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What do you think is the legacy of 9/11 on this day - the second anniversary of the event? What impact has it had on American life? What impact has it had on you? What will the lasting impact of 9/11 be on America and the world?


There is no passion to be found playing small, in settling for a life
that is less than the one you are capable of living. - Mandela

© MBM

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I think the legacy will be th loss of certain freedoms.

It will bring the end of unmanaged immigrants. If it doesn't, if it doesn't then the next time something like 9/11 happens, and it will, it will be the end of the political career of whoever is in charge.

For African Americans, it is likely to be the screen behind which we allow the protection of our right to vote to be taken.

PEACE

Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
The investigation into the Florida elections in 2000, revealed that government/institutional influence had be applied to African American voters. The findings were referred to the Department of Justice (of which John Ashcroft is Secretary). That department has failed/refused to litigate. The violations are under and Section 4 of the Voting Rights Act of 1965. Section 4 and Section 5 have been voted to expire in 2007.

Does that help?

PEACE

Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
I agree with Oshun 100%. There were no lessons learned from 9-11 and sadly america continued on its same arrogant path with even less regard for others. The attitudes of its citizens are to trudge stubbornly ahead on the same path....as the world in general prepares to try and deal with this country in a way that will bring it to its knees......a vicious cycle indeed....
Inequality Before and After 9/11
by Paul Street

I'll always remember the day I tried to engage in that silly exercise called "speaking truth to power." It was early December of 2001. My topic was American policymakers' decision to place nearly a million black people behind bars and to mark more than one in three black males with a felony record. As a member of a Chicago-based council of advisers working to help ex-offenders "reintegrate" into the "free world," I was invited to a pleasant conference room to give my thoughts on these matters to Matt Bettenhausen, Illinois' "Deputy Governor for Criminal Justice and Public Safety." Along with eight other council members, I presented facts and reflections on the vicious circle of racially disparate mass incarceration. Among other things, I noted that there were nearly 20,000 more black males in the Illinois state prison system than the number of black males enrolled in the state's public universities. There were more black males in the state's correctional facilities just on drug charges, I added, than the total number of black males enrolled as undergraduates in Illinois state universities.

Bettenhausen, who hails from a local family of accomplished racecar drivers, arrived in time only for the last talk. He apologized for his lateness, explaining that he had been meeting with the state's Attorney General to discuss the "War On Terrorism." His eyes beamed with pride as he told us how much busier he had become since his appointment as the state's "first-ever Homeland Security Coordinator." With an American flag pin prominently displayed on his lapel, he regaled us with the latest reports on the United States military campaign in Afghanistan. He was clearly relishing his new supposed importance in the battle between planetary good and evil. "Wow," a fellow presenter muttered, "he watches CNN."

After thus communicating the relative insignificance of our issue at this moment of sweeping global consequence, Bettenshausen told us that then Illinois governor George Ryan would not be reversing his recent decision to eliminate higher education and vocational training for prisoners from the state's budget. These cuts, he claimed, were compelled by the "post-September economic downturn" – a dubious dating of an overdue correction in the capitalist business cycle.

Tires squealing, he apologized for racing off to another meeting related to "the war on terror." I was instantly reminded of James Madison's comment that "the fetters imposed on liberty at home have ever been forged out of the weapons provided for defense against real, pretended, or imaginary dangers from abroad." Another phrase also came to mind: plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose (the more things change, the more they stay the same).

"Everything Changed"

According to a great national myth propagated by the in-power right wing War Party and its allies and enablers in the dominant state-corporate media, "everything changed" on September 11, 2001. Before 9/11, this authoritarian narrative runs, Americans lived in peaceful division, pleasantly but naively stuck in their own little prosperous domestic spheres. We were cheerfully but innocently blind to the dangers of a still-precarious world and to the related greatness and vulnerability of our nation. We were too preoccupied with our busy little lives to grasp our creeping moral decline, epitomized by the sexual transgressions and lies of Bill Clinton.

