. Again my primary point w/ my initial post was that black men and women are increasingly taking different paths. Care to argue me?

"Show me someone or something that has not been scrutinized and I'll show you the wind and even the wind has received its fair share of questions." It's inevitable, if you're here they want to know why- just ask animals, gravity, molecules and/or the moon."

-Babette Thomas

---

the loving decision was the first 'legal' marriage in the Southern states of the USA. The numbers you post MUST include that understanding that before 1967, NO ONE could interracially marry in most of the south [where most Black live]. So...to go from ZERO percent to a small percentage is actually a big big leap!!!

***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

quote:

---

Originally posted by IMMORTAL LOGIC:
Well this post and many others I've just read illustrate a point I've been trying to make for sometime now. The majority of African American women DO NOT suffer from lack of self-esteem. Quite to the contrary a good portion have too much of it. Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge.

Prophetess (if that the way you want to play it)you speak of YAH constantly,but in my 31 years on this planet I can't recall a more haughty person than yourself. If your so eager to quote scripture why not read Prov.16:18, Is.2:11,17, Ezek.16:50, Zeph.3:11, Rom.11:20, Is.14:13-15, Dan.5:20-23, mark 7:21,22, luke18:11,12, Hos.7:9,10, Ps.73:6 there are more and I can go on-and on. Haughtiness and highminded people are at the top of the lord YAH's most hated of sins so just why pray tell do you expect to be rewarded for yours. And how do you explain your anti-patriarchal stance when it comes directly from the architect, creator, and sovreign ruler of existence it's self,this I've got to hear.

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

---

I agree with alot of the 'self praise' things you have said about many Black women, or should I say 'black nubian princesses' or 'divas'. I had tried to debate with many blk women in the past, but they seem to put themselves on a pedestal. I guess that's good and where many of them belong, out of sight, out of mind. Good points bruh Stay up!!

***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

quote:

---

Originally posted by RadioRaheem:

I think there was a movie or something about it.

---

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/6304091192/104-6570184-4499131?v=glance

quote:

---

The topic came up in a college class I was taking a class in which someone mention that they never see old old IR couples...and that's why.

---

Well, we're not exactly young.

Illegal, noun: A term used by the descendents of European Immigrants to refer to descendants of Native Americans Plowshares Actions The Nuclear Resister School of the Americas Watch

Cauca, Colombia

Prophetess, although what you are saying has some truth to it, the way in which you are articulating it appear to me and maybe some of the other readers that you are bashing Black men. I will be the first Black man to join you in bashing Negro men who have abandoned the black family for their backwards pursuit of white women; however your statements do not appear to be limited to these men. There are thousands upon thousands of Black men today and from times past that have fought hard on behalf of Black women and the Black family, so any accusations that the Black man has abandon the Black family would be false.

Secondly if we are too accurately portray the plight of the Black man in America then we must deal with those times in which the Black man was made less than a man and the Black woman was made to be the stronger of the two because a strong Black man was a threat to white power. Black women during these times would raise their daughters to be strong and the fighters and caretakers of the family and Black boys were raised to be passive as a defense mechanism so they would not be killed. With that said I must speak to the idea that Black men are the purveyors of individualism. In a thread about Ward Connerly betrayal of the Black family and Black community and then offering words of condemnation of Black men as equal participants in the destruction of the Black family as Ward Connerly is unfair and inaccurate. There are more than enough Black men that speak in defense and on behalf of Black people and the Black family to make statements like the Black woman is the only one that can save the Black family false and ridiculous.

All of our experiences are different, I converse with many Black women with children and without children and when the discussion of IRR comes up I never hesitate to give my opinion on this subject and I offer them a bit of advice that a Black woman offered in Essence magazine. This sister was speaking about the pool of Black men available to Black women and how many successful Black men are courting, dating and marrying white women and leaving many Black women without a mate or possibly having to marry down as you put it. This sister offered the soundest advice I have heard on this issue, if we do not want the next generation of Black women to suffer the fate many Black women are finding themselves in today, the easiest of solutions is to teach our Black sons to court, date and marry Black women. Plain and simple, there should be no wavering on this. When I mention this to many of the Black women I know who also speak about the problem of Black men courting, dating and marrying white women, they all seem to think something is inherently wrong with teaching our Black sons to marry Black women. They offer many excuses why we should not do this but do not see the correlation between not teaching our Black sons to marry Black women and the growing phenomenon of Black men abandoning the Black family. We have many problems in society and in our community but this problem have a solution but it is thrown out the window. I always say if we don't teach our Black sons to marry Black women this phenomenon will only grow. When we discover our children are smoking, we fly off the handle, when we find out our children are drinking alcohol we fly off the handle but when our sons bring home suzzy we are silently angry. This madness must stop and we must no longer sit quietly by when our children go astray in this area. A lot of us talk the talk about saving the Black family but are unwilling to do the necessary things to help towards this goal.

-------------------------
"We got to organize ourselves, We got to mobilize and there can't be no confusion in our collective solution, If not for ourselves, then for our kids, because we know who our enemy is!"

DPZ "for the hood"

More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem

I have to agree to disagree on this subject, simply for the fact is that interracial relations aren't destroying the black family. Black folks are destroying the black family. We have no one to blame but ourselves.

Why you may ask? Because many of us aren't marrying each other. We're not going extinct or anything because we're reproducing. The PROBLEM is that 70% of black children are born out of wedlock. That's not the fault of interracial dating, that's baby's mama and baby's daddy not marrying each other.

If IRR were the sole problem of the crumbling of the black family, black men and women wouldn't be sleeping with each other, let alone bringing life in the world.

So we need to ask ourselves, why some of us can't walk down the aisle and say "I do," but can stand each other just long enough to get naked and make a baby?

[This message was edited by Huey on October 26, 2003 at 06:43 PM.]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faheem:
This sister offered the soundest advice I have heard on this issue, if we do not want the next generation of Black women to suffer the fate many Black women are finding themselves in today, the easiest of solutions is to teach our Black sons to court, date and marry Black women. Plain and simple, there should be no wavering on this.

**Isn't this a two way street?? Black women are among the hardest women to approach [attitudal issues] and on top of that many blk women refuse to approach men that they desire [sit and wait]. So, in Essence [pardon the pun], they are basing their entire dating lives in the hands of someone else, namely the men that they attract. What's the point of 'teaching' Black boys to court Black women when the Black woman may be her own problem?? Sure a parent can make 'suggestions' to who they would like their son to date, but the final decision is that child's to make. Typically, young people avoid the 'recommendations' of their parent when it comes to their budding love life, just look at thug hungry young Black women...those guys that they are sexing are not the 'top choice' their parents would like. Also, your analysis ignores the fact that Black boys/men get approached by women of other races all day, everyday...at work, the gym, in church, shopping, basically all over the place. How does one 'teach' boys/men to approach, approach, and approach some more, until you find a Black woman that will meet you halfway, when other races of women are right there?? You have a good 'goal' in mind, but it simply needs more thought into it's 'execution'***


When I mention this to many of the Black women I know who also speak about the problem of Black men courting, dating and marrying white women, they all seem to think something is inherently wrong with teaching our Black sons to marry Black women.

