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'Child sacrifices in London'
By Richard Edwards Crime Reporter, Evening Standard
16 June 2005
African boys are being murdered as human sacrifices in London churches, according to a shocking Scotland Yard report.

The Met has uncovered a trade in black boys being trafficked into the capital.

A number of fundamentalist sects believe powerful spells require the ritual killing of male children.


The leaked report also reveals countless examples of African children being killed after being identified as "witches" by church pastors.

The 10-month study was commissioned in the wake of the inquiry into the death of Victoria Climbie. The study aimed to be an "open dialogue" with the African and Asian community in Newham and Hackney.

In discussions with African community leaders officers were told of numerous examples of children being murdered because their parents or carers believe them to be possessed by "evil spirits". Police are now investigating claims further.

Earlier this month two women were convicted at the Old Bailey of torturing an eight-year-old child they accused of being a witch.

The girl, an orphaned refugee from war-torn Angola, was stabbed, kicked, beaten, had chilli peppers rubbed in her eyes and was forced into a laundry bag and threatened with drowning in a nearby river.

Last month Scotland Yard revealed it had been unable to trace all but two of 300 black boys aged four to seven reported missing from London schools in a three-month period.

Child welfare experts say the number highlights the scale of the trade in children brought to Britain. The figure emerged through the murder inquiry following the discovery of a child's torso in the Thames in September 2001.

The identity of the victim, named "Adam" by police, is not known but his background was traced to Nigeria. It is believed he died in a ritual sacrifice. Detectives asked each London educat ion authority to give them details of black boys aged four to seven reported missing from school between July and September 2001.

It emerged that 300 had vanished, 299 from Africa and one from the Caribbean.

Police only managed to trace two children. The true figure for missing boys and girls is feared to be several thousand a year.

Scotland Yard's new report into child abuse report, leaked to the Today programme on Radio4, came after the death of Victoria Climbié.

The eight year old was beaten, burned with cigarettes and forced to sleep in a bin liner inside an empty bath. She died in February 2000, suffering from hypothermia and malnutrition.

She had been brought to Britain by relatives claiming her as their daughter and was starved and traumatised after they said she was possessed by the devil.

Her plight was overlooked by police, social workers and medical staff and she died covered in bruises.

Her great aunt and her greataunt's boyfriend were convicted of her murder and were jailed for life at the Old Bailey.

A Met spokesman said: "The Met undertook a project based on recommendations arising from the Victoria Climbié report aimed at improving our knowledge of issues impacting child abuse within the African and Asian communities of London.

"This initiative employed two Community Partnership Officers who conducted the survey over a ten-month period ending in March 2005.

Working in Newham and Hackney, the CPOs ran a number of workshops with various sections of these communities debating issues such as female genital mutilation, physical chastisement, forced marriage and faith-related child abuse.

"The aim of the project was to open a dialogue within these communities and encourage a debate which would help reduce the risks of harm to children.

"The recommendations in the report, due to be published later this month, are being carefully considered at the highest levels in the MPS in conjunction with partner agencies and community groups." The report concludes police face a "wall of silence" when dealing with the fundamentalist African community.
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

The topic heading is a little misleading isn't it?

Having said that in the case of the torso of the boy found in the River Thames it is interesting that the many supporters of African Traditional religion on this site have not stepped forward to explain this sickening and horrifying practice.

Hmmmn but then if we did not know better such ones would tell you these types of carry on is the way forward for Africa.
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:
The topic is a little misleading isn't it?

Having said that in the case of the torso of the boy found in the River Thames it is interesting that the many supporters of African Traditional religion on this site have not stepped forward to explain this sickening and horrifying practice.

Hmmmn but then if we did not know better such ones would tell you these types of carry on is the way forward for Africa.



How so, is the topic misleading?


So, you know this to be factual? That ritual 'killings' of young children is going on, as described? wth!
Sorry Nayo I should have said the "heading" is misleading. I would correct the last post.

The topic heading is misleading because there are no African Human Sacrifices taking place here in London. Also apart from the one mention of the torso in the river which is based on speculation by a racist white Police institution over here everything else posted had nothing to do with human sacrifices taking place here in London.
quote:
Originally posted by nayo:
So, you know this to be factual? That ritual 'killings' of young children is going on, as described? wth!

