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I think that the general thinking on repatriations is that somehow money needs to be paid. While this fact is debatable and both sides have great arguments, i think an option is being overlooked.

You ask 100 white dudes if they should pay repatriations in cash form and 98% say hell no.
You ask the same 100 people if the Natives should be given land and i would think 80% would say yes.

I know that the Apache(one tribe) and the Tutsi(one tribe) have different beliefs and values. When you think of it are they really that different ?

Wouldn't it be beneficial for black citizens to act in the same way that the native tribes of north America do and try to gain land and political clout instead of cash money ? This way everyone can take advantage of tax free commerce and help the people in concern. I will remind you that the thought of the general public is like this....

Money= Hell no i had nothing to do with that shit.

Land = That sounds about right and i dont have a problem with giving up land and certain tax clauses, my ancestors were dicks.

There is such respect for the ills fallen on the native people, but not the same attitude towards black folks. I think this is because of the ways things are portrayed to people. Ask for cash, no fuckin way. Ask for land or special treatment, o.k. take it.

I am just wondering if this is a solution for the black community. I am for it, but im a doochbag, and if i was asked to pay more taxes for repatriations i would be pissed. If i was asked to give up federal land and provide a certain industry to be available only on these lands, i am all for it.
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Ted, you're obviously misinformed and misinformed on a number of levels. If the U.S. gov't had any inclination to provide land for African-Americans it would have been done a long time ago when land was explicitly mentioned before the current reparations movement.

Land could have easily been part of the civil rights package. Dr. King certainly had something to say about how land reparations after slavery was an issue and his contemporaries in the Nation of Islam made rather explicit land claims:
quote:
What The Muslims Want

1. We want freedom. We want a full and complete freedom.

2. We want justice. Equal justice under the law. We want justice applied equally to all, regardless of creed or class or color.

3. We want equality of opportunity. We want equal membership in society with the best in civilized society.

4. We want our people in America whose parents or grandparents were descendants from slaves, to be allowed to establish a separate state or territory of their own--either on this continent or elsewhere. We believe that our former slave masters are obligated to provide such land and that the area must be fertile and minerally rich. We believe that our former slave masters are obligated to maintain and supply our needs in this separate territory for the next 20 to 25 years--until we are able to produce and supply our own needs.

[[[[[]]]]]]]



Beyond that, N'COBRA (National Coalition of Blacks for Reparations in America) list land with everything else:

quote:
What forms should Reparations take?

Reparations can be in as many forms as necessary to equitably (fairly) address the many forms of injury caused by chattel slavery and its continuing vestiges. The material forms of reparations include cash payments, land, economic development, and repatriation resources particularly to those who are descendants of enslaved Africans. Other forms of reparations for Black people of African descent include funds for scholarships and community development; creation of multi-media depictions of the history of Black people of African descent and textbooks for educational institutions that tell the story from the African descendants' perspective; development of historical monuments and museums; the return of artifacts and art to appropriate people or institutions; exoneration of political prisoners; and, the elimination of laws and practices that maintain dual systems in the major areas of life including the punishment system, health, education and the financial/economic system. The forms of reparations received should improve the lives of African descendents in the United States for future generations to come; foster economic, social and political parity; and allow for full rights of self-determination.

http://www.ncobra.org/AboutUs.html


Given that information, I'd like for you to explain where you got the idea that cash money was the only form of reparations proponents have argued for.
quote:
Given that information, I'd like for you to explain where you got the idea that cash money was the only form of reparations proponents have argued for.


Hell, if Ted had just used the search function [refined to "reparations Land" in commentary forum] for this site, he would have found that many members here had plenty to say on land. But a broader search would have revealed that amongst the membership [you know, a sub-group of the affected group making the demand, i.e., Black folks] money or any form of cash payment fell far, far down the list and really so did "land." In fact, I would argue that they were only put into the mix because the authors were thinking in terms of how white folks think, i.e., $$$ is king.
quote:
Originally posted by Ted:
I think that the general thinking on repatriations is that somehow money needs to be paid. While this fact is debatable and both sides have great arguments, i think an option is being overlooked.

You ask 100 white dudes if they should pay repatriations in cash form and 98% say hell no.
You ask the same 100 people if the Natives should be given land and i would think 80% would say yes.