**'problem'?? you can't be serious...you are kidding right?? The IR couples I know all are happy...no 'problem' with them. what's your point?? I don't understand.**

They offer many excuses why we should not do this but do not see the correlation between not teaching our Black sons to marry Black women and the growing phenomenon of Black men abandoning the Black family.

**I think that this is another one of your 'unt houghtout' 'assumptions, which ignores alot and says little. What about hte 'I don't need no man for nothing' or 'I can do bad by myself' mindset many Black women have?? Sounds like someone that wants to be left alone. So if a man leaves them, cuz he is not needed, she should be super duper happy...right?? Then there is no problem. If she needs a man around, why does she keep saying that she doesn't?? Makes no sense.


We have many problems in society and in our community but this problem have a solution but it is thrown out the window. I always say if we don't teach our Black sons to marry Black women this phenomenon will only grow. When we discover our children are smoking, we fly off the handle, when we find out our children are drinking alcohol we fly off the handle but when our sons bring home suzzy we are silently angry.

*smoking - causes stunted growth, addiction, and many lung diseases leading to a death

drinking - altered senses, addiction, liver damage, and alcohol poisoning/death

dating/marrying white women - possible life time happiness, possible family union, possible children, stability...all YES, but it is not a health hazard. Nuff said.



This madness must stop and we must no longer sit quietly by when our children go astray in this area. A lot of us talk the talk about saving the Black family but are unwilling to do the necessary things to help towards this goal.

**How is this 'destroying' the Black family?? it seems like a big leap to go from dating freely to possible IR marriage to the death of a community. I dunno, seems like you are one of those people that thinks that thinks that if they say alot, it must mean alot and the law of averages will dictate that eventually something will hit the target. Not in this argument that you are making.

Point blank, IR couples are her to stay. Dating freely is a 'freedom' protected under the first Amendment. That's the law. Your comments are also protected under that same law [BTW, so is the KKK and skinheads, you strangely agree with them on IR marriage, which in and of itself should cause you to pause ] so i'll let them be other than to ask...why put so much deep thought into something that YOU can't change??

God Bless You
-------------------------
"We got to organize ourselves, We got to mobilize and there can't be no confusion in our collective solution, If not for ourselves, then for our kids, because we know who our enemy is!"

DPZ "for the hood"

More to come later!

Your Brother Faheem

---

***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

IMMORTAL LOGIC YOU STATED:"Well this post and many others I've just read illustrate a point I've been trying to make for sometime now. The majority of African American women DO NOT suffer from lack of self-esteem. Quite to the contrary a good portion have too much of it."

MY REPLY: Hey Immortal, you mean "Praise God, the majority of African/America WOMEN do not suffer from a lack of self-esteem in spite of the treachery of the weak-colored boy sell-out faction." Thank God, though scarred, battered, violated in unspeakable ways, we still have our faith in God as our husband. Which leads me to another poster's comments.

RADIORAHEEM YOU STATED:"interracial coupling was illegal up until the 'Loving v. Virginia' Supreme court decision in the _early 1970_. This was the law 'on record' in not just VA, but in most of the South [which has the highest pops of Blk Americans] This law prevented just confirmed Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall from living in the State of VA [Northern VA suburb of DC] because he was interracially married. So the facts you post, should be understood under the law of the land from the beginning of this country up until about 1970. Also, the highest rate of IR marriage involves past and present member of the military [Semper Fi] and is growing rapidly "

MY REPLY: Well actually, it started with FREDRICK DOUGLASS yes, that great orator did marry a WHITE WOMAN.....so in legal times, or illegal times, black men in general have gone after the white girls who advanced them and that's the TRUTH you seem to be agreeing with and that alone, is the POINT that BLACK WOMEN must factor in with regard to our bottom rung world status . Still, RR old buddy, the point WAS NEVER the issue of IR DATING that's not the purpose of this post. For as I said, WHO CARES and I'll add, so WHAT'S YOUR POINT? In fact, I'm all for it, now let's get back to the subject matter. How to stop this colored boy Ward Connelly from stripping black power and letting white males retain 100% rule and power over black women just as they had in segregation.

So AGAIN, I say unto black women, "So come on black women, let's unite, onward and upward for us! See, Our eyes are on the RIGHT PRIZE, freedom, black self-rule, liberation, and all that...the black MATRIARCHY BE BORNE.. Oh, yeah let this FREEDOM ALONE RING!"


BACK TO IMMORTAL'S ILLOGIC:"Still, I'm glad
Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge."

MY REPLY:What should we want? To be violated, denigrated, DISRESPECTED? Oh, you should read little radioraheem's comments. He points out that YOU BLACK MALES HAVE ALWAYS MARRIED WHITE GIRLS and how did you put it, WORSHIPPED AT THEIR ALTARS....yeah, re-read it carefully it will uh, I guess as his comments were designed, comfort you.....


IMMORTAL'S ILLOGIC:"Prophetess (if that the way you want to play it)you speak of YAH constantly,but in my 31 years on this planet I can't recall a more haughty person than yourself. If your so eager to quote scripture why not read Prov.16:18, Is.2:11,17, Ezek.16:50, Zeph.3:11, Rom.11:20, Is.14:13-15, Dan.5:20-23, mark 7:21,22, luke18:11,12, Hos.7:9,10, Ps.73:6 there are more and I can go on-and on. Haughtiness and highminded people are at the top of the lord YAH's most hated of sins so just why pray tell do you expect to be rewarded for yours. And how do you explain your anti-patriarchal stance when it comes directly from the architect, creator, and sovreign ruler of existence it's self,this I've got to hear."

MY REPLY:Yeh,yeh,. tell it to Harriet, Sojourner and the millions of other black women who God has had to used because the male failed.....We want Queendoms where we can be proud of OUR BLACK MEN the few that exist, just like white girls MALES RUN THE WORLD and they are proud of them....oh, I guess they are proud of their BLACK MALES who, how did you put it again? WORSHIP AT THEIR ALTAR....Now, hey I got no problem with that reality, other than to say this to black women......

So AGAIN, I say unto black women, "So come on black women, let's unite, onward and upward for us! See, Our eyes are on the RIGHT PRIZE, freedom, black self-rule, liberation, and all that...the black MATRIARCHY BE BORNE.. Oh, yeah let this FREEDOM ALONE RING!"