Thanks to 9/11, we have lost our innocence and awakened to our national magnificence and the related threats we face from bad people who hate and envy our freedom and prosperity. United We Stand: we have transcended old divisions in shared allegiance to the "war on terrorism" – a new crusade against a new semi-permanent Evil Other that is the true replacement for Cold War predecessors in Moscow and Beijing. We have been morally, politically, and spiritually toughened, unified, and regenerated by violence: our own and that of our "freedom"-hating enemies.

Racially Disparate Residential Neo-liberalism

How curious, then, to pick up the "Metro" section of a recent (August 6th) issue of my leading local newspaper – The Chicago Tribune. The front page contains a photograph of 15 well-dressed white people relaxing in a plush and very predominantly Caucasian North Side neighborhood (Lincoln Park). They are positioned to permit a photographer to re-create George Seurat's late 19th century painting, titled "Sunday Afternoon on the Island of La Grande Jatte."

It's a perfect image of bourgeois calm and oblivious, self-satisfied, imperial repose. The photograph, the Tribune reports, will be used for a "recruitment poster" by the School of the Art Institute of Chicago, which does not seem terribly interested in attracting student's from the city and metropolitan area's large African-American population.

Things are a bit more stressful in another, blacker part of town. Further down on the same page of the same section, we can read the results of a recent research report on 1,587 African-Americans living in the decrepit Ida B. Wells housing project on the city's South Side. More than half of the households there have incomes less than $5,000. Less than a fourth of the heads of those households are employed. According to the Urban Institute, 1,000 people living at Wells may end up homeless as a result of the city's imminent demolition of the project. There's an endemic shortage, the Institute notes, of affordable housing for the project's residents and indeed for poor people throughout the city. Only a small number of the displaced will qualify to live in the "mixed income" dwellings the city will build where the facility used to sit.

This is terrible, but it's an old story. Since the early- and mid-90s, public authorities have been demolishing public housing projects with only minimal attention to the needs and limited resources of predominantly black public housing residents. The Chicago version is called the "Chicago Housing Authority Transformation Plan," a local monument to the market worshipping, privilege-friendly philosophy of global corporate neo-liberalism. Pushing disadvantaged inner-city residents and the idea of social justice to the remote margins of public concern, that philosophy holds that markets make the best decisions, that social action to improve your situation is self-defeating and silly, and that the best and only way to succeed in life is as a sovereign individual consumer and investor in a "free market society." Its triumph was proclaimed "inevitable" ("there is no alternative") by leading architects of American policy and opinion long before lunatics from a distant US-protected oil sheikdom turned flying gasoline-filled symbols (and agents) of petroleum-addicted corporate globalization into weapons of mass destruction.

As researchers and activists pointed out long before the jetliner attacks "changed everything," the available stock of such housing in Chicago is insufficient to absorb the displaced public housing population. That population is "free" to be homeless, thanks to the working of economic forces that carry social costs of secondary concern to local policymakers. Those policymakers, including the Mayor, are beholden to commercial and real estate property developers seeking to remove poor black inner city residents from choice urban investment locations. Those locations are slated for predominantly white professionals, who want to live and shop in proximity to their offices in downtown Chicago, a leading headquarters for heavily state-subsidized and global corporations like the Boeing Corporation, which equips such marvelous adventures in democratic free-market progress as the terrorist occupation of Palestine (1948 to the present) and the bombings of Baghdad (both pre- and post-9/11) and (pre-9/11) Belgrade.

Correctional Continuities

Another story on the exact same Tribune page also indicates that some situations remain "normal" in the post-September 11 era. It notes that seven inmates, mostly black, were recently beaten with pool cues by guards at the city's giant Cook County Jail. How pre-9/11: this is the third such high-profile incident reported in the last four years at Cook County. The latest revelations come just days after Cook County States' Attorney Richard Devine – notorious in the black community for his habit of putting innocent African-Americans on death row – announced that he would not file charges in connection with the beating of five shackled Cook County inmates in July 2000. Meanwhile, federal investigators are conducting a civil-rights violation investigation into an alleged mass beating involving 40 guards at the same jail in 1999.