Don't get me started .Wink Big Grin

All I can tell you is no continental African in their right mind or have even a tiny bit of education gets involved with traditional African religion. There is no history of anything good ever coming from it. You can trace slavery and every horror story coming from Africa to it. It is the cornerstone for fostering tribalism and tribal conflict. Here is a tip, notice how any time African's are involved with civil conflict traditional African religion plays a central part.

African are 99.999 percent Christian or Muslim. The people who engage in such things do not even come to any percentage. The bad news is we all know about our traditional religion and when our people's hearts are overtaken by tribal hatred they fall back to it and the rest is bad news.
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:
quote:
Originally posted by nayo:
So, you know this to be factual? That ritual 'killings' of young children is going on, as described? wth!

Don't get me started .Wink Big Grin

All I can tell you is no continental African in their right mind or have even a tiny bit of education gets involved with traditional African religion. There is no history of anything good ever coming from it. You can trace slavery and every horror story coming from Africa to it. It is the cornerstone for fostering tribalism and tribal conflict. Here is a tip, notice how any time African's are involved with civil conflict traditional African religion plays a central part.

African are 99.999 percent Christian or Muslim. The people who engage in such things do not even come to any percentage. The bad news is we all know about our traditional religion and when our people's hearts are overtaken by tribal hatred they fall back to it and the rest is bad news.


I am afraid you are quite mistaken. No Traditionalist in his/her right mind would harm a child thinking that somehow this will get a blessing. Also for you to say that no educated African is involved in Traditional African religions is a lie. The Awise Ogunwande Abimbola is just one of the hundreds I know of personally. I also include myself.
Third as you probably know many so-called xtians and mohammedans come to Ifa priest for help, for you to suggest otherwise in your post is a lie. I only speak for Nigeria, I cannot speak for the entire continent as you have done here. The percentages you site are so much dung.
I will defend the terrible of African Traditional Religion when you defend the abominations of catholic priests buggering young boys and your pentacostal pastor pimps.
So Fagunwa you know any African country where this nonsense is a national reliigion or belief? Here is a challenge show me any African country that promotes this nonsense and I would say you have a point but I am confident I can go on the web to every African country and their national religion would be cited as Christian or Muslim. That being the case you and others are the one spreading a lie by promoting traditional African religion as if it is the mainstay of daily African life or worship.

I am so glad you mentioned Nigeria because in West Africa it is common knowledge that certain parts of Nigeria are notorious for the evil practice that is being discussed here. Yes we don't hear of no African country but Nigeria. I don't know how much time you spent in Nigeria or you wouldn't dare to try and defend what is indefensible knowing such nastiness goes on in that country. You try it and I can assure you end up with egg on your face by the time we finish the discussion.
Well Fagunwa since you so kindly got me started on one of my pet hates here is some information about Nigeria for you to digest. By the way it was written by a Nigerian.


----------------------------------------------
Ritual Killing and Pseudoscience in Nigeria
Leo Igwe

The murder in London of a Nigerian boy, simply named Adam by the British Police, might have brought to international focus and attention one of the most dreadful and horrifying practices in Nigeria - ritual killing.

In September 2001, the mutilated body of "Boy Adam" was found by the British Police floating in the River Thames, near Tower Bridge in London. A top police source suspected that Adam might have been a victim of a style of ritual killing practiced in west and southern Africa. And forensic examination revealed that Adam lived in southwestern Nigeria.

So, early this year, British detectives arrived in Nigeria in search of Adam's killers. Both the former president of South Africa, Nelson Mandela, and Nigerian soccer player Nwankwo Kanu, made passionate appeals for clues and information leading to the arrest of Adam's killers.

In July, Police arrested a 37-year-old Nigerian, Sam Onogigovie (in Dublin), and twenty-one other Nigerians in Britain in connection with the murder of Adam. Generally, ritual killing is a common practice in Nigeria. Every year, hundreds of Nigerians lose their lives to ritual murderers, also known as headhunters.

These head hunters go in search of human parts-head, breast, tongue, sexual organs-at the behest of witchdoctors, juju priests, and traditional medicine men who require them for some sacrifices or for the preparation of assorted magical potions.

