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Where's Mommy?

They sure don't make women like they used to!, I overheard one brother say to another brother as he exited the subway station. Momma ain't never home, babies stay hungry, McDonald's is being heated up in the microwave, and the bed stays cold. Are today's women too "advanced" and busy to be wives? Have they lost all of their domestic capabilities (i.e., cooking, cleaning, maintaining the household)? With all of their education and degrees, who needs a husband!

Are today's women deserving, even better, fit to be wives?
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You know, these discussions are becoming "which came first, the chicken or the egg". Sometimes men are at fault for failing relationships, other times women are at fault. Sometimes, the person in the mirror is the reason your s--t didn't work out! Damn people, it's ALL of our faults!. We can make better choices in mates. We can choose to behave honorably in our relationships. We can choose to open our hearts, in spite of past hurts. We can check our friends (and ourselves) when we go astray. We can choose to value productive, honorable qualities in our mates.

Instead of wasting all this time bickering, how about some honest discussion, brainstorming and problem solving. I agree with many of the assessments made by ladies here, just not in the universal tone with which they are stated. The men here also raise valid issues & concerns (likewise, the proclamations should not be considered universal). We've all been hurt in a relationship in our lives; there's no gender exclusion to that pain. IMO, it's these "bad" experiences that help you recognize & cherish the good ones. Humans crave social interaction - we do need each other, romantically & otherwise. To need someone does not make you weak or less than, it makes you human! We can choose to wallow in rage, arrogance, denial & pity, or we can dust ourselves off, give someone new (and ourselves) a fair chance and get back in the game.

Some translation is in order, then some compromise. Men are trying to understand on a practical, pragmatic level how to please women. Ladies, understand this may not be the way you process relationships, but it is critical to know. We sure as hell don't understand the way you do things, so we can stand to learn as well.

As much as I enjoy a good debate, we are rapidly approaching "beat a dead horse" territory. Can we get some non-accusatory consensus building around here?

With heart

I'm not your adversary, I'm your complement...
quote:
Originally posted by ddouble:
As much as I enjoy a good debate, we are rapidly approaching "beat a dead horse" territory. Can we get some non-accusatory consensus building around here?


I appreciate the bleeding-heart lecture brother Ddouble, but I am genuinely concerned about the health and deteriorating traditional values that are lost on some of today's women. I have an older sister who has five children. And each time that I visit her, there is either KFC, Burger King, or Pizza on the kitchen's dinner table for her children to eat. As a matter of fact I have yet to see her prepare a home-cooked meal for her family for as long as her and her husband has been married. I'm asking members if this preference for eating out, rather than cooking for the family, is something that is common amongst the women in their families as well.
If everyone is out working 50+ hours a week to maintain a "lifestyle", who realistically can be home to cook? Or check homework or know what their children are really doing?

Fit is in the eye of each husband & wife. No bleeding heart lecture from me - I just think we could have some truly meaningful discussion in this forum (and the Den & Dating/Relationships) if we dropped some of the posturing and provacateur style postings.

Nevermind... carry on. Hopefully you'll get the results you're looking for... Smile
I think its all about adjusting your work to fit your family not your family to fit your work. A lot of the kids in my day care center their parents are very career goal oriented. I have this one girl, this is a very smart child but her mother and father are both classic workaholics so she acts out from time to time. But anyway back to the original question I think that todays women are deserving of marriage and do fit the roles of mother and wife of the future of today. Men say that they don't make women like they used to, but then again they don't make men like they used too, either.
About the dinner thing what some people fail to do is prepare. My grandmother worked 50+ hours a week at a local hospital but there was always a homecooked meal waiting for her family. It's all because on Saturday and Sunday night my granny was making dinner for the week and putting it up. She would prepare it right to the point of where all she had to do when she got home was get a box of cornbread and mix that to gether warm her meal up and start fixing plates. My mother did that too, all the way up until I was in high school, then I just started cooking on a regular basis(i really like to cook Smile) All they have to do is try organizing things.
quote:
Originally posted by tru2urself16:
I think that todays women do fit the roles of mother and wife of the future of today. Men say that they don't make women like they used to, but then again they don't make men like they used too, either.


In my view, "being busy" does not serve as an excuse for why women have moved away from their traditional roles as mothers. Many of our mothers, grandmothers, and great grandmothers were "busy" as well and had societal issues to deal with that were much more worrisome than the issues with which women must grapple today. What's partly responsible for our moving away from traditional lifestyles is our nation's addiction to convenience. It's more convenient to get a bucket of chicken than it is to prepare a healthy meal made with love, but preparing food says to your family that you're worth my time, effort, and patience.

Anyway, I'm concerned about the health of my nieces and nephews. If they don't adopt better eating habits, they will be overweight like many of the children that I'm seeing in the classroom.
quote:
Originally posted by tru2urself16:
About the dinner thing what some people fail to do is prepare. My grandmother worked 50+ hours a week at a local hospital but there was always a homecooked meal waiting for her family. It's all because on Saturday and Sunday night my granny was making dinner for the week and putting it up. She would prepare it right to the point of where all she had to do when she got home was get a box of cornbread and mix that to gether warm her meal up and start fixing plates. My mother did that too, all the way up until I was in high school, then I just started cooking on a regular basis(i really like to cook Smile) All they have to do is try organizing things.


tfro My mom did too. What she would do is take out the meat that she was going to prepare early in the morning so that it would be thawed out before she came home from work. Not only does cooking save time. It saves a hell of a lot of money.
quote:
I'll only say this. In all of my relationships I've been the cook - the one who prepared most of the meals: one thing that I find curious about modern dating is that some women want a traditional man (i.e., a bread earner) but cannot themselves be traditional women (i.e., bread makers).

appl

I'm more likely to cook in our home. My wife tends to only cook when we have parties or during the holidays.