Last July, the Chicago public was momentarily shocked – these things pass, as the media moves on – to learn of a terrible accident on Interstate 57, south of Chicago. Several blacks and Hispanics were critically injured and two died when a van rolled over while carrying 18 Chicagoans to visit loved ones warehoused in racially disparate mass penitentiaries located in the southern part of Illinois. Terrible, but not new: on January 26th of 2001, almost 9 months before "everything changed," a Salvation Army van carrying eleven people on Interstate 55 south of Chicago collided with a tractor-trailer, killing all ten of the van's passengers and its driver. Ten of the dead were Black and one was Hispanic. The van was part of a regular service that took people from Chicago's predominantly black West Side to visit relatives and mates doing time in state prison.

After both crashes, nobody in the local media or politics had much to say about the relationship between the victims' race and the nature of the van's destination. There were no connections made between the tragedy and the state's policy decision to dramatically increase the number of prisoners in Illinois – mostly black and from the Chicago area – from 27,000 in 1990 to nearly 47,000 in 2000 (even as crime fell) and its related building of 11 new mass correctional facilities in Illinois during the same period; massive job-programs for de-industrialized downstate whites that are placed at increasingly vast distances from the "offenders'" home communities (See Paul Street, The Vicious Circle: Race, Prison, Jobs and Community in Chicago, Illinois, and the Nation, Chicago: Chicago Urban League, October 2002).

Last Hired, First Fired

Speaking of jobs, an excellent recent front-page article in the Tribune notes that mass lay-offs enacted during the curiously "jobless" Bush "recovery" have hit Chicago's black population especially hard. Blacks "feel frozen out of the work world," as local activist Eddie Read told the Tribune. The feeling among black workers and job applicants, the paper explains, is very different from the late 1990s, when increased labor demand significantly cut black unemployment, even among lesser-skilled inner city workers. It is worth noting, however, that the black unemployment rate (18.2 percent) was more than four times higher than the white unemployment rate (less than 5 percent) even at the peak of the "Clinton boom" – which "lifted more yachts than rowboats" as the Tribune noted last year. Also meriting mention is the fact that Chicago area job growth in the booming 90s was dramatically higher in white communities than in black communities (see The Color of Job Growth, a 2002 report of the Chicago Urban League). Here we are dealing with continuities that go back much further than 9/11. They reach back further than the Great Depression, when blacks were the "last hired and first hired" for neither the first nor the last time in American history.

Ghetto Lives

To more directly sense the rich continuities of racial homeland inequality in Chicago before and after "everything changed," you don't need to read newspapers or studies. You can drive west out of the city's downtown on Madison Avenue, past the stadium that Michael Jordan built (the United Center) and into the heart of desperately impoverished West Side neighborhoods like North Lawndale and West and East Garfield. A large number of teen and younger adult males gather on street corners. Most of them are part of the city's large and very disproportionately black concentration – estimated at 97,000 strong in 2001 by the Center for Labor Market Studies (Northeastern University) – of "disconnected youth," 16- to 24-years olds who are both out of school and out of work. Many of them are clearly enrolled in gang organizations and engaged in the narcotics trade. Many of them have already served or will soon serve as raw material for the aforementioned "downstate" prison industry. Older unemployed males, many unrecorded in the nation's official unemployment statistics (their "discouraged" status means they are no longer actively participating in the labor force), congregate around liquor stores and missions. The endemic stress, disappointment, and danger of inner-city life is etched on their faces.

Equally evident is the relative absence of retail facilities, services, and institutions that are standard in richer, whiter neighborhoods: full-service modern grocery stores, drugstores, bookstores, restaurants, doctors, dentists, lawyers, dry-cleaners, banks, personal investment and family insurance stores, boutiques, coffee shops, and much more. Businesses and homes are visibly dilapidated, with many of the former relying on hand-painted signs to advertise their wares. Local business owners, many of whom are Arab, protect their enterprises from burglary with bars and gated shutters. Pawnshops and barebones storefront churches are widely visible, as are liquor stores and currency exchanges advertising super-exploitive Payday loans. Taxicabs are scarce and those that do serve the neighborhoods are generally low-budget, fly-by-night "jitney" firms.