Now WHIPWREX YOU STATED: "gotta say, I agree with this wholeheartedly. What is this garbage about women are the ONLY ones who can save black people? If that isn't an egotistical statement, then I do not know what is. Reading that statement, you would have to believe that black men were given the chance to save his race (by himself, mind you) and failed. If you believe that, then I got a deal on the Brooklyn Bridge for you. I got news for you black women; you can't save us. Here's some more news; black men alone can't save us either. It takes the will of the black family to bring us out of our doldrums. The black family, mother and father, will be the saviour. That isn't anti-women, it isn't pro-male, it is pro-black. No one person can save us. A true leader knows that she doesn't know everything.
Finally, when exactly did men become so materialistic?? That was the worst statement I read in the whole post. Lest we not forget that there are plenty of women out there who willingly show their bodies for money. Music videos are filled with women who get practically naked for the love of dough. Black men have many problems, there is no doubt, but we have enough problems without people making them up. I love my black women, and in conjunction with her black man, our race will be saved."

MY REPLY:You should be ashame of yourself if you are a black woman! How dare you come up in here and show sheer ignorance that equals a males. We are the ONLY ones who can control OUR DESTINY for as you've been to blind to see from the responses black males came in here to TAUNT a black woman with regard to what he sees as DEMOCRAT BLACK MAN DOING IT TO, and MISSING THE WHOLE POINT OF THE POSTER'S COMMENTS. Yet again, more proof that such types are still loss, and looking to the floor, CLUELESS and you should not come up in here and show him that you EQUAL HIM.

Besides that, the subject matter of which YOU should have burst in and comment on is HOW TO STOP STUPID COLORED BOY WARD CONNELLY FROM STRIPPING BLACK POWER IN THE FORM OF AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. Again, Shame on you! Fight the racist or colored boy idiots selling blacks out and wreaking havoc, rather than throwing a hissy fit over black women courageous and strong enough to fight for ourselves. Sheeeesh!

FAHEEM:Hi much respect to you as well. I'm not going to answer your comments as I think you simply misunderstood the correspondence. RE-READ carefully, that which I and LFBI wrote, the subject matter is not IR dating, as that's sort of irrelevant, the subject matter is HOW TO STOP THAT STUPID COLORED IDIOT WARD CONNELLY FROM GIVING WHITE MALES THE SAME 100% POWER THEY HAD IN SEGREGATION.

Oh, one more thing, Hiiiiiii MBM, great answer, you're ever the warrior. I'd like to Thank your mother and wife for the fine job they did. I'm so proud of the SONS OF THE AFRICAN MOTHERS no matter what their circumstances. It's all about black exaltation.

Now, now back to SUBJECT MATTER ALL!

Oh, Hi Ricardomath, your wife is beautiful, I've never seen a GOOD MAN so proud to WORSHIP AT THE ALTAR OF A BEAUTIFUL NUBIAN GODDESS....

quote:

---

Originally posted by Prophetessofrage:
IMMORTAL LOGIC YOU STATED:"Well this post and many others I've just read illustrate a point I've been trying to make for sometime now. The majority of African American women DO NOT suffer from lack of self-esteem. Quite to the contrary a good portion have too much of it."

MY REPLY: Hey Immortal, you mean "Praise God, the majority of African/America WOMEN do not suffer from a lack of self-esteem in spite of the treachery of the weak-colored boy sell-out faction." Thank God, though scarred, battered, violated in unspeakable ways, we still have our faith in God as our husband. Which leads me to another poster's comments.

RADIORAHEEM YOU STATED:"interracial coupling was illegal up until the 'Loving v. Virginia' Supreme court decision in the _early 1970_. This was the law 'on record' in not just VA, but in most of the South [which has the highest pops of Blk Americans] This law prevented just confirmed Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall from living in the State of VA [Northern VA suburb of DC] because he was interracially married. So the facts you post, should be understood under the law of the land from the beginning of this country up until about 1970. Also, the highest rate of IR marriage involves past and present member of the military [Semper Fi] and is growing rapidly "

MY REPLY: Well actually, it started with FREDRICK DOUGLASS yes, that great orator did marry a WHITE WOMAN.....so in legal times, or illegal times, black men in general have gone after the white girls who advanced them and that's the TRUTH you seem to be agreeing with and that alone, is the POINT that BLACK WOMEN must factor in with regard to our bottom rung world status . Still, RR old buddy, the point WAS NEVER the issue of IR DATING that's not the purpose of this post. For as I said, WHO CARES and I'll add, so WHAT'S YOUR POINT? In fact, I'm all for it, now let's get back to the subject matter. How to stop this colored boy Ward Connelly from stripping black power and letting white males retain 100% rule and power over black women just as they had in segregation.

So AGAIN, I say unto black women, "So come on black women, let's unite, onward and upward for us! See, Our eyes are on the RIGHT PRIZE, freedom, black self-rule, liberation, and all that...the black MATRIARCHY BE BORNE.. Oh, yeah let this FREEDOM ALONE RING!"


BACK TO IMMORTAL'S ILLOGIC:"Still, I'm glad
Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge."

MY REPLY:What should we want? To be violated, denigrated, DISRESPECTED? Oh, you should read little radioraheem's comments. He points out that YOU BLACK MALES HAVE ALWAYS MARRIED WHITE GIRLS and how did you put it, WORSHIPPED AT THEIR ALTARS....yeah, re-read it carefully it will uh, I guess as his comments were designed, comfort you.....


IMMORTAL'S ILLOGIC:"Prophetess (if that the way you want to play it)you speak of YAH constantly,but in my 31 years on this planet I can't recall a more haughty person than yourself. If your so eager to quote scripture why not read Prov.16:18, Is.2:11,17, Ezek.16:50, Zeph.3:11, Rom.11:20, Is.14:13-15, Dan.5:20-23, mark 7:21,22, luke18:11,12, Hos.7:9,10, Ps.73:6 there are more and I can go on-and on. Haughtiness and highminded people are at the top of the lord YAH's most hated of sins so just why pray tell do you expect to be rewarded for yours. And how do you explain your anti-patriarchal stance when it comes directly from the architect, creator, and sovreign ruler of existence it's self,this I've got to hear."

MY REPLY:Yeh,yeh,. tell it to Harriet, Sojourner and the millions of other black women who God has had to used because the male failed.....We want Queendoms where we can be proud of OUR BLACK MEN the few that exist, just like white girls MALES RUN THE WORLD and they are proud of them....oh, I guess they are proud of their BLACK MALES who, how did you put it again? WORSHIP AT THEIR ALTAR....Now, hey I got no problem with that reality, other than to say this to black women......