Recently, there have been several reported cases of individuals who were kidnapped, killed, or had their bodies mutilated by ritualists in Nigeria. The most notorious of them is the one associated with one Chief Vincent Duru, popularly known as Otokoto.

It happened this way: In 1996, the police in the southern Nigerian city of Owerri arrested a man, Innocent Ekeanyanwu, with the head of a young boy, Ikechukwu Okonkwo. In the course of the investigation, the police discovered the buried torso of Ikechukwu on the premises of Otokoto Hotel, owned by Chief Duru, and uncovered a syndicate that specialized in ritual killing and the sale and procurement of human parts. The horrifying discoveries sparked off violent protests in the city of Owerri which led to the burning and looting of properties belonging to suspected killers. Otokoto and his ritualist syndicate were arrested and put on trial, and in February 2003, they were sentenced to death by hanging.

Apart from the Otokoto incident, there have been other instances of ritual murder and mutilation in other parts of the country. For instance, in Calabar, two men plucked out the eyes of a young lady, Adlyne Eze, for money-making ritual. And in Ifo, Ogun state, a businessman inflicted the same harm on his younger sister. In Ibadan, the police in December arrested a taxi driver, Abbas, who used his fourteen-month-old baby for rituals. Abbas killed his child in order to secure a human head, which was one of the materials listed for him by a local witchdoctor for a money-making ritual.

And in another act of ritual horror in Onitsha, Anambra State, two young men, Tobechukwu Okorie and Peter Obasi, seized a boy, Monday Emenike, and cut off his sexual organ with the intention of delivering it to a man, who allegedly offered to pay 1.5 million naira ($11,000) for it. In Kaduna, Danladi Damina was arrested after he exhumed the corpse of a 9-year-old boy, plucked out his eyes and cut off his lips, intending to use them for charms. Recently a woman was caught in a bush in Warri, Delta State, decapitating a four-year-old boy for ritual purposes. And while writing this piece, I read in The Guardian (Nigeria) a report of the murder of an 18-year-old girl, identified as Chioma, by suspected ritualists in Mbaise, Imo State.

The question is: why do Nigerians still engage in such bloody, brutal, and barbaric acts and atrocities even in the twenty-first century? For me, there are three reasons:
1 Religion: Nigeria is a deeply religious society. Most Nigerians believe in the existence of supernatural beings and that these transcendental entities can be influenced through ritual acts and sacrifices. Rituals constitute part of the people's traditional religious practice and observance. Nigerians engage in ritual acts to appease the gods, seek supernatural favours, or to ward off misfortune. Many do so out of fear of unpleasant spiritual consequences if they default. So religion, theism, supernaturalism, and occultism are at the root of ritual killing in Nigeria.
2 Superstition: Nigeria is a society where most beliefs are still informed by unreason, dogmas, myth making, and magical thinking. In Nigeria, belief in ghosts, juju, charms, and witchcraft is prevalent and widespread. Nigerians believe that magical potions prepared with human heads, breasts, tongues, eyes, and sexual organs can enhance one's political and financial fortunes; that juju, charms and amulets can protect individuals against business failures, sickness and diseases, accidents, and spiritual attacks. In fact, ritual-making is perceived as an act of spiritual fortification.
3 Poverty: Most often, Nigerians engage ritual killing for money-making purposes. Among Nigerians, there is a popular belief in a special kind of ritual, performed with human blood or body parts that can bring money or wealth, even though such a belief lacks any basis in reason, science or common sense.

For example, there has never been a single proven instance of any Nigerian who became rich through a moneymaking ritual.

And still the belief in "ritual wealth" or "blood money" remains strong among the people and features prominently in the nation's media and film industry. Most times, what we hear are stories and speculations founded on ignorance and hearsay. For instance, Nigerians who enrich themselves through dubious and questionable means, like the scammers who swindle foreigners, are said to have indulged in money-making rituals using the blood or body parts of their parents, wives, children, or other close relations.