The small number of whites seen in these neighborhoods and their South Side counterparts are males working in traditional working-class "jobs that pay" – street and sewer repair, construction trades, firemen, and the like – that appear to be unavailable to black males.

Police cars cruise warily, their occupants donning bullet-proof vests deemed necessary in waging the war on drugs in neighborhoods where people with felony records outnumber legitimate jobs.

This is pretty much how these neighborhoods looked and felt before 9/11. Truth be told, they look a lot like they did in the 1960s, even before the riots that are supposed to have taken away their vitality, actually stolen by a process of disinvestment that was already well underway.

Accelerated Continuity

How have things changed since 9/11 in these neighborhoods? Simply put, the core continuities of human suffering and hopelessness have been accelerated. Things have gotten worse at a quickened pace, thanks in large part to the racially disparate joblessness of the current recovery. Also part of the unpleasant equation is 9/11 itself, or more accurately the official, right-led public and media response to the terror attacks. September 11th gave the radical-right Bush junta – falsely labeled conservative – a precious opportunity to divert public attention away from the causes and consequences of urban inequality, to starve, cripple, and pre-empt programs that might alleviate the suffering caused by racism and related socioeconomic inequality, and to conflate dissent with treason. These masters of war at home and abroad have seized on the opportunity with all deliberate speed, consistent with the timeworn conduct of concentrated power, before and since "everything changed." Empire abroad has always been and remains both reflection and agent of inequality and repression at home.

Paul Street (e-Mail: pstreet@cul-chicago.org) is an urban social policy researcher in Chicago, Illinois. His book Empire Abroad, Inequality at Home: Essays on America and the World Since 9/11 (Paradigm Publishers) will be available next year.

http://www.blackcommentator.com/55/55_think_street.html
quote:
Originally posted by ThaWatcher:
@JWC...do you honestly think that we will sit idly by and let this happen?...it sounds absurd to me...


yes, I do. There is nothing to lead anyone to believe we will act to prevent it. We have sat idly by for 21 years lettng the date for the ax to fall come closer and closer. And to reinforce that indifference, we, African Americans as a group, and the Congressional Black Caucus, and all the "leadership" groups have actively put position papers out there calling the entire impending act a lie. The most recent was a letter issued just before the national convention of the NAACP, signed by Kweisi Mfume.

Not only will we "sit idly by", but many have delcared such to be their intent.

And it is indeed, absurd.

But its real.

PEACE

Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
How would the United States have responded had the plane that went down in Pennsylvania actually reached its mark and hit the White House? What if the President or other top officials had been injured or killed - what would we have done differently?

We still didn't know precisely who did it. There was no nation, per se, to attack. How would we have exacted the higher level of revenge/justice that that would have warranted?


There is no passion to be found playing small, in settling for a life
that is less than the one you are capable of living. - Mandela
quote:
Originally posted by MBM:
What do you think is the legacy of 9/11 on this day - the second anniversary of the event? What impact has it had on American life? What impact has it had on you? What will the lasting impact of 9/11 be on America and the world?



The short term effect is a curtailing of civil liberties (increasing over time), ignoring of pressing social issues here at home, a disaster for the economy, simmering anger amoung portions of the population against the government (I'm recalling early polls that said that Americans were willing to lose several hundreds of soldiers, but not a thousand, which we will likely surpass in a couple of years), and an expansion of the American Empire worldwide.

The long term impact is more difficult to determine, but I'm reminded of the overextension of the former Soviet Union in Afganastan.


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...,
¡Ay, Dios!"

   Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja   


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


Cauca, Colombia


quote:
Originally posted by ThaWatcher:
@JWC...do you honestly think that we will sit idly by and let this happen?...it sounds absurd to me...


Watcher,

It already is happenning, much of it quite legally. Look at these numbers:

https://www.africanamerica.org/groupee/forums?a=tpc&s=60260642&f=79160213&m=48070354&r=77770354#77770354


"La vida te da sorpresas...
Sorpresas te da la vida...,
¡Ay, Dios!"