So AGAIN, I say unto black women, "So come on black women, let's unite, onward and upward for us! See, Our eyes are on the RIGHT PRIZE, freedom, black self-rule, liberation, and all that...the black MATRIARCHY BE BORNE.. Oh, yeah let this FREEDOM ALONE RING!"

Now WHIPWREX YOU STATED: "gotta say, I agree with this wholeheartedly. What is this garbage about women are the ONLY ones who can save black people? If that isn't an egotistical statement, then I do not know what is. Reading that statement, you would have to believe that black men were given the chance to save his race (by himself, mind you) and failed. If you believe that, then I got a deal on the Brooklyn Bridge for you. I got news for you black women; you can't save us. Here's some more news; black men alone can't save us either. It takes the will of the black family to bring us out of our doldrums. The black family, mother and father, will be the saviour. That isn't anti-women, it isn't pro-male, it is pro-black. No one person can save us. A true leader knows that she doesn't know everything.
Finally, when exactly did men become so materialistic?? That was the worst statement I read in the whole post. Lest we not forget that there are plenty of women out there who willingly show their bodies for money. Music videos are filled with women who get practically naked for the love of dough. Black men have many problems, there is no doubt, but we have enough problems without people making them up. I love my black women, and in conjunction with her black man, our race will be saved."

MY REPLY:You should be ashame of yourself if you are a black woman! How dare you come up in here and show sheer ignorance that equals a males. We are the ONLY ones who can control OUR DESTINY for as you've been to blind to see from the responses black males came in here to TAUNT a black woman with regard to what he sees as DEMOCRAT BLACK MAN DOING IT TO, and MISSING THE WHOLE POINT OF THE POSTER'S COMMENTS. Yet again, more proof that such types are still loss, and looking to the floor, CLUELESS and you should not come up in here and show him that you EQUAL HIM.

Besides that, the subject matter of which YOU should have burst in and comment on is HOW TO STOP STUPID COLORED BOY WARD CONNELLY FROM STRIPPING BLACK POWER IN THE FORM OF AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. Again, Shame on you! Fight the racist or colored boy idiots selling blacks out and wreaking havoc, rather than throwing a hissy fit over black women courageous and strong enough to fight for ourselves. Sheeeesh!

FAHEEM:Hi much respect to you as well. I'm not going to answer your comments as I think you simply misunderstood the correspondence. RE-READ carefully, that which I and LFBI wrote, the subject matter is not IR dating, as that's sort of irrelevant, the subject matter is HOW TO STOP THAT STUPID COLORED IDIOT WARD CONNELLY FROM GIVING WHITE MALES THE SAME 100% POWER THEY HAD IN SEGREGATION.

Oh, one more thing, Hiiiiiii MBM, great answer, you're ever the warrior. I'd like to Thank your mother and wife for the fine job they did. I'm so proud of the SONS OF THE AFRICAN MOTHERS no matter what their circumstances. It's all about black exaltation.

Now, now back to SUBJECT MATTER ALL!

Oh, Hi Ricardomath, your wife is beautiful, I've never seen a GOOD MAN so proud to WORSHIP AT THE ALTAR OF A BEAUTIFUL NUBIAN GODDESS....

---

What in the hell are you talking about? Ashamed of myself, for what? Just to clear something up, I am a black male. I read this topic unsure if I was allowed to respond because this spot was for the sistas. Since I am still relatively new to this forum, I looked to see if other men posted. Once I saw some testosterone in this topic, I decided to respond. With that said, why would wanting the black family to succeed by something to be ashamed of? Why would wanting to remind you sistas that you are not in it alone, be blasphemy? Why would letting you know that as a family we can succeed be wrong? Do yourself a favor; be proud of being a black woman, but not at the expense of your male counterpart. We are as important to the re-emergence of black people as you are.
After reading my post again, there is nothing offensive in it. No matter what the sex of the poster. Let me be blunt for you...You aren't saving us, you can't do it alone. If anyone has lost faith in black men, that is fine. Deciding to take the burden of saving the entire black race on your shoulders is arrogant. More important it goes back to the ego, that was mentioned in a previous post.

whip

quote:

---

Originally posted by Prophetessofrage:
RADIORAHEEM YOU STATED:"interracial coupling was illegal up until the 'Loving v. Virginia' Supreme court decision in the _early 1970_. This was the law 'on record' in not just VA, but in most of the South [which has the highest pops of Blk Americans] This law prevented just confirmed Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall from living in the State of VA [Northern VA suburb of DC] because he was interracially married. So the facts you post, should be understood under the law of the land from the beginning of this country up until about 1970. Also, the highest rate of IR marriage involves past and present member of the military [Semper Fi] and is growing rapidly "

MY REPLY: Well actually, it started with FREDRICK DOUGLASS yes, that great orator did marry a WHITE WOMAN.....so in legal times, or illegal times, black men in general have gone after the white girls who advanced them and that's the TRUTH you seem to be agreeing with and that alone, is the POINT that BLACK WOMEN must factor in with regard to our bottom rung world status . Still, RR old buddy, the point WAS NEVER the issue of IR DATING that's not the purpose of this post. For as I said, WHO CARES and I'll add, so WHAT'S YOUR POINT? In fact, I'm all for it, now let's get back to the subject matter. How to stop this colored boy Ward Connelly from stripping black power and letting white males retain 100% rule and power over black women just as they had in segregation.

**you missed the point. The original point I was trying to make was to give the 'correct' context to the percentages posted in the post I was quoting. The numbers maybe be low due to the fact that the practice of IR marriage was illegal...and it didn't even matter if you are a Supreme Court justice!!!***
as for the 'getting back to the topic, you MUST direct those comments to LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual, who changed the subject in the first place.

---

***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

Thank you whiprex for being honest enough to identify your MALE gender. You know I've come up against so-called christians who haven't been so TRUTHFUL as you. All I can say to your gender acknowledgment is, whew! What a relief!!!

Oh one more thing, please STOP disrespecting us black women who you want to WORK BESIDE by CURSING DISRESPECTFULLY AT US.....THAAANKS!!

Even though I know that the battle consists of the African mother and her sons and daughters fighting the African father and his sons and daughters, I still hate to see a black woman so mixed up and subservient at such a kind's warped, treacherous mentality. So again, thanks for your truthfulness even though, by reason the truthful disposition I just stated, I could not possibly agree with your assessment that 'black women are trying to save the race on our own.' We recognize we have righteous sons, always have and neither of our comments meant to infer any differently.

Little RR, LFBI was not changing the subject she was expounding on the DEEP MATTERS about the subject that we black women have to deal with whereas your comments were, well, your comments.

Albeit, I found it quite USEful information. Thanks for sharing. Now see, you just quit all that little old hostility....you little radio person.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Prophetessofrage:
Thank you whiprex for being honest enough to identify your MALE gender. You know I've come up against so-called christians who haven't been so TRUTHFUL as you. All I can say to your gender acknowledgment is, whew! What a relief!!!