So driven by ignorance, poverty, desperation, gullibility, and irrationalism, Nigerians murder fellow Nigerians for rituals. But ritual killing is not a practice limited to Nigeria. Ritual sacrifices also occur in other parts of sub-Saharan Africa, like in Ghana, the Democratic Republic of Congo, Liberia, Uganda, etc. In fact in some parts of Uganda, a child is sacrificed before a major building is erected. There is therefore an urgent need for an international campaign to end this murderous practice and other horrifying traditions and superstitions in Africa. Personally, I am recommending that the United Nations' Inter-Africa Committee includes ritual killing in its programs and campaigns as a harmful traditional practice.

Also, skeptics groups should strive to expose the ignorance, superstition, and unreason that underlie the belief in and practice of ritual killing by organizing public education, awareness, and enlightenment campaigns on science education, critical thinking, and rational inquiry.

The case of Adam underscores the need to internationally confront and combat religious obscurantism, dogmatism, and occultism in Africa and the world at large.

In 2001, there were so many cases of ritual killing in the Lagos metropolis that one of the nation's major newspapers, The Punch, published a scary headline: "Ritualists Lay Siege to Lagos."

Personally, I think that caption would have better read: "Pseudoscience Lays Siege to Nigeria." Because that was the case. And that is still the case.

About the Author
Leo Igwe is head of the Nigerian Skeptics Society. E-mail: nskepticleo@yahoo.com.

http://www.csicop.org/sb/2004-06/nigeria.html
Here is some more news for you Fagunwa. By now I am sure you can see why I said if you were really a Nigerian you have known what goes on and that knowledge would have kept your fingers off the keyboard and made you keep your thoughts to yourself. Big Grin

----------------------------------------------

No Human Heads, No Crown



A quiet revolution is now going on in Owerre Ebeiri community in Orlu local government area of Imo State . Chidi B. Uzomah, a lecturer in Imo State University , Owerri and the new Eze-elect for the community is kicking against ritual killings required by the tradition before he ascends the throne. Though it appears like a one-man riot squad, Uzomah is sure to win the battle.

Newswatch learnt that in the event of the death of the traditional ruler of the community; and the installation of a new one, about 34 human heads - 16 men, 16 women and a set of twins are usually sacrificed to appease the gods.

This, they claim, will enable the dead Eze have an easy passage and to be acceptable to the ancestors. The community has buried 10 Ezes in its life span and had performed the rituals. But Uzomah would not have any of it.

He claimed that God called him to cleanse the rotten system of the ancestors. He told Newswatch that God anointed him to liberate his people from the bondage of a barbaric culture. "That is why I left my job as dean in an American university where I was making $200,000 per year. When they were burying Ezealaeke, Eze Emenaha, his successor produced 34 human heads. That was the order then."

In the community, only strangers are killed in the event of the death of the Eze. Before the advent of the whiteman, there existed a slave market which provided the bulk of humans for such sacrifices. After the destruction of the market by the British soldiers following the abolition of slave trade, village warriors were given the task of providing human heads from distant towns and villages. "These people are crying to God today for justice. That is the trouble Owerre Ebeiri is facing today. This evil committed has been haunting Owerre Ebeiri people. But God has called me to clean up all these rubbish," Uzomah vowed.

That is not the only battle Uzomah has been waging in the community in the past two years. He refused to worship at the shrines and the temples of the ancestors. Instead, he brought about 10 pastors from the Overcomers Christian Mission, Owerri, to demolish some of the shrines. He said the shrines were used by his people to evoke sickness and unleash terror and mayhem on innocent people of the area. He claims to have also cast away the demons that inhabitate the Ofo, the symbol of the community, the Ikenga, and the Amadioha deities. This, he said, was to invoke the spirit of the dead to harm innocent citizens. He specifically mentioned a particular demon brought from Uli ( Anambra State ) by one of his grandfather's wives. This demon, he said, has a shrine at the right side of the palace. Each time Uzomah visited home, the demon would battle with him because nobody sacrifices to it. "I have to go with the pastors and remove the shrine and cast away the demon. If you are not in the main line of the Ezeship, you may not know what is going on there."

That was not all. Uzomah cited the killing of a promising young man by Ezealaeke for rituals. "The mother of the boy went to the village square where she protested naked. She cursed the entire village that nobody should go beyond the age of her son. Ever since then, nobody has started and completed a house. But after the liberation exercise, the difference is there," he said. He told Newswatch that the rebellion against the ancestors had just begun.