   Rubén Blades---Pedro Navaja   


Plowshares Actions
The Nuclear Resister
School of the Americas Watch


Cauca, Colombia


quote:
Originally posted by MBM:
What do you think is the legacy of 9/11 on this day - the second anniversary of the event? What impact has it had on American life? What impact has it had on you? What will the lasting impact of 9/11 be on America and the world?



MBM, all I can say is that the US government cares as much for the Iraqi people's welfare as he does for Amerikkkans. Ever since 9/11, and especially now, Bush himself is doing such a good job of destroying this countries' global profile, robbing it's citizens of their essential freedoms, and increasing world-wide hatred for the U.S, that I'd assume AL QAEDA isn't in any hurry to make a hasty attack just to be timely. 9/11 is still working in their favor, there's no rush Frown.

AfroMan.
Ricardomath:

I've admired the work it took to get that chart to display like that. I tried but it's not automatic.

That is an accurate representation of the long-used "felon-tactic."

The concern I cited regarding the Voting Rights Act of 1965 is another system in the process of being put in place. The great wonder is that with all the griping concern expressed on this board, no one to my knowledge is even willing to challenge their congress member about.

So when I read the social indignation, and political concern in various posts, I know it is really little more that self-righteous chest-thumping.

And of course the joy of being able to engage in confrontation afforded by the board.

PEACE

Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
quote:
Originally posted by ThaWatcher:
9/11's legacy will be and has been this: Increased security, the erosion of privacy laws, and paranoia...


What happened to your question about "standing idly by?" What happened to your challenge of "absurd?" No answer? Just bluster?

That's a powerful stance.

PEACE

Jim Chester

You are who you say you are. Your children are who you say you are.
I was listening to a segment on NPR where they asked what people were doing in observance of 9/11, "the greatest instance of terrorism on US soil." 3,000 people died.

Then it hit me ... An appropriate observance for Black folk would be to recognize the 10s of thousands of Black folk that suffered the lynchings and killings that makes 9/11 pale in comparison.
The legacy that it SHOULD have for this country is that if you put the wrong people in office and/or give too many of the wrong people too much power in this country, they will surely abuse it, ---- even to the point of 911 in order to fleece America out of billions of dollars in NO-Bid government contracts for themselves and their friends.
At times I actually get disgusted with myself about this.

I communicate with people on various boards about this and encounter people who are actually capable of believing a 200 ton airliner could level a 500,000 ton building in less than 2 hours. I want to fall out laughing at these people but there seems to be so many of them. As far as I am concerned it is an insult to all of the people that died to believe something that ridiculous for this long.

I have built a model for a simulation and am editing the video.

umbra
quote:
Originally posted by Yemaya:
The legacy of 9/11 will be the continuation of non-melanin producing people's aggression against the melanin producing people of the world. The U.S. has taken several brazen steps to re-colonize Africa and the Arabian penisula. Bottom line.



Legacy: White folks have rediscovered their right to run roughshod over the world. tfro
This is great:

Mos Def and Cornel West with Bill Maher

Though I don't go in on the 9-11 conspiracy theory, I relish Mos Def's skepticism.

Whenever folks (whites in particular) ask me what I think about the significance of 9-11, my response is basically that the only difference between life pre:9-11 and life post:9-11 is that before 9-11 it was only me who was afraid in this society. Now they are too. So they need to grow up and get a grip. The world was NEVER safe. That's some Mickey Mouse fantasy ish.

I vividly remember that though I was definitely interested in events, I was not one bit more afraid (or anxious) the day after than I was the day before.

Cornel pretty much speaks for me on this one. Smile
quote:
Though I don't go in on the 9-11 conspiracy theory


Do you go in for 200 ton airliners leveling 500,000 ton buildings in less than 2 hours? Physics is more important than conspiracies.

http://www.public-action.com/911/jmcm/physics_1.html

Then we have experts that play stupid games with math.

http://www.nistreview.org/WTC-REPORT-GREENING.pdf

Page 3:
quote:
Mc = n mf ......................... (1)
where mf is the mass of one WTC floor, assumed to be 1/110 the mass of an entire WTC tower, namely mf = (510,000,000 / 110) kg ≈ 4,636,000 kg


He is dividing the total mass of one WTC tower by 110 and using that to compute the potential energy of the building. The first problem with this is that the building had to be bottom heavy. Is the 105th floor going to weigh the same amount as the 5th floor. Wouldn't the 5th floor have to support a lot more weight and therefore must be much stronger and so require a lot more steel? So his averaging portrays more mass higher up in the building grossly exaggerating the potential energy.