And when talking about "traditional domestic roles"...how many men can fix things and are a "handy" around the house?
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
I'll only say this. In all of my relationships I've been the cook - the one who prepared most of the meals.


Brother Honestbrother, you do realize that we're talking about real cooking here, not making grilled cheese sandwiches and a bowl of chips.


Rowe, I would hope that by now you'd know me well enough to know that when I say that "I cook", I really cook Smile And I don't mean no damned ham sandwiches.

PS: How many of you own a hand cranked pasta maker? And know how to make fresh pasta from scratch (eggs, water, and flour)?
quote:
Originally posted by HonestBrother:
Rowe, I would hope that by now you'd know me well enough to know that when I say that "I cook", I really cook Smile And I don't mean no damned ham sandwiches.

PS: How many of you own a hand cranked pasta maker? And know how to make fresh pasta from scratch (eggs, water, and flour)?


Well, excuse me Chef Honestbrother! Pasta, from scratch, I'm impressed. If you would substitute that flour with whole wheat flour, we'd be in business. I bet your cooking is delicious.
quote:
Originally posted by MidLifeMan:
I'm more likely to cook in our home. My wife tends to only cook when we have parties or during the holidays.

And when talking about "traditional domestic roles"...how many men can fix things and are a "handy" around the house?


Great point. I usually cook at least three to four days out of the week. One of my favorite meals to prepare is vegetarian lasagna with whole wheat noodles, layers of egg plant, fresh spinach, fresh tomatoes, onions, green pepper, and soy cheese. For a side dish, I usually prepare roasted cauliflower with garlic, and side salad filled with a combination of nutrient-packed greens of all colors. For dessert, baked apples with cinnamon. Hmmmm. bsm
I think we all tend to idealize the gender specific relationships that our parents and grandparents had. While I have always been dreaming of staying home to raise our child / future children while my husband brings the money home, unfortunately we cannot do that in today's economy. Wages have not increased proportionately over the years to the cost of living, and the majority of families are forced into being a double-income household just to live comfortably. Growing up, I learned to cook, bake, sew among other things. Although I would love to sew clothes for the family, I cannot due to my fulltime job, then coming home and making dinner, using what little time I have left to bond with my daughter, then after she goes to bed, using what little time I have or even losing a little sleep to bond with my husband. His schedule is just as busy, and yes he makes dinner sometimes too - even though I have expressed my views that this makes me feel defeminized, I am often too tired to object. The bible stated in first Genesis that a woman's curse is pain in child birth and that a MAN'S curse is to toil for a living from sun up to sun sun down. It is not natural for a woman to work fulltime and be a mother too, but unfortunately, the current economy demands that we do.
quote:
Originally posted by surfer girl:
While I have always been dreaming of staying home to raise our child/future children while my husband brings the money home, unfortunately we cannot do that in today's economy. Wages have not increased proportionately over the years to the cost of living, and the majority of families are forced into being a double-income household just to live comfortably.


In the past, families lived off of a lot less than what people are making today. So "disproportionate wages" does not serve as an excuse either. Black mothers, in particular, made very little money from their jobs as nurses, cooks, maids, and nannies and they still managed to come home and prepare a decent meal for their families. Perhaps the problem today is people wish to maintain a lifestyle they cannot afford. When you're single, spending a little money on yourself every now and again is fine. But once you get married and establish a family, I think your priorities should definitely change. No longer should it be about accumulating unnecessary things that I want, but instead, providing what the family needs. And your family's health, your children's health especially, should be a top priority.
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
Where's Mommy?

They sure don't make women like they used to!, I overheard one brother say to another brother as he exited the subway station. Momma ain't never home, babies stay hungry, McDonald's is being heated up in the microwave, and the bed stays cold. Are today's women too "advanced" and busy to be wives? Have they lost all of their domestic capabilities (i.e., cooking, cleaning, maintaining the household)? With all of their education and degrees, who needs a husband!

Are today's women deserving, even better, fit to be wives?


what do you mean 'too advanced' to be wives?? please explain. Are you implying that today's woman is 'turning down' marriage proposals so that they can be 'advanced'??
quote:
Originally posted by Rowe:
In the past, families lived off of a lot less than what people are making today. So "disproportionate wages" does not serve as an excuse either. Black mothers, in particular, made very little money from their jobs as nurses, cooks, maids, and nannies and they still managed to come home and prepare a decent meal for their families. Perhaps the problem today is people wish to maintain a lifestyle they cannot afford. When you're single, spending a little money on yourself every now and again is fine. But once you get married and establish a family, I think your priorities should definitely change. No longer should it be about accumulating unnecessary things that I want, but instead, providing what the family needs. And your family's health, your children's health especially, should be a top priority.


I agree with health being a priority, but not your response about the economy.

How could wages have nothing to do with it?

I doubt all those mothers working all those hours at low wage jobs are doing so in order to not serve their families.

The reason is probably more along the lines that they wish to maintain a lifestyle that will keep their families out of a cardboard box.

Most mothers I know aren't neglecting their children in order to maintain something extravagant. I'm sure the economy has a lot to do with the change of traditional roles.

If the wife has left her traditional role, why can't the guy?

If the child is eating only fast food, is the father deserving to be a husband? 19

Both your sister and brother-in-law are at fault for their children's eating habits.

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