He said Owerre Ebeiri people should wait and see what will happen when his father will be no more. "It is not my battle. It's the Lord's battle. The battle, he said started when he was seven years old. The story of Uzomah is very intriguing and revealing. In fact, Uzomah could pass as the proverbial cat with nine lives.

Two years ago, Uzomah had a bitter experience. That was after the day he besieged Owerre Ebeiri with 10 pastors from Owerri. After the liberation exercise, Uzomah was attacked spiritually. "I saw spiritual he-goats flying into my car and I fainted. He was later revived and taken to the church for prayers. The incident did not discourage Uzomah from the revolution he embarked upon.

Uzomah is the 12th crown prince. The traditional institution of Owerre Ebeiri is hereditary. Newswatch was told that those who tried to disrupt the inheritance system had met instant death. A story was told of one Okwara Orisakwe who tried to hijack the throne by claiming to be the head of the royal family. He even contested the Ezeship in the law court between 1980 and 1985 and lost. He later died mysteriously.

The lineage is strictly followed that when Eze Uzomah Nzeukwu died in 1936, the heir apparent , Benjamin Uzomah was only 12 years old. One Nwadike Okwara Ukoma, now late was nominated to represent Uzomah until he became of age. Ukoma was answering Uzomah until he was 24 years when the former stepped aside. Now (Benjamin) Uzomah is 78 years and blind. In order to maintain the lineage, Uzomah anointed Chidi two years ago. In an elaborate ceremony attended by many prominent sons of the town including representatives of Governor Achike Udenwa of Imo State and President Olusegun Obasanjo, the old man transferred the crown to (Chidi) Uzomah, as tradition demanded. "In the Bible King Saul was alive when David was anointed. Saul was old and inefficient that was why David was anointed. So also my father is old and blind, that is the reason for my anointing. My father actually took the crown off his head and placed on mine publicly. We have photographs and video tapes on the ceremony," Uzomah stressed.

That was all Uzomah needed to launch his revolution against a tradition that thrives on human sacrifice. Ever since he started his rebellion against the ancestors Uzomah has attracted more enemies than friends. Uzomah has never known peace in the town. Many prominent sons of Owerre Ebeiri are bent on wrestling the crown from him. They accused him of desecrating and destroying the traditional institution of the community. Uzomah said these men have used all available means in a bid to eliminate him and take over the crown so that they could continue the atrocities of their ancestors. All efforts by the elders of the community to resolve the issue failed.

Prominent among the contenders was one Gilbert Nnabuife. Uzomah told Newswatch that Nnabuife used the death of his son to invite the dreaded Bakassi Boys of Aba to eliminate him (Uzomah). He alleged that Nnabuife paid Bakassi Boys N1.5 million to do the dirty job. The Bakassi Boys arrested him and four others, but instead of killing him, they demanded N100,000 for their release. They paid. He said he alerted the security agents about the threat to his life, but he was ignored.

Uzomah also mentioned one Hilary Mbachu, the parish priest of St. Martin 's Catholic Church, Owerre Ebeiri, an indigene of the town as one of the people instigating the public against him with the aim of snatching the crown from him. Mbachu, he alleged, uses the altar of God as a platform to cause disunity among indigenes of the town. He also accused one Anslem Ikegkwuoha of inciting the traditional religion worshippers against his ascendance to the throne. Uzomah claimed that on the day of his inauguration as the 12th crown prince, Ikegwuoha and his supporters attempted to disrupt the ceremony, "but what happened to him later forced him to run away from the village. Many of them wanted to be Eze to continue the evil of their forefathers."

All efforts to locate Ikegwuoha, Okwara and Nnabuife proved abortive as they were said to have travelled outside the state. However, when Newswatch later traced Mbachu to Saint Martin 's Catholic Church, Tuesday, June 4, he declined comment insisting that he had to get clearance from the Bishop of Orlu Catholic dioceses.

Christian Amadi, Ishimbi of Owerre Ebeiri denied knowledge of such practice as killing during the burial or installation of Ezes in the community. The 86-year-old man also insisted that there was no where in the history of the town where such tradition was recorded. He accused Uzomah of bringing in such sentiments to make him relevant. "All we heard was that our people were very much involved in slave trade before the British soldiers invaded the Orie market and demolished it. Since then Owerre Ebeiri has been a Christian community," he told Newswatch.