The second problem is the WTCs were actually 117 stories tall. The were 7 sub-basements. Wouldn't their mass be included in the total for the entire building? So he is including the mass of the basements but only dividing by 110 further throwing off his results.

I emailed Greening about this weeks ago. NO RESPONSE! lol

umbra
Last edited {1}
quote:
Originally posted by MBM:
What do you think is the legacy of 9/11 on this day - the second anniversary of the event? What impact has it had on American life? What impact has it had on you? What will the lasting impact of 9/11 be on America and the world?


There is no passion to be found playing small, in settling for a life
that is less than the one you are capable of living. - Mandela


For me, the legacy of 9/11 was a renewed faith. I can't control what our government does, and I can't control the fact that there are people who hate us simply because we are Americans. The lesson that was reinforced for me on 9/11 was that life is short...that something awful can fall out of even the clearest and bluest skies and change us forever. September 11, 2001 made me want to become closer to God. It made me turn to Him for answers and ultimately trust Him explicitly.

Instead of fear, paranoia, cynicism, and conspiracy theories, I pray that for most people the impact of 9/11 will be an increased faith and knowledge that God is in control.
quote:
I can't control what our government does


Yes we can ... vote them out ... impeach them.

quote:
I can't control the fact that there are people who hate us simply because we are Americans


People don't hate us because we are americans, they hate americans because of our government's policy toward them.

quote:
The lesson that was reinforced for me on 9/11 was that life is short...that something awful can fall out of even the clearest and bluest skies and change us forever


tfro
Kweli4Real , see your point but I didn't vote Bush in office. However, I sure hope that this country decides that enough is enough with the Republican Party. I pray that enough people vote for a change and give someone like Barack Obama a chance to do things differently. And I also have to disagree with on another point. None of us to a large degree can really control what our government decides to do and the decisions they make. I mean, Bush has like a 37% approval rating, yet he continues to do what he wants to do with this country and refuses to bring the war to an end. Clearly he doesn't care that 63% of Americans thinks he's doing a poor job as President.
And it doesn't matter why so many foreigners hate us. The reasons are irrelevant. The fact is there are many people that would and probably will kill Americans without batting an eye.
As long as I know that God is in control, I refuse to live my life in fear or anything negative.
I received this e-mail this morning. Although there are some buzz phrases that point to anti-zionist conspiracy theorists, I had heard about the pre-9/11 PUTs.

I'm in the process of researching the validity of the claims below.