Oh one more thing, please STOP disrespecting us black women who you want to WORK BESIDE by CURSING DISRESPECTFULLY AT US.....THAAANKS!!

Even though I know that the battle consists of the African mother and her sons and daughters fighting the African father and his sons and daughters, I still hate to see a black woman so mixed up and subservient at such a kind's warped, treacherous mentality. So again, thanks for your truthfulness even though, by reason the truthful disposition I just stated, I could not possibly agree with your assessment that 'black women are trying to save the race on our own.' We recognize we have righteous sons, always have and neither of our comments meant to infer any differently.

Little RR, LFBI was not changing the subject she was expounding on the DEEP MATTERS about the subject that we black women have to deal with whereas your comments were, well, your comments.

Albeit, I found it quite USEful information. Thanks for sharing. Now see, you just quit all that little old hostility....you little radio person.

---

I guess it must some general rule for a message board, if you run outta stuff to say or are proven wrong, make fun of someone's screen name. RadioRaheem is a character in a Spike Lee movie. The quote I was speaking to posted by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual, had nothing to do with the topic at hand. I was giving the Historical context related to the modern history. If you don't agree with me, fine...let's debate, if you got more tacky screen name comments, try to keep them to yourself.

***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

quote:

---

Originally posted by MBM:

quote:

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Originally posted by IMMORTAL LOGIC:

Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge.

---

Respectfully . . .


_There is no passion to be found playing small, in settling for a life
that is less than the one you are capable of living. - Mandela_

---

LOL! You mean with all the rhetoric about "the black mongrel male" that's been posted since last time I visited, this is what you call "b.s" okay m.b.m whatever.

Let me go further. The classic traits of a narcissist are:

*Dreams of granduer and in constant pursuit of power and influence.

*Expects and demands special treatment.

*Self centered.

*Constantly seeking and/or demanding praise and attention.

*Exaggerate their own acheivements, while dismissing the acheivements of others.

*Expects to be acknowleged and thought of as superior.

*Reacts with bitterness and intense anger when met with any criticism.

*Beleives it is the duty of others to provide their wants and needs.
And because of all this a narcissist has problems maintaining long lasting relationships. Fam. if you don't see all these traits in the community, and in this room you've got to be going out of your way not to see it. If it walks like a duck, looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck IT'S A DUCK!

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

quote:

---

Originally posted by whipwrex:

quote:

---

Originally posted by IMMORTAL LOGIC:
Well this post and many others I've just read illustrate a point I've been trying to make for sometime now. The majority of African American women DO NOT suffer from lack of self-esteem. Quite to the contrary a good portion have too much of it. Their ego's seem to know no bounds. and there no limit to the the amount of praise they expect and demand. It comes close to blasphemy if not that at times. From what I hear almost daily It's as if they've all but built alters to themselves and get upset when noone comes to worship, and there mandates fall on deaf ears. They must endure the gall the indignaty of having bros. continually go on with our lives even after they've clearly told us they're in charge.

Prophetess (if that the way you want to play it)you speak of YAH constantly,but in my 31 years on this planet I can't recall a more haughty person than yourself. If your so eager to quote scripture why not read Prov.16:18, Is.2:11,17, Ezek.16:50, Zeph.3:11, Rom.11:20, Is.14:13-15, Dan.5:20-23, mark 7:21,22, luke18:11,12, Hos.7:9,10, Ps.73:6 there are more and I can go on-and on. Haughtiness and highminded people are at the top of the lord YAH's most hated of sins so just why pray tell do you expect to be rewarded for yours. And how do you explain your anti-patriarchal stance when it comes directly from the architect, creator, and sovreign ruler of existence it's self,this I've got to hear.

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

---

I gotta say, I agree with this wholeheartedly. What is this garbage about women are the ONLY ones who can save black people? If that isn't an egotistical statement, then I do not know what is. Reading that statement, you would have to believe that black men were given the chance to save his race (by himself, mind you) and failed. If you believe that, then I got a deal on the Brooklyn Bridge for you. I got news for you black women; you can't save us. Here's some more news; black men alone can't save us either. It takes the will of the black family to bring us out of our doldrums. The black family, mother and father, will be the saviour. That isn't anti-women, it isn't pro-male, it is pro-black. No one person can save us. A true leader knows that she doesn't know everything.
Finally, when exactly did men become so materialistic?? That was the worst statement I read in the whole post. Lest we not forget that there are plenty of women out there who willingly show their bodies for money. Music videos are filled with women who get practically naked for the love of dough. Black men have many problems, there is no doubt, but we have enough problems without people making them up. I love my black women, and in conjunction with her black man, our race will be saved.

whip

---

YO Whip! You see what I'm saying right! Thank you! Sure there's going to be disagreements BUT DAMN!! It seems there's no room for common ground,reason,logic, whatever. It's so sad out here now it's funny, you hear the wildest things around the way now. I'm hearing stuff like "The black women existed thousands upon thousands of years before the genetic mutation called the black man came about." If you ask something as simple "how did they reproduce?" yelling,screaming and neckrolling ensues, but no real answers."God, Jesus and all the prophets of the bible from Noah on down were women, but when white men got a hold of it they changed them all to men, and black men are to brainwashed to change it back to it's true form" ask them to meet the burden of truth, or even the source of information, no answers just yelling and screaming about "You ain't no real man." And let's not forget prophetess little "God is half man/half woman" rant on which we are still waiting for an answer.

It's like that story about the emperors new clothe. They only seek the council or want to hear the words of people who tell them exactly what they want to hear. Plus everything you do is always wrong. ANYTHING you say can and will be taken as an attack or a bash,but if you don't say anything then you ignoring them and their issues plights and concerns. Any correct decision they make shows and proves, beyond the shadow of a a doubt that they should be in command. But any wrong decision they make,could only be the result of something that some brotha somewhere did to them, causing the mistake, thus proving that they should be in command. If we zig we're wrong if we zag we're wrong if we' stand perfectly still we're wrong. I was on the net the other day, and sistas were trippin' on bros. about the way mormons in Utah treat there women! What...IN THE HELL does some mormon in utah have to do with us. Anything any bro. does means we all did it, because we're all one person but being that we're men period also means anything any man does to any women anywhere is also our fault ensuring there'll always be some gripe or issue to complain about.

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

Since I made the comment about black women being the ones to save the black race and black world, let me elaborate.
First of all before every learned behaviour begins at home with the parents guidance. Anything the parent(s) put into the child is going to come to the surface. Even if there are two parents in a home, the primary caregiver is usually the mother. Now having said that, the mother is the person who instills the child's value system. This is especially true in the single parent household. So therefore, all I'm saying is mothers set the best example of black parenthood and black leadership that you can.
Unfortunately also, so many black men are in prison and are simply unavailable. Some of the ones who are not in jail seem to be quite indifferent to building up the black community.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but these are valid points in my opinion.