Uzomah's father also told Newswatch that nobody has the right to destroy the deities or any traditional practice established by the ancestors. He maintained that the destruction of such traditions would amount to the loss of the community's identity. Newswatch learnt that he had done all the ceremonies to restore the worship and service of those deities weeks after Uzomah had destroyed them.

However, Uzomah has a handful of supporters in the crusade he embarked upon. Many indigenes of the area who would not want their names mentioned confirmed the existence of such barbaric tradition in the area. They fear that Uzomah might fail in the crusade to abolish the culture especially with the calibre of people opposing him.

Canice Okorie, president, Owerre Ebeiri Development Union said the practice of killing human beings in the name of culture or tradition should not be taken lightly. He told Newswatch that he was aware of such practices in different parts of Igboland and beyond. He gave kudos to Uzomah for his effort to eradicate such tradition in the town. "I must commend him for his courage to confront the outdated practice. I condemn such traditions, we have to move out of the bondage of traditional bondage to enable us brace up for the future. Anybody using it (revolution) as a ploy to contest the throne is wasting his time," he assured. Okorie also likened what happened in Calabar where the present Obong refused to be guided by certain traditional norms when he ascended the throne to the situation in Owerre Ebeiri.

He, however, called on the government to intervene and stop "this evil practice" associated with the Ezeship stool in the community.

http://www.onlinenigeria.com/links/adv.asp?blurb=89
'Fagwuna'; Henry38,

No intent to start a thread of flames, innuendo/insults. Please. However, I posted this, not to point fingers as if to say, look at the savage, ignorant Africans. Not even. I posted it to discuss the ongoing issues holding 'progress' from the continent. Of course their are henious goings on within the Christian and Moslem religions. But, I was talking about traditional African religions and these incidents. See the following story:
----------------------------------------------

Priest unrepentent after crucifying of nun

June 18 2005 at 02:46PM

By Laura Chiriac

Tanacu, Romania - A Romanian Orthodox priest who ordered the crucifixion of a young nun because she was "possessed by the devil" and now faces murder charges was unrepentant on Saturday as he celebrated a funeral mass for his alleged victim.

"God has performed a miracle for her, finally Irina is delivered from evil," Father Daniel, 29, the superior of the Holy Trinity monastery in north-eastern Romania, said before celebrating a short mass "for the soul of the deceased", in the presence of 13 nuns who showed no visible emotion.

He insisted that from the religious point of view, the crucifixion of Maricica Irina Cornici, 23, was "entirely justified", but admitted that he faced excommunication as well as prosecution, and was seeking a "good lawyer".--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Cornici had entered the monastery just three months before
Cornici was found dead on Wednesday, gagged and chained to a cross, after fellow nuns called an ambulance, according to police.

Mihaela Straub, spokesperson for the police in the province of Vaslui, said Daniel and four other nuns had claimed Cornici was possessed and should be exorcised.

Before being crucified she had been kept shut up for several days, her hands and feet tied and without food or drink, he said.

Cornici had entered the monastery just three months before, after visiting a friend who was a nun there, police said.

As her coffin entered the church of the monastery Saturday no church bells were sounded while nuns cast distrustful glances at the strangers, including two AFP reporters, present at the ceremony.

'She can't be laid in the church because she was possesed'
Claps of thunder from an approaching storm were sometimes the only sounds to break the silence.

"This storm is proof that the will of God has been done," Daniel said.

"You see it?" said the priest, gesturing at the body, lying in an annexe and still showing the marks of the gag. One of the nuns, Sister Martha, added, "She can't be laid in the church because she was possesed."

Daniel has lived for the past four years in the isolated monastery located in the hills of one of the poorest regions of Romania, without running water or electricity.

"Over there, in your world, the people must know that the devil exists. Personally I can find his work in the gestures and speech of possessed people, because man is often weak and lets himself be easily manipulated by the forces of evil," said the bearded young priest.

"I don't understand why journalists are making such a fuss about this. Exorcism is a common practise in the heart of the Romanian Orthodox church and my methods are not at all unknown to other priests," he said.