quote:
Trusted News Trader
$4.5 billion options bet on catastrophe within four weeks - someone "knows" what's coming...
Posted By: Zany Mystic
Date: Sunday, 26 August 2007, at 1:00 p.m.
Someone knows what's coming -- $4.5 billion options bet on catastrophe within four weeks -- another huge sale of option contracts (ready for civil war -- as soon as the "event" occurs Chertoff will start war on us)
------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
From: Dick Eastman
To: Undisclosed- Recipient: ;
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 3:30 AM
Subject: someone knows what's coming -- $4.5 billion options bet on catastrophe within four weeks -- another huge sale of option contracts (ready for civil war -- as soon as the "event" occurs Chertoff will start war on us)
$4.5 billion options bet on catastrophe within four weeks
And guess what? Just as no one caught the criminal accomplices who short-sold airlines just before 9-11-01, so the financiers have kept their privacy walls despite all "anti-terrorism" legislation. Only those who plan and profit from such terrorism would be in favor of keeping such transactions untraceable. Only the Zionist merchant bankers have the power to prevent that logical anti-terrorism regulatory measure from being taken.
- -
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2007
ANYBODY HAVE A CLUE AS TO WHAT THESE 'INVESTORS' ARE EXPECTING?
http://www.tickerfo rum.org/cgi- ticker/akcs- www?post= 4669
The two sales are being referred to by market traders as "bin Laden trades" because only an event on the scale of 9-11 could make these short-sell options valuable.
There are 65,000 contracts @ $750.00 for the SPX 700 calls for open
interest. That controls 6.5 million shares at $750 = $4.5 Billion. Not a
single trade. But quite a bit of $$ on a contract that is 700 points
away from current value. No one would buy that deep "in the money"
calls. No reason to. So if they were sold looks like someone betting on
massive dislocation. Lots of very strange option activity that I haven't
seen before.
The entity or individual offering these sales can only make money if the
market drops 30%-50% within the next four weeks. If the market does not
drop, the entity or individual involved stands to lose over $1 billion
just for engaging in these contracts!
Clearly, someone knows something big is going to happen BEFORE the options
expire on Sept. 21.
THEORIES:
The following theories are being discussed widely within the stock and
options markets today regarding the enormous and very unusual activity
reported above and two stories below. Those theories are:
1) A massive terrorist attack is going to take place before Sept. 21 to
tank the markets, OR;
2) China, reeling over losing $10 Billion in bad loans to the sub-prime
mortgage collapse presently taking place, is going to dump US currency
and tank all of Capitalism with a Communist financial revolution.
Either scenario is bad and the clock is ticking. The drop-dead date of
these contracts is September 21. Whatever is going to happen MUST take
place between now and then or the folks involved in these contracts will
lose over $1 billion for having engaged in this activity.
------------ -
"$1.78 Billion Bet that Stock Markets will crash by third week in September
Anonymous Stock Trader Sells 10K Contracts on EVERY S&P/Y "Strike"
Shorts Stocks "in the money" effectively selling all his SPY holdings
for cash up front without pressuring the market downward
This is an enormous and dangerous stock option activity. If it goes
right, the guy makes about $2 Billion. If he's wrong, his out of pocket
costs for buying these options will exceed $700 Million!!!
The entity who sold these contracts can only make money if the stock
market totally crashes by the third week in September.
Bear in mind that the last time anyone conducted such large and unusual
stock option trades (like this one) was in the weeks before the attacks
of September 11.
Back then, they bought huge numbers of PUTS on airline stocks in the
same airlines whose planes were involved in the September 11 attacks.
Despite knowing who made these trades, the Securities and Exchange
Commission NEVER revealed who made the unusual trades and no one was
ever publicly identified as being responsible for the trades which made
upwards of $50 million when the attacks happened.
The fact that this latest activity by a single entity gambles on a
complete collapse of the entire market by the third week in September,
seems to indicate someone knows something really huge is in the works
and they intend to profit almost $2 Billion within the next four weeks
from whatever happens! This is really worrisome."
more here: link to www.tickerforum. org
http://www.tickerfo rum.org/cgi- ticker/akcs- www?post= 4669
Okay, I've done enough research to easy my mind. Two sources [that I trust] indicate that there is "not much to worry about". But some are suggesting that this move is in anticipation of something happenning in Iran. No one that I've seen, other than various conspiracy sites, are talking about another 9/11 attack on US soil.

quote:
http://www.thestreet.com/newsanalysis/optionsfutures/10377063.html

However, Dan Perper, a Partner at Peak 6, one of the largest option market makers and proprietary trading firms, has confirmed that the trades are part of a "box-spread trade."

"This was done as a package in which the box spread was used [as a] means of alternative financing at more attractive interest rates" explained Perper.

Simply put, two parties agree to trade the box at a price that essentially splits the difference between current rates.

For example, the rough numbers would be that given the September 700/1700 box must settle at a value of 1,000 -- it is currently trading around 997 -- that translates into a 5% interest rate.

For the seller it is a way to borrow money at a slight discount to the prevailing rate, and for the buyer, it is a way to lend money at a low rate of return, but it's better than nothing at a time when others are scared and have painted themselves into a box (ha ha) because they have run out available funds.
quote:
Originally posted by umbrarchist:
quote:
Though I don't go in on the 9-11 conspiracy theory


Do you go in for 200 ton airliners leveling 500,000 ton buildings in less than 2 hours? Physics is more important than conspiracies.