I know that the Apache(one tribe) and the Tutsi(one tribe) have different beliefs and values. When you think of it are they really that different ?

Wouldn't it be beneficial for black citizens to act in the same way that the native tribes of north America do and try to gain land and political clout instead of cash money ? This way everyone can take advantage of tax free commerce and help the people in concern. I will remind you that the thought of the general public is like this....

Money= Hell no i had nothing to do with that shit.

Land = That sounds about right and i dont have a problem with giving up land and certain tax clauses, my ancestors were dicks.

There is such respect for the ills fallen on the native people, but not the same attitude towards black folks. I think this is because of the ways things are portrayed to people. Ask for cash, no fuckin way. Ask for land or special treatment, o.k. take it.

I am just wondering if this is a solution for the black community. I am for it, but im a doochbag, and if i was asked to pay more taxes for repatriations i would be pissed. If i was asked to give up federal land and provide a certain industry to be available only on these lands, i am all for it.


yessiree boss ... you so smart, a damn genius... just what the doctor ordered.

I mean, what would black folk do without smart azz white dudes like you

to point out the obvious? Roll Eyes

You really ARE as smart as you look. Smile

Gag & puke
quote:
Actually, 2 1/2 acres (and a mule) was supposed to be given to the slaves


2 1/2 acres?? Hell, Deed Books in Maryland, for example, show how indentured servants received 50 acres as "freedom dues." The amount of land may have varied for colony to colony but it was always more than 2.5 and even the famed 40 acres and a mule (indentured servants supposed received farming tools and a gun) pales in comparison to the 160 acre tracts of land virtually given away to Whites in the 1862 Homestead Act.

http://www.pricegen.com/resources/servants.htm
http://www.archives.gov/educat...ssons/homestead-act/
Well, rest easy Ted. Land or money -it ain't gonna happen....PERIOD!! With all the serious and critical issues facing the working class, the middle class and blacks alike, why this is (reparations) still taken seriously is beyond me. It's like debating the merits and technical feasibility of riding a bicycle to the moon. Pure unadulterated fantasy.......
End slavery? No doubt, there was someone placing their bet on "IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN."

End Segregation? No doubt, there was someone placing their bet on "IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN." Ask that sucka Wallace (or Wallace sucka) who said, "Segregation now. Segregation tomorrow and Segregation forever!!!" how that sh*t turned out.

And, really, if you actually believed what you've said here, more than once, then there would be no reason to say it. Obviously, you're trying to convince yourself.
That fact of the matter here is people like Ted, the professed white dude, are in ABSOLUTE FEAR of having to pay restitution for something that they understand on a subconscious level is completely justified. They also understand on a subconscious level that they stole, murdered, raped & pillaged people and things that are not theirs. They understand that as a collective, that they have completely benefitted from the breaking of the universe's natural law. What they are afraid of ultimately is the consequences of their actions.
So what they'll do is come into boards like this and attempt to rationalize the irrational, hum and haw about their views & how they shouldn't be responsible, blah blah blah, ultimately dictating to African-Americans as to what we should think about issues that we are very clear on based on FACTS. As a matter of fact, Ted is dictating what he thinks that we are entitled to! How AUDACIOUS!! White Privilege attacks on AA.org AGAIN! How dare you?! When does a law breaker ever dictate to the court what their sentence should be? And the killing part is that you don't see anything wrong with what you've stated here Ted or even the fact that you've brought up this thread.
Stop trying to pawn that illogical crap you call thought on this intelligent board. nono
quote:
Originally posted by Yemaya:
That fact of the matter here is people like Ted, the professed white dude, are in ABSOLUTE FEAR of having to pay restitution for something that they understand on a subconscious level is completely justified. They also understand on a subconscious level that they stole, murdered, raped & pillaged people and things that are not theirs. They understand that as a collective, that they have completely benefitted from the breaking of the universe's natural law. What they are afraid of ultimately is the consequences of their actions.
So what they'll do is come into boards like this and attempt to rationalize the irrational, hum and haw about their views & how they shouldn't be responsible, blah blah blah, ultimately dictating to African-Americans as to what we should think about issues that we are very clear on based on FACTS. As a matter of fact, Ted is dictating what he thinks that we are entitled to! How AUDACIOUS!! White Privilege attacks on AA.org AGAIN! How dare you?! When does a law breaker ever dictate to the court what their sentence should be? And the killing part is that you don't see anything wrong with what you've stated here Ted or even the fact that you've brought up this thread.
Stop trying to pawn that illogical crap you call thought on this intelligent board. nono