A 34-year-old parishioner who had come to defend Daniel and gave her name as Dora, said Sister Irina " had to be punished, she had an argument with the Father during a Sunday mass and insulted him in front of the congregation."

Sociologist Alred Bulai said that corporal punishment was still commonly used in certain Romanian monasteries.

"It's happening particularly in the isolated monasteries, where the superiors have difficulty understanding the current realities and adapting themselves to modern life," Bulai said.

Since the fall of the communist regime in December 1989, the Orthodox Church, which represents 85 percent of Romania's 22

million inhabitants, is rated in many opinion polls as the most trusted institution in the country.

Vitalie Danciu, the superior of a nearby monastery at Golia, called the crucifixion "inexcusable",k but a spokesperson for the Orthodox patriarchate in Bucharest refused to condemn it.

"I don't know what this young woman did," Bogdan Teleanu said. - Sapa-AFP
---------------------------------------------

Dogmatic religious beliefs clearly are behind many violent/vicious, sick and twisted travesties in western, eastern, middle eastern and African practices. So are we clear? Back to the point at hand, the case with the young African boys and so on, is troubling because , I have this somewhat 'Pollyanna' hope for Africa, and this story, and many others, created a cognitive dissonance, when I 'want to' view traditional religion as progressive and a potential alternative to Christianity.
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:
So Fagunwa you know any African country where this nonsense is a national reliigion or belief? Here is a challenge show me any African country that promotes this nonsense and I would say you have a point but I am confident I can go on the web to every African country and their national religion would be cited as Christian or Muslim. That being the case you and others are the one spreading a lie by promoting traditional African religion as if it is the mainstay of daily African life or worship.

I am so glad you mentioned Nigeria because in West Africa it is common knowledge that certain parts of Nigeria are notorious for the evil practice that is being discussed here. Yes we don't hear of no African country but Nigeria. I don't know how much time you spent in Nigeria or you wouldn't dare to try and defend what is indefensible knowing such nastiness goes on in that country. You try it and I can assure you end up with egg on your face by the time we finish the discussion.


I was born in Ile Ife,Nigeria and I am there at least seven times a year. As is the usual case on this board, you didn't read what I posted. Why don't you try that and then maybe you wont need the propaganda. Oh and Benin has traditional religion as it's State religion,but you should know that as you are the voice for African news as long as it fits your views.

Second, this nonsense is not my religion, nor did I advocate the murder of children or anyone else. Once again read what I posted and comment on that if you wish. If you are african you know by the names of the folks in the garbage you posted what they are and you know by my name what I am. You are a xtian and like your masters you mix murder with my religion (Ifa) as a way of keeping people away from the sacred technology. We all know no xtians commit murder in the name of religion. No murders were ever committed in Togo by your masters in the name of religion, none in Benin and surely none in the Congo. No, your masters brought civilization to Africa. Thank you very much for it. I can see how much progress we have made with the civilization.

I do not have to ask if you are African, you sound like many of my people in Nigeria. Going to the pentacostal church's and mosque by day praising jesu and mohammed then coming to my grandfathers compound by night for the real thing. Touting all things british while the brit's rob the country blind with their negro lackeys firmly in charge.

Thank you for the education henry38, my heart is now glad. I will now begin to repent and praise jesu for all of his many gifts to our ancestors.
quote:
Originally posted by Fagunwa:
this nonsense is not my religion, nor did I advocate the murder of children or anyone else.

So you say this nonsense is not your religion? It is very good news that you renounce such barbarism. Maybe you can join me in a crusade to wipe this evil out of Nigeria. After that we can go after the traditional religious bastards in South Africa that tell grown men to sleep with children to cure themselves of Aids.

One more thing, you need to get rid of your avatar. It's a monstrosity! Did you know it has a human head sticking out of it? My jaw dropped in disbelief the first time I saw it. Look closely above where the chain and the padlock join in the beastly cauldron, the red patch is the face of a man staring back at you. You can clearly see the eyes and the nose. Ugh, how horrible!!
Henry, you kill me.

Why don't you clear up the thieves, con-men, child molesters, child traffickers ect. in the X-tian community? Or is it just their behavior as individuals when X-tians do evil things to their fellow human beings?