Well. If the plane had no fuel then the conspiracy theory makes a LOT of sense.

The fuel causes a problem for the conspiracy theory. Yes. I know that some people have suggested that the heat from the resulting fire could not possibly have reached the temperature required to actually melt the steel.

However, it would not be necessary for the steel to melt.

The only thing necessary is for the heat to sufficiently compromise the structural integrity of the frame. It doesn't require it to actually reach the melting point.

I'm no engineer (or physicist) but it seems reasonable to initially only consider the potential energy of the floors above the point where the jet collided.

Once the structural integrity of the frame at that point is sufficiently compromised then the next floor down would have to deal with the resulting force of the entirety of the structure above it collapsing.

It would be like a domino effect. With each successive floor adding to the stress which was brought to bear on the remaining structure beneath. It would be like a shock wave rippling downward gathering strength as it progressed.

I have not rigorously thought through the process. And I have no proof (it would be impossible to have definitive proof anyway). But it seems to me a waste of time to speculate.

Besides, if you find me 5 engineers who dispute this version of things, I can probably find 20 who don't. At least 5. So it's at least a reasonable version of events.

So in the end, whether the government were responsible or not, I don't trust the government anyway (this one especially). It makes no difference to my overall outlook on things either way. So I don't waste brain cells hatching conspiracies.

Plus given the unusual incompetence of this government it would strike me as very odd that this is the only thing they got perfectly right.
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quote:
Originally posted by EbonyRose:
While watching two different shows on the anniversary of 9-11, what happened at the Pentagon was termed to be an "explosion" and not an airplane strike terrorist attack.

When did this determination of the events of what happened there change? Confused


Someone provided a link about the Pentagon strike on another board that had some really hilarious information.

They said that there was no recording of seismic activity when an airliner supposedly struck the Pentagon.

When planes struck the World Trade Center towers at the 80th and 95th floors they were recorded via ground vibration. So how could an airliner have hit the Pentagon at practically ground level without doing the same? It is also curious that with all I have run across about the seismographs on the WTC I hadn't heard about this before. That is one of the cool things about information hiding, it is so easy for people to not think of obvious questions.

umbra
quote:
Yes. I know that some people have suggested that the heat from the resulting fire could not possibly have reached the temperature required to actually melt the steel.

However, it would not be necessary for the steel to melt.

The only thing necessary is for the heat to sufficiently compromise the structural integrity of the frame. It doesn't require it to actually reach the melting point.


So how does one account for the still molten steel in the basement of the towers ... 4 days after the event. The "mainstream" academicians have avoided it; but the conspiracy theorist have discussed it at length.

quote:
Why in the world would they do that??


The War in Iraq, the Patriot Acts 1-4, the Unity Executive ... all of these were unfathomable on 9/10; but are largely acceptable/accepted today.
quote:
Originally posted by Kweli4Real:
quote:
Yes. I know that some people have suggested that the heat from the resulting fire could not possibly have reached the temperature required to actually melt the steel.

However, it would not be necessary for the steel to melt.

The only thing necessary is for the heat to sufficiently compromise the structural integrity of the frame. It doesn't require it to actually reach the melting point.


So how does one account for the still molten steel in the basement of the towers ... 4 days after the event. The "mainstream" academicians have avoided it; but the conspiracy theorist have discussed it at length.



Mainstream academicians according to whom? The conspiracy theorists? * Did you ask any mainstream academicians? *

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert. I'm not. But when I referred to the non-necessity of the steel melting, I was referring only to the structural steel in the vicinity of the initial point of impact.

Who knows what types of secondary events (compatible with popular consensus) could have occurred after that point in time? I can imagine any number of factors that might possibly account for the phenomenon you mention beginning with

quote:

It would be like a domino effect. With each successive floor adding to the stress which was brought to bear on the remaining structure beneath. It would be like a shock wave rippling downward gathering strength as it progressed.


But I'm only speculating.

I just don't think Bush and Co. are that bright. They're ideologues who took advantage of events as they occurred.

My 2 cents.
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