Our people have made the mistake of confusing the methods with the objectives. As long as we agree on objectives, we should never fall out with each other just because we believe in different methods, or tactics, or strategy. We have to keep in mind at all times that we are not fighting for separation. We are fighting for recognition as free humans in this society
Malcolm X, 1965

YSYSS QUOTE:"

quote:

---

Originally posted by Yssys:
Since I made the comment about black women being the ones to save the black race and black world, let me elaborate.
First of all before every learned behaviour begins at home with the parents guidance. Anything the parent(s) put into the child is going to come to the surface. Even if there are two parents in a home, the primary caregiver is usually the mother. Now having said that, the mother is the person who instills the child's value system. This is especially true in the single parent household. So therefore, all I'm saying is mothers set the best example of black parenthood and black leadership that you can.
Unfortunately also, so many black men are in prison and are simply unavailable. Some of the ones who are not in jail seem to be quite indifferent to building up the black community.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but these are valid points in my opinion."

---

MY REPLY:Hi Ysyss, yes you are right the mothers have there responsibility but as the facts IFBI brought out, black males 60% are accountable for their own actions and do go against the mother's training. We both know this is common place.

As for leader and savior, yeah, well God uses whom he uses and since we black women have been the victim of sexism and racism, it is to we Black women whom God has chosen to be the deliverer of our own well-being. Now, of course, there are our righteous sons, they fight for the same deliverance for our collective being but they fight 'beside' us, not before nor behind but beside.

Anyway, you are right, as black women are awakening we must instill a warrior spirit in sons and daughters. We must reach the lost masses of black young women and teach them to respect themselves. Call for celibacy, and train them to love themselves and their children. In other words, we've got work to do as we fight this two fold enemy. The racist white slime, without and colored boy retards who are selling us out to them.

RADIORAHEEM, I wasn't meaning to be offensive in making fun of your name.

Here's what you black males can start doing. Start respecting black women. Don't speak disrespectfully around them. Begin to have black man meetings on cleaning up the neighborhod and getting your acts together and young black women will be drawn to such real manhood and such real manhood will understand that.

Immortal it's okay to call the bad beings names as their very disposition is a 'bad name' being hurled at righteous black people.

As for the other, I won't debate truth. I'm here to post truth and ways to utilize it to break the evil. This is where you all are missing it. For instance, this ongoing topic. The comments made by IFBI, Ysyss and myself have to do with what is, not DEBATING ABOUT WHAT IS....I geniunely hope you understand that...okay, peace out....

quote:

---

Originally posted by Huey:
I have to agree to disagree on this subject, simply for the fact is that interracial relations aren't destroying the black family. Black folks are destroying the black family. We have no one to blame but ourselves.

Why you may ask? Because many of us aren't marrying each other. We're not going extinct or anything because we're reproducing. The PROBLEM is that 70% of black children are born out of wedlock. That's not the fault of interracial dating, that's baby's mama and baby's daddy not marrying each other.

If IRR were the sole problem of the crumbling of the black family, black men and women wouldn't be sleeping with each other, let alone bringing life in the world.

So we need to ask ourselves, why some of us can't walk down the aisle and say "I do," but can stand each other just long enough to get naked and make a baby?

[This message was edited by Huey on October 26, 2003 at 06:43 PM.]

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Hi Huey, I just came across your comments. Yes I agree with you, the problem isn't IR dating. I don't think that is what any of us women in the original discourse was saying. What we were saying was how do we factor this in to our well-being. The fact is, we chart our own course and take chare of our bottom rung status. We black women are the ones who have beheld the madness and the discussion around it isn't to blame or anything as it's over as far as the old, 'why, why, why?' questions used to go.

It's now about the answers. The answer is to get our own act together. We will shape our image henceforth. A part of that is to get the attention of the black young girls out there. Get them to halt the promiscuity, and have self-love which will automatically alleviate the out-of-wedlock, love/yearn/child syndrome. That's what the 70% out of wedlock births are all about.

Black girls have been brutalized by the racist structure, bottom rung status. It affects them and that's where the 'I do not feel love, 'a baby will love them' syndrome comes from.

As for the young men, they too are deprived and sorely afflicted. We need those old 'lunch program' things the old Black Panthers used to have. You know where they fed the kids, with literal and spiritual food. Black young men, need to start doing 'rap sessions.' And rap about their failings, desires, dreams and ways to enact them. Starting with 'respect black women' and black women will come around.

Get jobs, get educated, but since all things start with a single step, just hearing what the black woman is saying, without judging it, just hear it, 'I see your point,' I'll stop it, and check my brother and get him to stop with the disrespectful talk. You'd be surprise how a little TLC on black young girls will help in aiding their broken spirits.

can't we all just get along??

will the war in Iraq end soon?? If not, can we draft GW Bush to be the field general for the war he started?? Speaking of Bush, why is his wife so ugly??


anyone else notice the 'free gay personals' ad at the bottom of this message board?? what's that all about??


The lakers don't seem to play too well with Kobe, I think they'll bench him


Man, it's hot in herre, i'll exit stage left


***********************************************************
'Sometimes life is obscene' - Black Crowes


Commerical Hall of Fame - All time list


'Who in the hell left the gate open???'

'Somebody put roots on me'

'I've fallen, and I can't give up!!!'

Apology to Prophetessofrage for being the catalyst that took your discussion off-topic. I was only responding to Yssys' views. Again my fault/bad.

"Show me someone or something that has not been scrutinized and I'll show you the wind and even the wind has received its fair share of questions." It's inevitable, if you're here they want to know why- just ask animals, gravity, molecules and/or the moon."

-Babette Thomas

Hey Foxy, your post was great, the male will be the male, and so reveal to black women the importance of uniting, and establishing a matriarchy to fight for our well-being, because if we don't lift ourselves up, who will? These clueless ones? Not hardly....

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Prophetessofrage:

p.o.r: Hey Immortal, you mean "Praise God, the majority of African/America WOMEN do not suffer from a lack of self-esteem in spite of the treachery of the weak-colored boy sell-out faction." Thank God, though scarred, battered, violated in unspeakable ways, we still have our faith in God as our husband.

#1 So now that we are in agreement that there is no self esteem issues, does that mean it can finally be put to rest as an excuse for wrong decisions made.