The biggest pentacostal preacher in Kenya was just recently found to be trafficking children to Europe via his church connections with the West.

Also, I could have sworn the 1st article posted said some PASTORS and others have killed children because they said they were witches or posessed by the devil. That sounds like X-tian stuff to me... X-tians that are torturing children because the child is being accused of being a traditionalist(aka witch, possesed by the devil ect. but then again, people who agree with your religious choice can do no wrong huh?

I guess the inquisition, colonization, slavery, Salem witch trials, ect., ect., weren't done in the name of Jesu then... sck
Hey OA I was wondering where you vanished to, I was beginning to think you have run for cover. Welcome to the party.

You see you are not reading right again. Nothing in the Christian faith requests ritual killing. You get that? Nothing and nowhere has this been a request from God. The cases you are talking about as reported are criminals engaged in modern day human trafficking..

Don't let us lose track of what is being reported here. Human body parts, human torsos etc? You simply don't get it, this is an essential part of traditional African religion. The key word is "essential." You want to accuse the Bible of promoting this kind of evil? So you tell me where in the Bible is it required to kill a person and walk about with the murdered person's body bits dangling from your waist? Are you telling me you support the practice common among ritual killers of turning poor innocent kidnapped people into half human half zombies for all sorts of beastly going on? Whew - what is wrong with you?

My advice to you is follow Fagunwa's example and denounce this evil practice.
quote:
Originally posted by henry38:
Hey OA I was wondering where you vanished to, I was beginning to think you have run for cover. Welcome to the party.

You see you are not reading right again. Nothing in the Christian faith requests ritual killing.You get that? Nothing and nowhere has this been a request from God.


Jesus wasn't a human sacrifice?

quote:
The cases you are talking about as reported are criminals engaged in modern day human trafficking..


Exactly...done by people who claim to be X-tians, just like people who CLAIM to be traditionalists do the same. But you lump evil folk all together under other religions, But seperate them from your own...You can't have it both ways. People who claim all religious doctrine do f-ed up stuff Henry.

quote:
Don't let us lose track of what is being reported here. Human body parts, human torsos etc? You simply don't get it, this is an essential part of traditional African religion. The key word is [b]"essential."/[b] You want to accuse the Bible of promoting this kind of evil?


I didn't kow you were a follower of traditional spirituality or a Baba to know this? You are just believing the propoganda that X-tians(and massa) put in you head about traditional religion...or have you been to a human sacrifice ritual? TIsk tisk Henry. nono


quote]So you tell me where in the Bible is it required to kill a person and walk about with the murdered person's body bits dangling from your waist? Are you telling me you support the practice common among ritual killers of turning poor innocent kidnapped people into half human half zombies for all sorts of beastly going on? Whew - what is wrong with you?[/quote]

You have been watching too many of the Zombie movies the west puts out about so-called Vooodoo. I see a whole bunch of X-tians who are spiritual and psychological slaves.

quote:
My advice to you is follow Fagunwa's example and denounce this evil practice.


You are an idiot. WHen did I say I was pro-human sacrifice? That's why I don't like looking at or reading about a bloody Florentine faggot hanging from a cross.

Your lack of being able to outside the box is amazingly sad considering you are a grown ass man Henry.

I suggest you continue to defy all logic and continue on your rampage against traditional religion like massa likes your ilk to do. You'll answer to the ancestors one day.

Damn I can't stand thows missionaries for what they did to the African mind.
You trying to tell what is myth and what is true about my traditions OA? Maybe you did not read the reports I posted earlier of how the Nigerians reacted when they discovered the ritualists hiding in their midst. They chased them out and burned down their houses. I am sure to you their reaction was irrational. You are born and bred in America and you try to educate me about my African background? Hmmn and you have the nerve to call me an idiot when the word is written on your forehead? To help illustrate how much you become the rank idiot here is a simple test. Say I with my background write a book on anything to do with Africa and you write one, which one would be accepted as gospel? Work that one out and you would see how ridiculous it is for you to be arguing with me on this subject.
Well, I'm certainly no expert here, but it seems to me that a killing done through a religious ritual may be misguided, outdated and ill-informed ... but, the Christians historically committing murder for the purpose of domination and control and simply out of a sense of superiority over other human beings seems downright evil to me. Eek

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