Please justify to me me, why i owe you shit ?
quote:
Originally posted by Ted:
quote:
Originally posted by Yemaya:
That fact of the matter here is people like Ted, the professed white dude, are in ABSOLUTE FEAR of having to pay restitution for something that they understand on a subconscious level is completely justified. They also understand on a subconscious level that they stole, murdered, raped & pillaged people and things that are not theirs. They understand that as a collective, that they have completely benefitted from the breaking of the universe's natural law. What they are afraid of ultimately is the consequences of their actions.
So what they'll do is come into boards like this and attempt to rationalize the irrational, hum and haw about their views & how they shouldn't be responsible, blah blah blah, ultimately dictating to African-Americans as to what we should think about issues that we are very clear on based on FACTS. As a matter of fact, Ted is dictating what he thinks that we are entitled to! How AUDACIOUS!! White Privilege attacks on AA.org AGAIN! How dare you?! When does a law breaker ever dictate to the court what their sentence should be? And the killing part is that you don't see anything wrong with what you've stated here Ted or even the fact that you've brought up this thread.
Stop trying to pawn that illogical crap you call thought on this intelligent board. nono


Please justify to me me, why i owe you shit ?


please justify to EVERYONE why a black poster would owe shit to you...?

Go watch paint dry, trick.
quote:
End Segregation? No doubt, there was someone placing their bet on "IT AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN." Ask that sucka Wallace (or Wallace sucka) who said, "Segregation now. Segregation tomorrow and Segregation forever!!!" how that sh*t turned out.


I have no idea how you can compare a nefarious concept like reparations to segregation. Segregation (legal) and Jim Crow was going to end. The writing was on the wall that this insidious unconstitutional public policy was going to end at some point. IT CLEARY VIOLATED THE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS OF BLACK AMERICANS. It trampled on the civil rights of a selected group of American citizens. The Supreme Court was very clear about its interpretations and ended the legality of it (segregation). The constitution does not support reparations.

quote:
And, really, if you actually believed what you've said here, more than once, then there would be no reason to say it. Obviously, you're trying to convince yourself.


No reason to say it? Ha! Ha! Ha! That's funny. I have every right to respond to this folly as many times as it is posted. And I don’t have to convince myself of anything. Facts are facts. Never had the need to convince myself of reality my friend. Of all the critical problems and issues facing black America, why would you focus on something that has no rational nor legal precedent outside of a distorted belief of entitlement? You’ll never live to see it and neither will your children or your grandchildren. Sorry to be the courier of bad news bro but it’s true……..
quote:
Originally posted by Xeon:

Segregation (legal) and Jim Crow was going to end. The writing was on the wall that this insidious unconstitutional public policy was going to end at some point.



The only people i've ever seen espouse this delusion are euro-americans...

And elaborate on (in a histrionics-less manner) why you've described reparations as "nefarious" when British Slaveowning subjects were compensated for the loss of slaves when Britain abolished slavery in 1833?

Slaveholders were compensated for their legally imposed loss of value. "The British government raised £20 million to pay out in compensation for the loss of the slaves as business assets to the registered owners". This means the slaveowners and their progeny never took a financial hit, while the slaves were never compensated for their legally imposed labor or inability to accumulate any material possessions. There is a distinct disadvantage. All but the willfully blind can see this.

Not to mention, Japanese-Americans were compensated for the loss of their freedom and livelihoods when they were forced into American internment camps during WWII...

Germany, and other european governments were forced to pay for confiscating valuables from Jewish citizens...

American taxpayers are paying billions for the rebuilding of schools and communities in Iraq despite the fact that I have never bombed a school nor killed an Iraqi...

The precedent is more than established and the right thing to do.
Peace...


quote:
it ain't gonna happen....PERIOD!!


How can any American take such a feeble position?


Why should we believe that it will never happen?

Negroes used to say the same about a black pro quarterback, or fortune 500 CEO, Federal Judge, and POTUS....Why would reparations be so far out of our league?

I think it is rather pathetic to witness underacheivers as they seek to spread their own self loathing onto others...



Whirling Moat

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