#2You would'nt have to put up with treachery and whatever if more of an emphasis was put on character as opposed to content. Choosing a mate based on money or material goods, neighborhood reps etc. as oppossed to character is an irresponsable decision, and when you make irreasponsable decisions in men you get a irreasponsable man who does irreasponsable things. It's not rocket science. If someone is selling poison to there community just so they can have a few dollars, do we really have to sit these women down and explain to them that this is'nt going to be the most honorable of men, and don't expect a lot of integrity from him, I would wager that alot of these women know that already,but "no money no panties" right .

#3God is your husband?!?! Questions within a question:1) if god is both man and women as you keep babbling about why give him a gender specific title like "husband"? 2) How did you come to the conclusion you were married to YAH did he propose to you p.o.r ? I read where he referred to himself as a father but... 3)being that your supposed to be "captain matrarchy" who would be head of this union, you or YAH?

(p.o.r)So AGAIN, I say unto black women, "So come on black women, let's unite, onward and upward for us! See, Our eyes are on the RIGHT PRIZE, freedom, black self-rule, liberation, and all that...the black MATRIARCHY BE BORNE.. Oh, yeah let this FREEDOM ALONE RING!"

"I say unto"?!?! oh boy,your messiah complex is getting worse. You speak of freedom oh great liberator what freedoms will you provide that are'nt already available? And just exactly are you going to bring about this matriarchy,plese do explain.

(p.o.r):What should we want? To be violated, denigrated, DISRESPECTED?

Again better decisions better mates. It's not some high wisdom or lost knowledge

(p.o.r):Yeh,yeh,. tell it to Harriet, Sojourner and the millions of other black women who God has had to used because the male failed.....We want Queendoms where we can be proud of OUR BLACK MEN the few that exist, just like white girls MALES RUN THE WORLD and they are proud of them....oh, I guess they are proud of their BLACK MALES who, how did you put it again? WORSHIP AT THEIR ALTAR....Now, hey I got no problem with that reality, other than to say this to black women......

I don't have to tell it to harriet and sojourner, there ego's were'nt out of control they did'nt sit there all day with huge bragging mouths take credit for others work's,that's you.And what have you ever done to put yourself in such lofty company,you just sit and talk about the achievements of others and I'd wager you've actually done nothing for no one, you think the"black momngrel male/colored boy" needs to be eradicated in africa? GO DO IT. Like I said one of the characteristics of a narcissist is to exaggerate one's accomplishments whole trying to diminish all others,tsk tsk. Two great sistas,no dobt but you make it sound like they and "the millions others" did everything by themselves. A lot of good men died so you could sit here and try to diminish their contributions and legacy's I would 've thought that was too low even for you ,but being that you just did it... I guess not.

And by the way you never answered my questions:

#1 You put a lot of words in YAH almighty's mouth but never showed us were he said the women is the head of the house show us what passage,bring this truth your always talking about light.

#2 Just why do you think your to be rewarded by the soveregin ruler of existence, for possessing the trait(haughtiness)that he hates above all others. And for that matter, ignoring HIS mandates and saying things in his name that were NOT said. Entire nations have been destroyed and angels cast from heaven for doing just that, so why oh why "prophetss" are you to be rewarded. Do tell.

You say your not here to debate, well neither am I, but to discuss in a calm, adult(that means without having to result to childlike antics like name callng),non-rambling manner (non of which you seem able to do). You come to a DISCUSSION board but nothing you ever profess is up for discussion. Why can't you ever meet the burden of proof? Why can't you ever provide a source of information? Why do you never even attempt to? The truth can stand up to any amount questions can't it? I think you dont because you can't, plain and simple. Just someone sitting and rambling over a computer screen making it up as she goes along...how sad.

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

(p.o.r) black males 60% are accountable for their own actions and do go against the mother's training. .

Agreed, I'll do you one better I'll say 90% responsable if not more so. What you try to glance over and never factor in is the same is true for blackgirls, I hardly think mom's telling them to date thugs, hustlaz, pimps, gangstas etc.

(p.o.r)As for leader and savior, yeah, well God uses whom he uses and since we black women have been the victim of sexism and racism, it is to we Black women whom God has chosen to be the deliverer of our own well-being. .

YAH has chosen you to be leader and savior?!?! I thought HE was leader and YAHSHUA was savior when did he switch that up, ooohhh wait I forgot your gods fiancee okay now I'm found... still tough break for YAHSHUA. And your right your well-being is in your hands women need to stop looking for men to MAKE them happy and MAKE content and GIVE them self-esteem we can't do it not now not ever we can only share what we have and hope you can reciprocate. Your absolutely right these are things YOU have obtain on your own. After all,they're mindsets not things. The kingdom of heaven is inside you after all.

(p.o.r)Anyway, you are right, as black women are awakening we must instill a warrior spirit in sons and daughters. We must reach the lost masses of black young women and teach them to respect themselves. Call for celibacy, and train them to love themselves and their children. In other words, we've got work to do as we fight this two fold enemy. The racist white slime, without and colored boy retards who are selling us out to them.

Agreed, but why are the blackgirls just lost and the yong men colored boy retards why are'nt they both either lost or "retards".


(p.o.r)Here's what you black males can start doing. Start respecting black women. Don't speak disrespectfully around them.

Man even when your trying to be polite your condecending, you sound like one of those old republican racist your always ranting about talking about "I don't hate neggras I just want them to stop making cack babies and leechin' of the gov'ment is all" That's not something black men can do that's something SOME black people can do respect and disrespect is a 2 way street. We're not the only ones known for speaking disrespectfully.

(p.o.r)Begin to have black man meetings on cleaning up the neighborhod and getting your acts together
Okay, here's the problems with this statement:

1)you just showed that with the exception of your pops and your gay friend you don't know a lot of brothas, if any for that matter. If you had you'd know there are lots of grassroots based organizations devoted to just that, and they're not hard to find, every city I visit I check one if not several, if you can't find one you have'nt looked(which I suspect strongly is the case).

2) The majority of black men already have our acts together,we do't need you to validate us.

3)there're women who can get there acts together as well.

4)If your the backbone of the community and rightful head of the black family why are you constantly looking to us to fix all that's wrong that's a job for the "leader" is'nt it. A patriarch is a man who guides, guards governs, and provides for thus entitled to a certain level of respect and honor. You keep saying the women should be head of the family,so this wold be your domain would'nt it. If you want to be the head then you have to except all the responablities thereof right. You can't pick and choose . It' appears you want all the honor and respect but none of the work and responsabilities oh great liberator.

(p.o.r)and young black women will be drawn to such real manhood and such real manhood will understand that.
If you did know some brothas they'd tell you more often than not this is NOT the case.


(p.o.r)Immortal it's okay to call the bad beings names as their very disposition is a 'bad name' being hurled at righteous black people.

No gods fiancee/the new messiah it's not, in the bible there' a story, about satan trying to re-animate the body of moses so he could enter it and deceive Israel, YAH sent Michael to retrieve the the remains from satan. So there they are satan vs. Michael in a face-off does not call satan a name even once, the story was being used as an example,if there was ever a time to call someone a name and if there was ever someone who deserved to be called a name that was the time and place but michael refrained because the lord YAH says so. As I think back I called you a nut once so I guess i owe you an apology for that, other than that...

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Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

[This message was edited by IMMORTAL LOGIC on October 30, 2003 at 02:46 PM.]

Immortal listen and understand, the reason I won't ARGUE, DEBATE with you is because there is no reason to DEBATE TRUTH.

You have shown me that 'you have eyes but you do not see, you have ears but you do not hear' so why would I want to debate you when you are hostile to truth?

For instance, the things you quote show me that you don't understand as so, I'd rather talk to someone who does understand.

Listen, just follow the conversation of LFBI, YSSYS AND MYSELF. You see we are not DEBATING the TRUTH just expounding on it. That's called COMMON SENSE. Look at ALL the post YSSYS put up, they are TRUTH she is putting down FACTS now It would be absurd to debate a FACT, REALITY all I, she, and all the women on the board do is EXPOUND ON THE TRUTH, PRAISING THE GOOD TRUTH WHILE SPEAKING ON WAYS TO ALLEVIATE THE NEGATIVE TRUTH. Whereas YOU, are ANGRY AT THE TRUTH and recklessly fighting the TRUTH instead of embracing and exalting it.

This is what you are blinded to, and such a mindset can hardly be reasoned with. Try, try hard to understand that.

[This message was edited by Prophetessofrage on October 31, 2003 at 01:33 PM.]

quote:

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Originally posted by Prophetessofrage:
Immortal listen and understand, the reason I won't ARGUE, DEBATE with you is because there is no reason to DEBATE TRUTH.

You have shown me that 'you have eyes but you do not see, you have ears but you do not hear' so why would I want to debate you when you are hostile to truth?

For instance, the things you quote show me that you don't understand as so, I'd rather talk to someone who does understand.

Listen, just follow the conversation of LFBI, YSSYS AND MYSELF. You see we are not DEBATING the TRUTH just expounding on it. That's called COMMON SENSE. Look at ALL the post YSSYS put up, they are TRUTH she is putting down FACTS now It would be absurd to debate a FACT, REALITY all I, she, and all the women on the board do is EXPOUND ON THE TRUTH, PRAISING THE GOOD TRUTH WHILE SPEAKING ON WAYS TO ALLEVIATE THE NEGATIVE TRUTH. Whereas YOU, are ANGRY AT THE TRUTH and recklessly fighting the TRUTH instead of embracing and exalting it.

This is what you are blinded to, and such a mindset can hardly be reasoned with. Try, try hard to understand that.

[This message was edited by Prophetessofrage on October 31, 2003 at 01:33 PM.]

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I'm angry at the truth because I asked you to provide sources of info or meet the burden of proof?!?! If I was angry at the truth would'nt I ask or demand that you NOT back it up, insisting that you change the subject so that you can't provide facts. All I've ever asked is that you back up what you claims,or provide references so I, or anyone else can check for for ourselves, and you still provide nothing. I see a lot of OPINIONS that people wish were facts but no actual facts. You say you don't want to argue...that's cool but you don't want to discuss or provide actual info, justname calling and long winded rants you want everyone to take at face value...well p.o.r only fools don't question what they're told.

******************************
Then I heard another voice say:"come out of her,my people,so that you will not share her sins,so that you will not receive her plagues, for her sins have piled up to heaven and YAH has remembered her crimes,give her back as much as she has given;pay her back double what she has done. Mix her a double portion from her own cup. Give her as much torture and grief as the glory and luxury she gave herself."(Revelations 18:4-7)

quote:

---

Originally posted by LilFoxyBrwnIntellectual:
Apology to Prophetessofrage for being the catalyst that took your discussion off-topic. I was only responding to Yssys' views. Again my fault/bad.

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Are you kidding, you made her day. Taking the topic where it went was exactly what she wanted - a chance to bash the black male.

As you feeling so egoistical the following is something you women can add to your CV's. By the way let us know how far this ego trip would take you?

As I grow in age, I value women who are over 40 most of all. Here
are just a few reasons why:

A woman over 40 will never wake you in the middle of the night to
ask, What are you thinking?" She doesn't care what you think.

If a woman over 40 doesn't want to watch the game, she doesn't sit
around whining about it. She does something she wants to do. And
it's usually something more interesting.

A woman over 40 knows herself well enough to be assured in who she
is,what she is, what she wants and from whom. Few women past the
age of 40 give a damn what you might think about her or what she's
doing.

Women over 40 are dignified. They seldom have a screaming match
with you at the opera or in the middle of an expensive restaurant.
Of course, if you deserve it, they won't hesitate to shoot you if
they think they can get away with it...

Older women are generous with praise, often undeserved. They know what it's like to be unappreciated.

Women get psychic as they age. You never have to confess your sins to a woman over 40. They always know.

A woman over 40 looks good wearing bright red lipstick. This is not true of younger women or drag queens.

Once you get past a wrinkle or two, a woman over 40 is far sexier than her younger counterpart.

Older women are forthright and honest. They'll tell you right off you are a jerk if you are acting like one. You don't ever have to
wonder where you stand with her....

Yes, we praise women over 40 for a multitude of reasons. Unfortunately, it's not always reciprocal. For every stunning,
smart, well-coiffed, hot woman of 40+, there is a bald, paunchy relic in yellow pants making a fool of himself with some 22-year-old waitress.

Ladies, I apologize for all of us and I hope you will remember us useless and cowardly black
males as you bask in your new found glory.



_____________________________
Is it just talk or are you for solutions? If you are GENUINELY interested in solving black problems? Then join us at http://www.theguidedog.com/BlackNation.html

Now, now Henry, this is no way to talk about someone whose sending $20.00 a month to Africa to feed a village of 250 of ya, what with you the MALE having abandoned the African woman to her fate you SENSELESS MALE BEINGS made for her. A fate of destitution, abject poverty, starvation, AIDS INFECTING, rapes, beatings, torture, and just the denigrating world in which they exist thanks to the so-called 'brudahs' who are laying prostrate before the white fiend who has his heel on your neck while you all by and large grin at a white girl. Now that's pathetic, disgraceful, and just downright degrading way to be.

As so, I'd think you'd have your hands full worried over that, rather than criticizing a black woman with the courage to call you colored boy buzzards who are responsible for the black woman's bottom rung world status.

By the way, how is England? It had to take some getting used to, what with the 'wearing shoes,' concept of daily baths and showers...and eating meat other than 'goat' and the other kind they allege you all to be scoffing down. Hmmmm...now I've really given you something to chit-chat about, eh?